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View Full Version : “FT” clerk Rachelle Ann Beguia apologizes to Singaporeans for her ‘insensitive’ comme



land118
14-08-11, 21:36
http://www.temasekreview.com/2011/08/11/ft-clerk-rachelle-ann-beguia-apologizes-to-singaporeans-for-her-insensitive-comments/

“FT” clerk Rachelle Ann Beguia apologizes to Singaporeans for her ‘insensitive’ comments
“FT” clerk Rachelle Ann Beguia has apologized to Singaporeans for her ‘insensitive’ comments on Facebook:


Ms Beguia sparked a massive outcry among netizens by posting a series of derogatory comments belittling Singaporeans in her zeal to defend PAP Malaysian MP Penny Low who was under heavy criticisms herself for looking down at her handphone when the National Anthem was played during the National Day Parade.

In a short exchange with Singaporeans on Ms Low’s Facebook, Ms Beguia lectured Singaporean NSmen for lacking ‘morals, loyalty and patriotism’ and described Singaporeans who lost their jobs to foreigners as being ‘incompetent’:



An astute TRE reader Lim Meng Yong observed the presence of a “National Heart Center” logo in Ms Rachelle’s original Facebook profile photo and contacted NHC which confirmed that Ms Rachelle is working as a clerk in its Medical Records Office.

Following a flurry of angry responses from netizens and complaints to her employer, Ms Rachelle succumbed to public pressure and issued the apology in the same thread on Ms Low’s Facebook.

While Ms Rachelle’s rant at Singaporeans is uncalled for, it is shocking that she was able to find a job in Singapore as a clerk in a public hospital.

According to some NHC patients, a large number of the staff at the National Heart Center, including the non-nursing staff are foreigners.

We urge NHC to reveal the number of Singapore citizens and foreigners on its payroll to dispel the public perception that it is favoring foreigners over Singaporeans.

In the meantime, NHC has issued a public statement apologizing for Ms Rachelle’s remarks and promised to conduct an investigation into the matter.

land118
14-08-11, 21:38
http://www.temasekreview.com/2011/08/11/letter-to-tan-chuan-jin-on-rachelle-ann-beguias-comments-about-singaporeans/

Letter to Tan Chuan-Jin on Rachelle Ann Beguia’s comments about Singaporeans
August 11th, 2011 | Author: Your Correspondent
From: “Kai Hin Lim”
To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected], [email protected]
Mr Tan Chuan Jin
Minister of State
Ministry of Manpower

Dear Mr Tan,

Subject: A Citizen’s Outcry On the Increasing Numbers of Foreigner’s Derogatory Remarks

I believe the ‘foreign talents’ have gotten the impression that the government needs them badly for all the wrong reasons, now they are beginning to act as if they are the saviour of our country.

First the PRC who had openly cracked jokes at our languages, now on the internet we see a Philippina, Rachelle Ann Beguia, who went on internet to pass derogatory comments belittling us especially the NSmen for lacking morals, loyalty and patriotism.

Even though both of them apologized later but I think they see us as a small nation, our government can’t survive without them so after an apology everything would be forgotten. We are the kind of people so timid that even our leaders are turning a deaf ear for fear of antagonizing their countries.

How do you feel as General of our NSmen. Would you swallow her comments quietly like a dog, or would you stand up and lead your soldiers to fight back?

Netizens found out she is working in National Heart Centre as a clerk, and majority of the nursing and clerical jobs are held by Philippina at the Centre. Do you mean our local do not like the jobs? She said locals lost the jobs to them because we, your own countrymen, are incompetence. Do you agree?

We now want to know the ratios of locals as against foreigners in all the government hospitals, and also want disciplinary action to be taken against Rachelle to the extent of expulsion because her comments was a grave humiliation to a nation as a whole, akin to the burning of our national flag.

Your prompt reply is very much appreciated.

.
Yours sincerely,

Lim Kai Hin
11 August 2011

.

