Malaysia Properties

[Laguna]

Spent sometime in analsying KL property market and sharing my findings here.

1. developers start to brand their projects with names like Ritz, Bayan Tree etc and commanding a good premium.

2. developers offer the following
option 1 : cash rebate - thus lower the down payment quantum
option 2 : discount
option 3 : interest absorption scheme
All these move the projects reasonably well as upfront load is lighter especially the cash rebate

3. bank loan LTV has reduced to 85% max, or even 70%

4. most buyers are hoping for capital gain, after project TOP, ie after 3 years of debarment period (ie cannot sell within 3 years)

5. very very high number of completed units looking for tenants...I cannot quantify the numbers, just counted a few project in Mont Kiara, Golden triangle..the number is frightening.

6. very high number of newly completed units, and many many sub sales units, some projects run onto 1000 units for sales and there will be many serivce apartments as well into thousands.

7. top end projects in KLCC less than 5 years are very much lower than the new launches.

8. financing cost is around 4.25%pa

9. Huge supply of land for the larger KL

Conclusion :
1. so call paper profit or capital gain is unlikely can be materialised
2. strong holding power needed, including loan servicing
3. huge oversupply in the sub sale market and rental market, good supply in the primary market
4. traffic condition is getting worst
5. KL is not a financial hub, govt has shifted out alr

so dun touch KL even it looks "affordable"

[Lovelle]

how about landed property ?

[maisonjai]

thanks for the good info, can i add.

CP tax 5% for less than 5 yrs ppty.
26% rental income tax, after deduct expenses.

i lost appetite.....heehee

[supermax]

Spent sometime in analsying KL property market and sharing my findings here.

1. developers start to brand their projects with names like Ritz, Bayan Tree etc and commanding a good premium.

2. developers offer the following
option 1 : cash rebate - thus lower the down payment quantum
option 2 : discount
option 3 : interest absorption scheme
All these move the projects reasonably well as upfront load is lighter especially the cash rebate

3. bank loan LTV has reduced to 85% max, or even 70%

4. most buyers are hoping for capital gain, after project TOP, ie after 3 years of debarment period (ie cannot sell within 3 years)

5. very very high number of completed units looking for tenants...I cannot quantify the numbers, just counted a few project in Mont Kiara, Golden triangle..the number is frightening.

6. very high number of newly completed units, and many many sub sales units, some projects run onto 1000 units for sales and there will be many serivce apartments as well into thousands.

7. top end projects in KLCC less than 5 years are very much lower than the new launches.

8. financing cost is around 4.25%pa

9. Huge supply of land for the larger KL

Conclusion :
1. so call paper profit or capital gain is unlikely can be materialised
2. strong holding power needed, including loan servicing
3. huge oversupply in the sub sale market and rental market, good supply in the primary market
4. traffic condition is getting worst
5. KL is not a financial hub, govt has shifted out alr

so dun touch KL even it looks "affordable"

I am a K.L guy,kind of agreed with u as the number of expatriats is not big enough to cater for the hugh supply of units.Moreover, infrastucture and amenities are not properly planned to enhance value of properties.

[stl67]

thanks for the good info, can i add.

CP tax 5% for less than 5 yrs ppty.
26% rental income tax, after deduct expenses.

i lost appetite.....heehee

26% rental income tax??... what is the incentive to invest?

[CCR]

I am a K.L guy,kind of agreed with u as the number of expatriats is not big enough to cater for the hugh supply of units.Moreover, infrastucture and amenities are not properly planned to enhance value of properties.

10 years ago... when I went to KL, I was really impressed with the vibrancy, nightlife and energy...

Then I didnt have the opportunities to go to KL for about 10 years...

Recently i just happen to go there...
The place have changed so much with so many malls ans luxury condos...
But the traffic and infrastucture have gotten so bad...

When I was there 10 yrs ago, i was worried that KL will catch up with Singapore as SIN was a dead place and KL was happening...

After this trip, my conclusion is that SIn had run so far ahead of our South East Asian neighbours that we are at least 15-20 years ahead in terms of infrastucture, talent, easy place to do business...

Our gahmen keep asking us to keep running faster and faster...
Keep telling us others will catch up.... but I seriously think that these last ten years we actually widen the gap between us and our ASEAN neighbours...

[avo7007]

Ikind of agreed with u as the number of expatriats is not big enough to cater for the hugh supply of units.Moreover, infrastucture and amenities are not properly planned to enhance value of properties.

Does the same applies to Iskandar investment pty too?

[Jadey]

Anyone got any input on iskandar? Where is a good place to invest for detach housing?

