Caribbean At Keppel Bay (D4, 99-year Leasehold, by Keppel Land)

The developer units are largely the rear most, undesirable stacks, which remained unsold after years of marketing it from 2000-2004. These units later then got converted to serviced apartments.

These units are now all facing Reflections and construction is expected to go on for another 2 years. There used to be a nice golf course view but now its all reflections construction non-stop.

I am not sure if it is indeed a good idea to buy from developer - at least those wioth direct/partial construction facing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by focus

Is Carribean coming to 10yrs old?
So is it worth buying at $1300psf ?
coz if you intend to sell it 5 yrs later.. would it be staying at $1300 or lower? Even if it's enbloc.. since it's keppel's land.. would it mean that the only developer able to enbloc it is keppel since keppel can refuse other developers any extension of the land tenure.

---

Does anyone knows what are the sellers and developers calling now?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DW

The developer units are largely the rear most, undesirable stacks, which remained unsold after years of marketing it from 2000-2004. These units later then got converted to serviced apartments.

These units are now all facing Reflections and construction is expected to go on for another 2 years. There used to be a nice golf course view but now its all reflections construction non-stop.

I am not sure if it is indeed a good idea to buy from developer - at least those wioth direct/partial construction facing.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DW

Does anyone knows what are the sellers and developers calling now?

---

Developer is marketing mainly 2 and 3 rooms on block 42 and 44. Many 3 rooms available at $1310 to $1380 depending on floor and facing. 2 rooms is about $1350 average. But 2 rooms are limited only about 4 to 5 units only. One low floor facing small water channel is about
$1400 psf

Resale asking prices are now $1450 for 2br...amazing rise of about 50% from the start of the year.

If this keeps up, its going to spill over to Reflections. As someone else aptly put it, that development could be like a cup of well microwaved water - all appears calm on the surface, but its actually ready to bubble over....

Sigh... such a conflict ...deep in my heart i feel singapore properties are clearly in a bubble.. but the market action have proven me otherwise as it seems more nad more buyers are only beginning to dip into the market.

Even some property bosses are dumbfounded by what is causing all these buying spree...

Now..the only thing that is undervalued relatively is the landed properties.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by focus

Sigh... such a conflict ...deep in my heart i feel singapore properties are clearly in a bubble.. but the market action have proven me otherwise as it seems more nad more buyers are only beginning to dip into the market.

Even some property bosses are dumbfounded by what is causing all these buying spree...

Now..the only thing that is undervalued relatively is the landed properties.

---

Is it due to the fact that you are putting yourself against the market everyday. Is every Channel 5/8 news on bullish property news affecting you? If every positive news posted by Mr Funny troubling you and making you less happy? If you are, maybe you need to pull yourself away from the market/infomation a bit and enjoy your daily life.

I feel that its a bubble too, and the magnitude has went beyond my expectation, but when all views (low interest rate to stay low for a long time, economy surely will recover, supply of home is in short supply etc etc) are so perfectly align to one direction (i.e. mkt will head further up), its not hard to imagine what will happen when it all unwind.

Bro, have patience and enjoy life.......have a great week ahead.

thanks blackswan.. Nice name by the way..make famous by the subprime crisis.. :)

Anyway..I am kept busy with the stock market.. but have a million in cash sitting in the bank.. need to find a home for it soon 'coz I am more or less fully invested in stock market..

Conflicting right.. :) I must pray that stock market go up up up.. but then it means properties will go up too and here I am saying properties are in a bubble..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by focus

thanks blackswan.. Nice name by the way..make famous by the subprime crisis.. :)

Anyway..I am kept busy with the stock market.. but have a million in cash sitting in the bank.. need to find a home for it soon 'coz I am more or less fully invested in stock market..

Conflicting right.. :) I must pray that stock market go up up up.. but then it means properties will go up too and here I am saying properties are in a bubble..

---

Its a good problem right?
You are hedge!!! Up you happy, down you happy too!!!
What better way to live???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 8kenshin

Resale asking prices are now $1450 for 2br...amazing rise of about 50% from the start of the year.