* Letter was posted on: “FT” clerk Rachelle Ann Beguia apologizes to Singaporeans for her ‘insensitive’ comments (http://www.temasekreview.com/2011/08/11/ft-clerk-rachelle-ann-beguia-apologizes-to-singaporeans-for-her-insensitive-comments/)

marktkt22
15-08-11, 01:37
We r probably the most spineless nation around.
One of these day, these ft will use our flag as rags.
Where is our pride ??? We pay them to insult us.

marktkt22
15-08-11, 01:50
We got the military hardware and the economic strength
But a pity, we dun have the balls to use it...
We got foreign affairs, diplomat but no use..:.
Indeed a nation of softie ...

land118
15-08-11, 06:34
We got the military hardware and the economic strength
But a pity, we dun have the balls to use it...
We got foreign affairs, diplomat but no use..:.
Indeed a nation of softie ...
General feel is that to its own citizens, we kena shown the Big Stick, but come to FT, Government become soft. Imagine if a local made the same comment, sure kena marked, mayb ISD come knocking and throw u into jail w/o trail...:doh:

jsh
15-08-11, 08:06
I just feel that we have used the wrong terminology to describe these foreign workers. People & the govt should stop calling them 'foreign talent'.It gives them a sense of superiority over us. They seem to think that there are no local talent & that we are dependent on their so called "talent". How can a clerk in the NHC thinks of herself as a talent. She's just a foreign worker.

Also nowhere in the world are these foreign workers referred to as foreign talent. They are called foreign workers, migrant workers , temporary workers etc but never foreign talent. So I would urge fellow singaporeans & the govt to stop calling them foreign talent.

land118
15-08-11, 09:39
. ..nowhere in the world are these foreign workers referred to as foreign talent. They are called foreign workers, migrant workers , temporary workers etc but never foreign talent. So I would urge fellow singaporeans & the govt to stop calling them foreign talent. We should called them "foreign workers, migrant workers". Never heard employers calling our local "Local Talents". Gov is so generous to welcome foreigners while they has really ignore the local talents who are core in nation building.:doh:

august
15-08-11, 10:07
I just feel that we have used the wrong terminology to describe these foreign workers. People & the govt should stop calling them 'foreign talent'.It gives them a sense of superiority over us. They seem to think that there are no local talent & that we are dependent on their so called "talent". How can a clerk in the NHC thinks of herself as a talent. She's just a foreign worker.

Also nowhere in the world are these foreign workers referred to as foreign talent. They are called foreign workers, migrant workers , temporary workers etc but never foreign talent. So I would urge fellow singaporeans & the govt to stop calling them foreign talent.

the term 'foreign talent' was devised by the pap govt to sell the lopsided immigration and manpower policy to the electorate.

Snail
15-08-11, 10:24
Question is why locals are not doing these jobs in the first place. Solve that THEN solve the problems relating to FW/FT.




She said locals lost the jobs to them because we, your own countrymen, are
incompetence. Do you agree?


The word is 'incompetent' ...... not 'incompetence' :banghead: If you're going to call people incompetent best not to show yourself as likewise.

ysyap
15-08-11, 11:33
I could almost hear the reply. 'Its not that locals are not doing the job or their jobs have been taken over by foreigners. Rather, it is because there are insufficient number of locals answering the call of the nation to take up these jobs!' :doh:

I heard this 10 years ago so maybe its still unchanged over these many years?

proud owner
15-08-11, 12:26
We should called them "foreign workers, migrant workers". Never heard employers calling our local "Local Talents". Gov is so generous to welcome foreigners while they has really ignore the local talents who are core in nation building.:doh:

in USA ... FTs are called " Aliens'

august
15-08-11, 12:35
A better term is Economic Refugees.