[Regulators]

I personally think iskandar is just there to foster closer ties with our neighbors, difficult for that place to be run with the same level of efficiency as singapore coz that is after not on singapore soil. For investment, those outlying towns of kl seem the best bet, some might think klcc is better, but with the prices going for klcc properties, hard to justify those asking rents there and hard to get tenants. Supply is definitely higher than real demand in kl and malaysia generally. For condos there is also maintenance issues and when things go wrong, how is anyone going to get things done. The kopi money culture still very strong in malaysia so you can report to the authorities till the cows come home and nothing gets done. Just be careful if you are bent on investing in malaysian properties. should focus on new town developments like shah alam where capital appreciation potential is high.

[Laguna]

thanks for the good info, can i add.

CP tax 5% for less than 5 yrs ppty.
26% rental income tax, after deduct expenses.

i lost appetite.....heehee

Need to clarify on this
1. capital gain tax is 10% if sold within first year, and 5% 2nd-5th year
2. for property under construction, no sale is allowed within 3 years from date of S&P.

[Laguna]

how about landed property ?

I tried but failed to conclude in a meaningful way as I dun know KL that well. It is more difficult to analyse landed as compare to condo.

But for sure, the yield is extremely bad.

[Laguna]

I would like to refer to this report, page 5, fig 5

http://www.malaysiapropertyinc.com/p...uly%202011.pdf

I personally, feel the number of unsold unit in KL is under-stated.
I have done the work on Iskandar, will share later.

If ur interested in Malaysia property, can read their monthly newsletter

[maisonjai]

26% rental income tax??... what is the incentive to invest?

i can only think of one, price of a resale 3 rm hdb can get u nice unit in KL & hope for big capital appreciation. After Interest, tax, FX not much meat left. Buy for holiday home i think still ok bah.

So several yrs back, msians were the top foreign buyers in Spore not winout a reason.

[Laguna]

Does the same applies to Iskandar investment pty too?

Anyone got any input on iskandar? Where is a good place to invest for detach housing?

Good points :
1. u can buy land at M$45 psf (Leisure Farm) to build ur dream house, double volume living / dinning rooms, 10 high ceiling bedrooms, pool etc
2. lower cost of living, and under MM2H, cheap car as well
3. lower cost of medical care.

As investor, I will not bet on this, reasons :
1. huge supply, Iskandar, 3 time the size of Singapore
2. ability to deliver, execute and sustain is yet to be proven
3. who will buy there? Singaporean? buy to stay or buy to retire and live in? what is the number we are talking here to fill the supply there

There are some other more sensitive issues, not to mention here.

I mentioned in one of the threads earlier on Iskandar, I will keep on eye on its development, perhaps 5 years time and then reassess.

[supermax]

I personally think iskandar is just there to foster closer ties with our neighbors, difficult for that place to be run with the same level of efficiency as singapore coz that is after not on singapore soil. For investment, those outlying towns of kl seem the best bet, some might think klcc is better, but with the prices going for klcc properties, hard to justify those asking rents there and hard to get tenants. Supply is definitely higher than real demand in kl and malaysia generally. For condos there is also maintenance issues and when things go wrong, how is anyone going to get things done. The kopi money culture still very strong in malaysia so you can report to the authorities till the cows come home and nothing gets done. Just be careful if you are bent on investing in malaysian properties. should focus on new town developments like shah

alam where capital appreciation potential is high.

I would say Subang Jaya is a better bet.Its chinese area,better amenities and infrastructure,and its run by a better municipal council.

[buttercarp]

In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.

[supermax]

[quote=buttercarp]In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.[/

Actually,if you have bought into kl properties in 2008 especially the landed
one in prime location you would have made tons of monies. The rental yield is much better than in Singapore,besides capital gain.

[dtrax]

[QUOTE=supermax]

In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.[/

Actually,if you have bought into kl properties in 2008 especially the landed
one in prime location you would have made tons of monies. The rental yield is much better than in Singapore,besides capital gain.

But if you would have done the same in 2008, close one eye buy any condo u point in SG u also earn to the max and and not to mention the extra money u get when u convert into ringgits. Talking about landed in SG, no need prime in SG in 2008, the gain is even more insane. Rental yield how much you talking about? >10%?

[TKT]

[quote=supermax]

In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.[/

Actually,if you have bought into kl properties in 2008 especially the landed
one in prime location you would have made tons of monies. The rental yield is much better than in Singapore,besides capital gain.

Correct. KL properties, similar to Spore's, have already shot up so much in the last couple of years. Penang properties as well.

The next big move (1-2yrs) should be Nusajaya in Iskandar.

[TMATT]

Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away

Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?

never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea...