If this keeps up, its going to spill over to Reflections. As someone else aptly put it, that development could be like a cup of well microwaved water - all appears calm on the surface, but its actually ready to bubble over....

---

Afraid it has already spilled over to Reflections. Reflections starting px psf is $1950.

Somewhat developer is the winner in these 2 projects at Keppel Bay.
The higher Caribbean px goes, the higher Reflections can achieve.
The higher Reflections px goes, the cheaper Caribbean appears to be. And the cycle repeat itself to push the px higher :scared-5:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by focus

Anyway..I am kept busy with the stock market.. but have a million in cash sitting in the bank.. need to find a home for it soon 'coz I am more or less fully invested in stock market..

Conflicting right.. :) I must pray that stock market go up up up.. but then it means properties will go up too and here I am saying properties are in a bubble..

---

then u should wait..
if pty mkt dips then u enter lor, if not at least ur stocks are in the money

must be patient

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by august

then u should wait..
if pty mkt dips then u enter lor, if not at least ur stocks are in the money

must be patient

---

patience is a virtue

without which, one can be ....patients .... those in the hospital ...

Thanks all for your views :)
I also have tried to reason with myself that I should buy properties only when no one else is buying.. even if it means the price is higher than now.. 'coz you know the downside is minimized.

Almost all the existing release of 2brm developer units have been sold and a contact tells me that the cheapest for future releases will be at least $1,400psf.

There are already some developer units released (pool facing) asking $1,550 psf. Based on this, I suspect Keppel is targeting over $1,800psf for the Sentosa view units it has left. Note these are not direct facing, so the view is not ideal.

Looks like the game will move to Reflections next if this property rally keeps going.

I always thought developer has only block 42 and 44 ?

The sentosa sea fronting view units are bloack 28,36, and 38. Based on caveat records, all these units are already sold in 2000-2003 period.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 8kenshin

Almost all the existing release of 2brm developer units have been sold and a contact tells me that the cheapest for future releases will be at least $1,400psf.

There are already some developer units released (pool facing) asking $1,550 psf. Based on this, I suspect Keppel is targeting over $1,800psf for the Sentosa view units it has left. Note these are not direct facing, so the view is not ideal.

Looks like the game will move to Reflections next if this property rally keeps going.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DW

I always thought developer has only block 42 and 44 ?

The sentosa sea fronting view units are bloack 28,36, and 38. Based on caveat records, all these units are already sold in 2000-2003 period.

---

Thought so too. Was told by agents that only blk 42, 44 the developer has. Not sure if all 2bedrooms are sold, as last week hear developer is stop selling the higher floor 2bedrooms for price revision which was previous selling at $1,350 psf, not sure whether these units are released again this week and at what price.

Also was told that there are still several 2bedrooms currently rented out, and can be purchsed with the tenancy too, so definitely for buyers looking for 2 bedrooms should still have a choice, unless the demand is so good that within last week all are snapped up. If so the market is really red hot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by flxcat

Thought so too. Was told by agents that only blk 42, 44 the developer has. Not sure if all 2bedrooms are sold, as last week hear developer is stop selling the higher floor 2bedrooms for price revision which was previous selling at $1,350 psf, not sure whether these units are released again this week and at what price.

Also was told that there are still several 2bedrooms currently rented out, and can be purchsed with the tenancy too, so definitely for buyers looking for 2 bedrooms should still have a choice, unless the demand is so good that within last week all are snapped up. If so the market is really red hot.

---

The current release of units is all in stack 42 &44.

From what I heard, there are a still several 2bdr for sale, and more unreleased 2brm held back by the developer. The latter are being planned to be sold at a higher price (a minimum of $1400psf).

I am not sure which block number the casino view units are, but they apparantly are high floor units (8 or 9?) in a stack about 3 rows back from the water. So they are not waterfront, but rather casino view. I have no idea how blocked or unblocked the view is.