Regulators
15-08-11, 13:35
Rachelle is only a clerk, what kind of special talent does she have? I think she was probably hired coz she was willing to accept a lower pay, perhaps that is where her talent is. :doh:

Rysk
15-08-11, 14:13
Aiyo.. most of my colleagues who are Philipino (even deg holders) told me.. they will be jobless if they stay in their own country in Philippines!

So ask those yaya papaya go back to Philippines loh.. why need to come S'pore leh :tsk-tsk:

Regulators
15-08-11, 14:21
Those filipinas working in the pubs on the ground flr of paramount shopping centre on two week social visit pass and was told that they provide prostitution services. I think our govt is too relaxed with this group of people. Many of them may work normal low end jobs in the day but doing seedy businesses at night, is this what our govt classify as foreign talent?

land118
15-08-11, 14:29
Those filipinas working in the pubs on the ground flr of paramount shopping centre on two week social visit pass and was told that they provide prostitution services. I think our govt is too relaxed with this group of people. Many of them may work normal low end jobs in the day but doing seedy businesses at night, is this what our govt classify as foreign talent?This is quite common, many of those on short social visit to S'pore are doing that..., PRC, Thai, ....

Rysk
15-08-11, 15:23
This is quite common, many of those on short social visit to S'pore are doing that..., PRC, Thai, ....

But heard Filipino "kang hu" better mah.. :D

amk
15-08-11, 18:46
Guys u all have not really followed up this case have you ? It's now revealed it's her husband, a SINGAPOREAN, who posted all those remarks. :cool:

kingkong1984
15-08-11, 18:50
hahahaa... best excuse ever...

my 2 year old son posted them lah.

ysyap
15-08-11, 20:12
Guys u all have not really followed up this case have you ? It's now revealed it's her husband, a SINGAPOREAN, who posted all those remarks. :cool:Ai yah... so she not FT or FW just a FB (foreign bride) so can stay in our shores and enjoy all the benefits through her spouse! :doh:

howgozit
16-08-11, 10:54
http://www.asiaone.com/News/AsiaOne%2BNews/Singapore/Story/A1Story20110815-294657.html