[QUOTE=dtrax]

But if you would have done the same in 2008, close one eye buy any condo u point in SG u also earn to the max and and not to mention the extra money u get when u convert into ringgits. Talking about landed in SG, no need prime in SG in 2008, the gain is even more insane. Rental yield how much you talking about? >10%?

[ikan bilis]

Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away

Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?

never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea... .

umm.... sea view and near mrt ??...
i think even in sgp also quite hard to find sea view & near mrt... may be skyline, theSail, Marina bay suites/residences....

[supermax]

[quote=dtrax]

But if you would have done the same in 2008, close one eye buy any condo u point in SG u also earn to the max and and not to mention the extra money u get when u convert into ringgits. Talking about landed in SG, no need prime in SG in 2008, the gain is even more insane. Rental yield how much you talking about? >10%?

Easily more than 10% if you are innovative enough.My Singapore friends bought student houses at less than RM400k,designed it and rent out more than RM4000 per month.Now houses he bought transacted at twice the value.

[supermax]

[quote=TMATT]Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away

Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?

never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea...

In Malaysia,Reputation of the Developer come first when u want to buy property.A lot of incomplete projects still takes place at prime location in KL.A lot of Singaporeas get caught with Resort homes bought from pariah developers during the 1990s.

[yowetan]

I have read in other forum on Malaysia projects and properties. It seems attractive and luring.

I am unsure how reliable is the development there, and what are the pros and cons. But, I am pretty convinced that there are indeed hordes of Singaporean moving across the causeway for the homes over there.

Now, is it really feasible and worthwhile to get a roof over there? Is there any "true" prospect for/from Iskandar project or is it just a overhype project touted by the political leader(s) between two countries to entice investors of all land to inject and fuse money into the area for whatever reason?

One immediate concern I have is the security. If all foreigners gathered in Iskandar area, wouldn't that implying the area is subjected to plouging when things (situational/politically) go wrong?

[yaozong7]

http://www.sammyboy.com/forumdisplay...o-Living-In-JB

Basically, most of the information on Iskandar properties can be found here. Indeed, due to affordability issues, many Singaporeans have moved across the Causeway.

My personal take is that it's more suitable for home stay than investment. But to each his own.....

[ikan bilis]

I have read in other forum on Malaysia projects and properties. It seems attractive and luring.

I am unsure how reliable is the development there, and what are the pros and cons. But, I am pretty convinced that there are indeed hordes of Singaporean moving across the causeway for the homes over there.

Now, is it really feasible and worthwhile to get a roof over there? Is there any "true" prospect for/from Iskandar project or is it just a overhype project touted by the political leader(s) between two countries to entice investors of all land to inject and fuse money into the area for whatever reason?

One immediate concern I have is the security. If all foreigners gathered in Iskandar area, wouldn't that implying the area is subjected to plouging when things (situational/politically) go wrong?

think must in-out at very correct time... cyberjaya (mahathir's pet project) got a lot of infrastruture built but now like all wasted... cyberjaya like mostly hosting call centres and data processing centres now....

(google satellite image here, but photos could be a few years behind)
http://maps.google.com/?ll=2.928597,...38581&t=h&z=15

[Jadey]

http://www.sammyboy.com/forumdisplay...o-Living-In-JB

Basically, most of the information on Iskandar properties can be found here. Indeed, due to affordability issues, many Singaporeans have moved across the Causeway.

My personal take is that it's more suitable for home stay than investment. But to each his own.....

Thats exactly what I am thinking too. If you own a few properties in Singapore you will have the option of renting them out and live in lskandar for retirement.

[yowetan]

think must in-out at very correct time... cyberjaya (mahathir's pet project) got a lot of infrastruture built but now like all wasted... cyberjaya like mostly hosting call centres and data processing centres now....

(google satellite image here, but photos could be a few years behind)
http://maps.google.com/?ll=2.928597,...38581&t=h&z=15

This is exact reason why I am skeptical towards Malaysia's government policy and development plan.

Every change in their political scene will motivate and demotivate projects across the country. Despite re-assurance(s) from two governments across the causeway, I am still suspicious and skeptism over Iskandar project development.

Having said that, many Singaporean who bought Horizon hills, leisure farms etc will still stand to gain should their primary agenda/objective is to self-stay and/or retirement purpose. Else, the place has zero to minimum upside potential. I could be wrong in my analysis.

[TKT]

[quote=TMATT]Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away

Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?

never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea...



You can consider Danga Bay or Puteri Harbor in JB... fits your requirements except MRT not expected till 2018/20.

[avo7007]

Maybe in 10 years time, most Singaporean will stay in JB and rent out their pty in Singapore to FT.......