Was also at Reflections over the weekend. Golf course view is $1650psf, seaview is $2,150psf. The best stack (direct casino view) is still unreleased.

I think this will play out like the original launch. Keppel's plan will be to sell some units at a very high price, before releasing the best stack. This will be after the IR is built, and I think they want around 3K psf.

The question is...will they be able to get it :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 8kenshin

Almost all the existing release of 2brm developer units have been sold and a contact tells me that the cheapest for future releases will be at least $1,400psf.

There are already some developer units released (pool facing) asking $1,550 psf. Based on this, I suspect Keppel is targeting over $1,800psf for the Sentosa view units it has left. Note these are not direct facing, so the view is not ideal.

Looks like the game will move to Reflections next if this property rally keeps going.

---

I was in Caribbean 2 weeks ago and the pool facing stack 120 & 121 was selling around $1400psf from developer.

May I know which stack pool facing units from developer asking for $1,550psf now?

I didn't pay much attention, but it was something like stack 4 or Stack 30 (I guessing based on the map), that is stacks immediately overlooking the pool.

I think they were two bedders, which are priced at $50-100psf premium to the larger units.

Ahh....... 2BRs. I guess that might be possible then. The smaller units are usually more expensive. Personally, the units which I will consider getting in CRB would be at least the 3BR. The best layout in so far as my view goes, is the 1335sf (3+1) layout. Very regular, good usage of space throughout the apartment in my opinion.

But the 2BR stacks are usually bad facing and hardly have any views. Not sure if there is actually a good 2BR stack which actually faces the pool.

Or are you talking about the small pool (and not the main olympic size pool) ??

Heard from agents KL sold more than 50+ units last weekend and the week before. Any one has any idea what is the pricing now ??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 8kenshin

I didn't pay much attention, but it was something like stack 4 or Stack 30 (I guessing based on the map), that is stacks immediately overlooking the pool.

I think they were two bedders, which are priced at $50-100psf premium to the larger units.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 8kenshin

I didn't pay much attention, but it was something like stack 4 or Stack 30 (I guessing based on the map), that is stacks immediately overlooking the pool.

I think they were two bedders, which are priced at $50-100psf premium to the larger units.

---

Looking at my map for Caribbean, stack 4 is fountain facing and stack 30 is canal facing.

If you are talking about the main pool view units from developer; I think it should be stack 119, 120, 121, 122. The direct main pools facing units are stack 120 & 121 which they are selling at a premiums. However, these 2 stacks are 3 bedder of size 1227sqft.

I am also interested to know the current price from developer now?

You are probably right about the stacks, I wasn't interested in paying that type of price so didn't note down the stack. They were pointed out to me when I was standing by the main pool, and they are units overlooking the main pool.

I also agree that the current pricing, the 3brm offers better value. As well as the extra room, They have a a maids room (which can be used as a store room) and will be more lettable. Many caucasian families stay there, and they like both space and often have young families.

One of my relatives bought a 3brm at a bit over $1300psf over the weekend, with a very attrractive rental contract included (reducing the price ~$80psf) . To respect their privacy I will not disclose any additional details.

Having seen Keppel's work in past launches, they are clearly trying to set a benchmarkt price at the Caribbean prior to doing the next major launch at the Reflections. Will be interetsing to see if their stategy is accepted by the market.

wow.. paying $1300 psf for a 90yrs remaining property?
So basically betting on enbloc? coz how to have further upside after 10yrs ..when it is left with only 80yrs. But I am interested in caribbean too.. very nice..

btw, who to contact for the developers' resale unit ?

I think the ones which are selling at premium prices are 122. These are the 3+1, in my view more regular layouts. 02-122 was selling at 1400psf by developer. The higher floors of 121 or 120 is still at 13xx level, not 1400psf yet. Thus my assessmenet that developer is pricing 122 at a premium.

Its common knowledge that pool facing units are usually sold at higher price. My question is, in caribbean where the attraction is the waterway, why is pool facing still selling at a higher premium than the waterways one ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dormer

Looking at my map for Caribbean, stack 4 is fountain facing and stack 30 is canal facing.