AsiaOne & my paper
Monday, Aug 15, 2011
The Ministry of Education (MOE) posted a comment on its Facebook page yesterday afternoon, acknowledging that it is aware of Mr Gay Chao Hui's Facebook comments insulting Singaporeans.
The Ministry said that it "takes a serious view of the matter" and will look into it.
In a recent development on Saturday, Mr Gay, who is a teacher at Tampines Junior College, owned up to using his Filippino wife's Facebook account to post comments insulting Singaporeans on Member of Parliament Penny Low's Facebook page.
The Facebook posts made were in Ms Low's defence when she was caught using her iPhone during the national anthem at this year's National Day Parade. It described Singaporeans as "moronic" whose "loyalty" and "patriotism" will be dropped "at the first sign of trouble" and said Singaporean NSmen will "declare they are ready to pack up and run" when asked to fight a war.
Mr Gay had apparently made those postings without his wife's knowledge.
While he had apologised for this actions on his wife's Facebook account, netizens are skeptical about the apology, saying that he might even be taking the fall for his wife.
Netizens were concerned at the fact that Mr Gay is an educator, reported citizen journalism website Stomp.
A Facebook user named Wak Enal Zainal said that Mr Gay's posting was a "disgrace" regardless of whether he was a foreigner or local, while another Facebook user named Douglas Ho wondered if he understood the "gravity of the situation".
His wife, Rachelle Ann Beguia, who works at the National Heart Centre (NHC) as a clerk, has been dealt with accordingly.
The National Heart Centre posted on their Facebook page:
"Our investigations into Ms Rachelle Ann Beguai's case have concluded.
"Although Ms Beguai had explained that she did not post those comments, she is accountable to NHCS.
"Appropriate disciplinary action has been taken against her."
Couple probed over comments on MP's FB page
EMPLOYERS of the husband-and-wife pair responsible for incendiary remarks made on MP Penny Low's Facebook page have launched investigations into the comments made.
The Ministry of Education (MOE) and National Heart Centre Singapore (NHCS) have released statements saying that they are looking into the case involving Tampines Junior College teacher Gay Chao Hui and his wife, nurse Rachelle Ann Beguia, respectively.
The derogatory comments were posted on Ms Low's Facebook page to rebut criticisms made against the MP of Pasir Ris-Punggol GRC, after she was spotted looking at her mobile phone while the National Anthem was being sung at last week's National Day Parade.
In a post, the MP apologised and explained that she was too "caught up in the wonderful NDP 2011 celebrations" and had "wanted to capture that moment of pride".
However, Ms Beguia's comments, posted last Wednesday, riled netizens because of her disparaging jab at Singaporeans, whom she described as "moronic" and whose "loyalty and patriotism" would be dropped "at the first sign of trouble".
Her comments were subsequently deleted from Ms Low's Facebook page. By then, it had already garnered more than 600 responses, most of which condemned her comments.
A twist came a few days later when Mr Gay claimed responsibility for the comments, and apologised to people who were "hurt" by his postings, as well as to NHCS.
The 34-year-old civics tutor said he had used his wife's Facebook account without her knowledge to post the comments that had "inflamed many Singaporeans".
However, most netizens are unconvinced. One of them, Haziq Evan Rose, feels that Mr Gay is merely taking the rap for his Filipino wife, adding: "Your writing style is...clearly different from Rachelle's."
An MOE spokesman said that the ministry takes a "serious view of Gay's reported actions and statements on the Internet" and will take "appropriate disciplinary action".
NHCS also reacted to the controversy on its Facebook page, saying that it regrets the "insensitive comments" made by Ms Beguia, and that the organisation does not condone such behaviour.
Investigations have been concluded and appropriate disciplinary actions have been taken against her, said a spokesman on the NHCS Facebook page.
When contacted, Ms Low said that she does not wish to make further comments aside from her apology on Facebook.

DaytonaSS
16-08-11, 11:09
Seriouly i doubt we should have someone like the husband as an educator. I suggest the guy be reassigned to some do administrative work.

land118
16-08-11, 12:15
Seriouly i doubt we should have someone like the husband as an educator. I suggest the guy be reassigned to some do administrative work. This is bad, Government need to show some "Balls", both eating from taxpayers' money and biting the hand that feed them, criticise so jialat. Gov shld revoke their immigration status and send them home...I assume the husband is also a foreigner...:doh:

howgozit
16-08-11, 12:25
This is bad, Government need to show some "Balls", both eating from taxpayers' money and biting the hand that feed them, criticise so jialat. Gov shld revoke their immigration status and send them home...I assume the husband is also a foreigner...:doh:

I think husband is Singaporean

land118
16-08-11, 12:26
Got some details on Mr Gay Chao Hui from this link, not sure if he is Singapore citizen, but facts below seem like he may be Singaporean or Singapore PR...

http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/showthread.php?t=3359990

All about our dear Gay Chao Hui~
Time when saga(Gay Chao Hui) starts : 13 August 2011, about 7pm

Full name : Gay Chao Hui, Joachime

DOB : 14 Febuary 1977

Age : 34

Ethnicity : Chinese

Maritial Status : Married

Location : Singapore, Punggol - Used to stay in Bedok North

Contact : 9658 1443; [email protected] ([email protected])

Hobby : Tennis, Music

Job : Civics Tutor in Tampines Junior College

Wife : Rachelle Ann Beguia

One Child, about 3 years old now
Studied in,

Yu Neng Primary School
Bedok View Secondary School
Nanyang Junior College
National University of Singapore

Regulators
16-08-11, 16:46
Gay Chao Hai or Gay Chao Hui :D

ysyap
16-08-11, 16:47
Seriouly i doubt we should have someone like the husband as an educator. I suggest the guy be reassigned to some do administrative work.Well to use your spouse's online account to post negative and criticisms without informing the wife is also questionable! :doh: What was he thinking then? :tsk-tsk:

westman
16-08-11, 18:02
*
...
...
His wife, Rachelle Ann Beguia, who works at the National Heart Centre (NHC) as a clerk, has been dealt with accordingly.
....
....
The Ministry of Education (MOE) and National Heart Centre Singapore (NHCS) have released statements saying that they are looking into the case involving Tampines Junior College teacher Gay Chao Hui and his wife, nurse Rachelle Ann Beguia, respectively.
....
....


Very confusing leh.

Read from MSM, Rachelle was reported as Nurse (professional) but according to many info, Rachelle was reportedly working as clerk.*
Is Clerk's work*very challenging and so much so that we need foreign talent to take on?
*
Should MSM “stand corrects” on this?:rolleyes:
*

howgozit
16-08-11, 18:34
I know most will disagree, but actually I feel quite sorry this family.

Their livelihood now is hanging on a thread over some silly comments made on the internet. The penalty is too heavy for the "crime". I feel Singapore must have some tolerance for freedom of expression.

Just my humble opinion.

marktkt22
16-08-11, 18:57
Sack both, revoke citizenship, take back Hdb.
If we had balls to be stern to our singapore pilot union,
Dun breed a nations of softie

howgozit
16-08-11, 19:27
Sack both, revoke citizenship, take back Hdb.
If we had balls to be stern to our singapore pilot union,
Dun breed a nations of softie

Wah.... so serious ah.

Uhh... what has it got to do with the pilot union ah?

land118
16-08-11, 20:16
I know most will disagree, but actually I feel quite sorry this family.

Their livelihood now is hanging on a thread over some silly comments made on the internet. The penalty is too heavy for the "crime". I feel Singapore must have some tolerance for freedom of expression.

Just my humble opinion.
If the Gov is like u, what if all NSMen decide not to turn up for reservist...?:doh:

evergreen
16-08-11, 20:50
the term 'foreign talent' was devised by the pap govt to sell the lopsided immigration and manpower policy to the electorate.
The government has never used the term "foreign talent" and "foreign workers" interchangeably. The former refers to foreigners who earn more than 8k a month. It is only in coffeeshop talk that people sarcastically refer to foreign workers as foreign talent. Unfortunately, many people make the mistake of assuming that it was the government that said it. :doh:

land118
16-08-11, 21:09
The government has never used the term "foreign talent" and "foreign workers" interchangeably. The former refers to foreigners who earn more than 8k a month. It is only in coffeeshop talk that people sarcastically refer to foreign workers as foreign talent. Unfortunately, many people make the mistake of assuming that it was the government that said it. :doh:
Can argue until the cows come home but see this below from LKY ( reporter misquoted. ? )

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1142473/1/.html
S'pore cannot do without foreign talent: Ex-MM Lee
By S Ramesh | Posted: 22 July 2011 2108 hrs

Former Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew (R) at the South Asian Diaspora convention in Singapore.
*
SINGAPORE: Former Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew said Singapore would not be able to punch above its own weight if it were to depend on talent from its own population.

He was speaking at a dialogue to wrap up the two-day South Asian Diaspora convention in Singapore on Friday.

DBS Bank's CEO Piyush Gupta posted a question to Mr Lee, asking just how big the issue of attracting foreign talent in Singapore is, having noted that it was a hot topic during the recent General Election.

Mr Lee felt it was an issue among Singaporeans even before the election.

Mr Lee said: "For some time, the Singaporean has felt the competition from talented foreigners. But these are people who have come here to become our citizens and I am a firm believer that the more talent that you have in a society, the better the society will grow.

"If Singapore depends on the talent it can produce out of three million people, it's not going to punch above its weight.