If you are talking about the main pool view units from developer; I think it should be stack 119, 120, 121, 122. The direct main pools facing units are stack 120 & 121 which they are selling at a premiums. However, these 2 stacks are 3 bedder of size 1227sqft.

I am also interested to know the current price from developer now?

---

I'm not sure I would have done the same thing as my relative. Then again, I even more sure I would not pay $1,200 for AMK or the $2000 asking price of some fringe prime developments. That said, unlike this relative, I already own property and am thus hedged against price rises.

There are any number of DTZ agents at the showflat (I'd guess at least 30). I have been there the last two weekends and there are agents by the pool showing sitemaps, agents at the ground floor lobbies and agents entering and leaving the units you are being shown. For the most part, they are busy with clients. When I went to the room where the OTP is done, there were 4 other groups with an agent each. I took them almost 3 hours to do the paperwork (thoiugh I went for lunch - maybe they did the same!).

For the most part, agents were almost always with clients, the most prominent groups being Caucasians, mainland China, and Malaysia.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DW

I think the ones which are selling at premium prices are 122. These are the 3+1, in my view more regular layouts. 02-122 was selling at 1400psf by developer. The higher floors of 121 or 120 is still at 13xx level, not 1400psf yet. Thus my assessmenet that developer is pricing 122 at a premium.

Its common knowledge that pool facing units are usually sold at higher price. My question is, in caribbean where the attraction is the waterway, why is pool facing still selling at a higher premium than the waterways one ?

---

How to price the units for waterways and pools facing in Caribbean is the developer decision. I cannot answer for them. Each buyer has their own preference.

There is no waterway in front of Stack 122. I don't know why they are selling higher price.

I know that the high floor of stack 119 from developer which is pool facing asking around $1500psf. I guess the pricing for each units is depending on the release of units by different phrases and the size of the units.

My veiws is as long as those units from developer that is front facing but not facing the Reflection with direct west sun are consider good units.

hi,heard from my agent that the developer are releasing 2 bedders from unit 101,#05 and #06,and with existing tenant to mid 2010,6.8k and 7.1k..does anyone know how is the facing of this unit?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rain

hi,heard from my agent that the developer are releasing 2 bedders from unit 101,#05 and #06,and with existing tenant to mid 2010,6.8k and 7.1k..does anyone know how is the facing of this unit?

---

2BRs can fetch so high rental??!!?!? Private market in caribbean with 7.1K, can fetch 3BRs or 3+1 BRs even!!

QUOTE=DW]2BRs can fetch so high rental??!!?!? Private market in caribbean with 7.1K, can fetch 3BRs or 3+1 BRs even!![/QUOTE]
It is possible as there units are rented out as service apartment under caribbean residence. If the selling price is still around $1.2mil n clearly dev is charging low to provide the same level of service apartment service then is worth it. So the key is on selling price n charges to provide the rental service. Just some thoughts

These units are serviced apartments with 3x a week cleaning, SCV and up to $300 utilities included. (approximately $700p.m. value).

I've heard Keppel has upped to almost $1500psf for the new 2BRM releases based on how quickly the first units sold.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 8kenshin

These units are serviced apartments with 3x a week cleaning, SCV and up to $300 utilities included. (approximately $700p.m. value).

I've heard Keppel has upped to almost $1500psf for the new 2BRM releases based on how quickly the first units sold.

---

Stack 101 should be 893sf.
Assume is rented out at $7k, service apt charges $1k, and selling at $1.5k psf, the total cost of is ~$1.34mil. Rental gain of $6k still translates to 5.3% yield, not too bad. However, if interest rate hikes, then the buffer will be eaten up fast!

Btw, stack 101 is facing inside greenery, no channel view, so that makes me wonder for 2bedroom facing channel, such as stack 118, 119 are they selling above $1.5k since 101 without channel view is already asking $1.5k