"It's because we have been drawing talent from across the globe - South Asia, Northeast Asia, China, India and beyond that - you have a vibrant economy which is way beyond what three million Singaporeans with the talent they can produce can do.

"So you've got to accept the discomfort, which the local citizens fear that they are competing unequally for jobs. (It) cannot be helped.

"But without them, the jobs will not be there to begin with. So welcome talent and we'll continue to welcome talent."

When asked how the political problem associated with the foreign talent issue could be managed, Mr Lee said: "You just have to assuage it.

"What is the choice - slow growth with no input of talent or faster growth with input of talent and the feeling that some of the top jobs are going to the foreigners? You may get no jobs at all if there were no growth."

Several participants at the convention also took the opportunity to tap Mr Lee's views on the importance of governance and meritocracy for the success of a country. One common question raised during the dialogue was how Mr Lee would have governed India, if the country was handed to him.

Mr Lee replied: "First, what sort of Indian would I be? A northern Indian? A southern Indian? That identifies you with the interest of a particular group.

"Or a Bombay Indian, which is the most cosmopolitan of all. But it may well be that a Bombay Indian doesn't represent Indians at all, so it's a problem India has to face.

"It is important whoever leads India should find acceptance with the widest group of Indians possible. But I think it is very difficult for any Indian leader to find more than 40 per cent of Indians believing he represents them."

Mr Lee also noted that Indians speak nearly 300 different languages, but in China, 90 per cent of the people speak the same language and that makes it a much easier country to lead than India.

- CNA/ck

howgozit
16-08-11, 21:16
If the Gov is like u, what if all NSMen decide not to turn up for reservist...?:doh:

His comments regarding NS were " just ask any of them if they want to be excused from serving NS and they will be the first to raise their hands..... require any of them to serve an extra month of NS and they will riot..."

If Singapore were to revoke the citizenship of any NSmen that has ever had such thoughts, I think our country will consist of mainly very old people, women and young children. Btw, I don't think at any point in time he was telling people not to do NS.

No doubt, the rest of what he said was very insensitive. His postings on other forums are also very anti-Singaporean. He has fulfilled his own prophecy of calling Singaporeans "moronic" because he being a Singaporean behaved in a very moronic manner which he accused others of.

Lastly, I am not trying to defend this guy. I am trying to defend the freedom of speech. I just think at this day and age we should be progressing towards more openness and tolerance.

If MOE and NHC were to bow to public opinion and sack these two for such an indiscretion, I think it will be a sad day for Singapore.

Anyway, this is just my humble opinion. Apologies if any offence caused.

land118
16-08-11, 21:16
The government has never used the term "foreign talent" and "foreign workers" interchangeably. The former refers to foreigners who earn more than 8k a month. It is only in coffeeshop talk that people sarcastically refer to foreign workers as foreign talent. Unfortunately, many people make the mistake of assuming that it was the government that said it. :doh:


http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1077857/1/.html


Singapore gains from inflow of foreigners: PM Lee
By May Wong | Posted: 29 August 2010

Special Report

• National Day Rally 2010
SINGAPORE: Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong has said welcoming foreign talent and new immigrants benefits Singaporeans.

But the government understands Singaporeans' concerns over the negative impact of immigration and will introduce even more policies to ensure that citizens always come first.

Prime Minister Lee said this in his National Day Rally speech at the University Cultural Centre on Sunday evening.

He said that in order to achieve higher growth to benefit Singaporeans, the country must accept a controlled flow of foreign talent here. With the economy booming, Mr Lee said Singapore could be attracting about 80,000 more foreigners this year.

Keeping Singapore's doors open, he said, will reap benefits like having a bigger talent pool to help grow the economy and make up for the population shortfall.

Mr Lee said: "We have moved fast over the last five years. But now I think we should consolidate, slow down the pace. We can't continue like this, increasing our population (by) 100,000... 150,000 a year indefinitely.

"And we should give Singaporeans time to adjust and our society time to settle, integrate better - the new arrivals.

"But we must not close ourselves up. We must continue to be open today so that we bring in the right people, manage the difficulties whatever they may be so that a generation from now, Singapore will still be thriving and prospering."

Mr Lee explained in detail how the government will address the concerns of having more foreigners here. He assured Singaporeans that their jobs will be protected, by restricting foreign workers through increased levies.

Aside from protecting jobs, Prime Minister Lee emphasised the government's commitment to ensure that public housing will be within the reach of Singaporeans.

He said the Housing and Development Board (HDB) will build an additional 22,000 new flats next year - 6,000 more than this year.

For households earning between S$8,000 and S$10,000 monthly, he said the government will now allow them to participate in HDB's Design, Build and Sell Scheme (DBSS).

Mr Lee said the move will widen the choice beyond executive condos, to allow them to buy HDB DBSS flats with a S$30,000 grant, but no HDB loan.

He added that the government will also do more to cool the private property market.

"Our purpose is to make sure that in the long term, Singaporeans can own their home and afford it, and it'll be a gradually appreciating asset which will grow as Singapore grows so that Singaporeans can benefit," he said.

Mr Lee also announced that S$400 million will be pumped into the Workfare Income Supplement for 400,000 low-wage Singaporeans this year.

National Servicemen will also not be forgotten, as Mr Lee acknowledged their contribution through a new initiative.

The National Service Recognition Award (NSRA), giving each NSman S$9,000, will be paid in tranches at major milestones of an NSman's service to help with the cost of their education and to buy a house.

Ultimately, to manage Singapore's immigration, talent and population policies, the government will set up a high-level Population and Talent Division.

Deputy Prime Minister Wong Kan Seng will oversee this division and ensure that all Singaporeans will benefit from the country's open door policy. But Mr Lee acknowledged that immigration is a continuing issue. He said the country as a whole must manage, monitor and adjust along the way.

- CNA/ir

evergreen
16-08-11, 21:17
Can you highlight where he referred to low wage workers as foreign talent?

land118
16-08-11, 21:24
His comments regarding NS were " just ask any of them if they want to be excused from serving NS and they will be the first to raise their hands..... require any of them to serve an extra month of NS and they will riot..."

If Singapore were to revoke the citizenship of any NSmen that has ever had such thoughts, I think our country will consist of only very old people, women and young children. Btw, I don't think at any point in time he was telling people not to do NS.

No doubt, the rest of what he said was very insensitive. His postings on other forums are also very anti-Singaporean. He has fulfilled his own prophecy of calling Singaporeans "moronic" because he being a Singaporean behaved in a very moronic manner which he accused others of.

Lastly, I am not trying to defend this guy. I am trying to defend the freedom of speech. I just think at this day and age we should be progressing towards more openness and tolerance.

If MOE and NHC were to bow to public opinion and sack these two for such an indiscretion, I think it will be a sad day for Singapore.

Anyway, this is just my humble opinion. Apologies if any offence caused. u are entitled to your opinion, but many are watching what Gov going to do on this case, and I am sure that many NSmen past and present are even more watchful of outcome...., many will feel cheated if Gov do nothing, why should NSmen sacrifice full-time NS and another 10 years of annual call ups, and why do All citizens even bother to sing "Stand UP for Singapore " if Gov do not stand up for all of us..., very hard to swallow when remarks like this is written in black and white to an MP....

Simply "Bo nao", coming from a so call Civil Servant, educating our brighter students, and some of his male students are about enter NS....

Will watch and see ....how this saga unfolds....

evergreen
16-08-11, 21:33
u are entitled to your opinion, but many are watching what Gov going to do on this case, and I am sure that many NSmen past and present are even more watchful of outcome...., many will feel cheated if Gov do nothing, why should NSmen sacrifice full-time NS and another 10 years of annual call ups, and why do All citizens even bother to sing "Stand UP for Singapore " if Gov do not stand up for all of us..., very hard to swallow when remarks like this is written in black and white to an MP....

Simply "Bo nao", coming from a so call Civil Servant, educating our brighter students, and some of his male students are about enter NS....

Will watch and see ....how this saga unfolds....
Only if the accusations are true or possibly true will people feel offended. If you know what they say is nonsense, you won't even bother, would you?
E.g. If you tell the whole world that Bill Gates is a pauper, he won't even bother with you.

howgozit
16-08-11, 21:39
u are entitled to your opinion, but many are watching what Gov going to do on this case, and I am sure that many NSmen past and present are even more watchful of outcome...., many will feel cheated if Gov do nothing, why should NSmen sacrifice full-time NS and another 10 years of annual call ups, and why do All citizens even bother to sing "Stand UP for Singapore " if Gov do not stand up for all of us..., very hard to swallow when remarks like this is written in black and white to an MP....

Simply "Bo nao", coming from a so call Civil Servant, educating our brighter students, and some of his male students are about enter NS....

Will watch and see ....how this saga unfolds....

OK, I agree with you accountability is required. As to what extent I guess everyone has his own yardstick.

marktkt22
16-08-11, 22:24
I dun c how China part time student cum prostitute and Filipino in ktv can help singapore ....
We issuing pr to all walk of people....indeed world class immigration policy.
Btw, if i am not wrong, the spur programme ,funded by reserve help sporean and PR, MAYBE INCLUDING MS RACHAEL. OUR RESERVE...

land118
16-08-11, 23:07
Deleted.., wrong post

streak69
17-08-11, 01:15
His comments regarding NS were " just ask any of them if they want to be excused from serving NS and they will be the first to raise their hands..... require any of them to serve an extra month of NS and they will riot..."

If Singapore were to revoke the citizenship of any NSmen that has ever had such thoughts, I think our country will consist of mainly very old people, women and young children. Btw, I don't think at any point in time he was telling people not to do NS.

No doubt, the rest of what he said was very insensitive. His postings on other forums are also very anti-Singaporean. He has fulfilled his own prophecy of calling Singaporeans "moronic" because he being a Singaporean behaved in a very moronic manner which he accused others of.

Lastly, I am not trying to defend this guy. I am trying to defend the freedom of speech. I just think at this day and age we should be progressing towards more openness and tolerance.

If MOE and NHC were to bow to public opinion and sack these two for such an indiscretion, I think it will be a sad day for Singapore.

Anyway, this is just my humble opinion. Apologies if any offence caused.

Agreed on freedom of speech. I think he's being very ungrateful, but for us to be the first world country we profess to be, perhaps we should be more open minded.

"Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,"

http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/

Peace.

howgozit
17-08-11, 11:44
Agreed on freedom of speech. I think he's being very ungrateful, but for us to be the first world country we profess to be, perhaps we should be more open minded.

"Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,"

http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/

Peace.

His biggest mistake was to post his remarks on Penny Low's FB in her defence using his wife's account.

If a similar remark was instead put on Temasek Review or TOC to attack the government's NS policy, it is water off a duck's back. Forummers there are getting away with far far worse remarks than this. There are posts that incite riot, bigotry and even violence.

It is becoming increasingly difficult to voice your opinion if your opinion is not anti-government. The very vocal minority overwhelms and drowns out the passive majority.

Peace.

august
17-08-11, 12:00
His biggest mistake was to post his remarks on Penny Low's FB in her defence using his wife's account.

If a similar remark was instead put on Temasek Review or TOC to attack the government's NS policy, it is water off a duck's back. Forummers there are getting away with far far worse remarks than this. There are posts that incite riot, bigotry and even violence.

It is becoming increasingly difficult to voice your opinion if your opinion is not anti-government. The very vocal minority overwhelms and drowns out the passive majority.

Peace.



nothing wrong, since the mainstream media is overwhelmingly sycophantic and pro-pap.