Newbie
i bought at a high, bought the 2 bedroom at $500,000. am not renting it out now cuz am staying with my family. indicative i've gotten so far's $2800 for renovated unit (as mine's renovated) but anyone reading this please do your double checking.
en bloc committee is to vote soon so have to see how the results are though hope that i can stay a while cuz of all the trouble i took to reno. still if price is good i don't mind but so far no one knows
Newbie
the en bloc sales committee has been elected and formed. the meeting was quite interesting since it was my first time seeing what happens in one.
the tension was much less than what i expected though since the press was sensationalising how bad the arguments will get but generally it is still between those who cherish their homes and those who are taking the chance to see if they can earn some $.
those who asked to be in the committee to investigate what kind of direction we can go are quite well qualified though. i see PHD and Masters holders + a good mix of residents who stayed here for sometime (more than 5 years) already. So i think i at least satisfied that we don't have a skewed group that may eventually cause some trouble in the scouting process.
one very interesting event that happened during the meeting though was that an Australian actually got up to argue against forming the committee (or at least he sounded like he was arguing against in my personal opinion though some may say he was just asking all of us to think very carefully about this) cause he quite rightly pointed out that what we have here is something no where else can replace (eg quietness due to thick walls, space for kids to run and enjoy etc).
i think times are hard even now and it's not gonna get better so we have to respect both sides, the ones who want to stay and the ones who are trying to get more $ for security sake.
So, will this news affect the price of Lakepoint positively ???? any comments....Originally Posted by tericia
Newbie
one of the resident during the half hour discussion (before the voting) actually asked a very pointed question on why someone would be willing to pay us more when there is much empty land around jurong. that was something i think someone else in condosingapore.com asked as well.
it was a point i was also pondering on quite a lot as i also feel it was impossible that someone would give us more when there is plenty around for less.
however, another resident who was a property professional (it was stated in the summary of people whose names are put up to be voted into the sales committee) replied that lakepoint is within 300m of an mrt, which means the land is under a different classification. so we can apply to raise our plot ratio from 1.4 to 3, but for how much we don't know yet(cuz lakeholmz and lakeshore apparently their plot ratio is 3 or more, but those reading this please double check again cuz i'm also lost on this plot ratio issue and am still trying to find out how we know all these statistics).
moreover, at present even without plot ratio increase the number of units that can be rebuild can go up to triple of current amount cuz there are 3 blocks (4,6 and block 8)which contains the townhouses so basically only 2 tall blocks (block 2 and 10).
so i gather from this the number of total units available for the buyer should be substantial (how many am also not sure since it was not stated out at the meeting, just generic Q&A). still these guys who were interested to be in the committee look very hopeful (and qualified too) so it will be good to see how they work out the sums.
Newbie
Having gone through an enbloc excercise I can see you are up for some disappointment. CSC's will always paint the rosiest of pictures. You need to start looking at sites like http://www.hope4stayers.com/ just to hear the other side of the story & what kinds of nonsense goes on before signing your home away.... once your names on the CSA you wont be able to get it off. (other than 5 day cooling period).
Plot Ratio.
This is set out in the masterplan. In the latest 2008 plan just released, it didn't increase. There is no guarantee that lobbying the URA will see any change in the plot ratio, and realistically with all the empty land nearby that the government wants developed, this is your only chance to get any sale prices worth considering.
I am not considering signing the CSA until the plot ratio has been increased to it's maximum level, if you do, the CSC will have the authority to sell away your home at the reserve price. Dont be tricked into signing first on the promise they will get the plot ratio of 3. Insist they have it first and show you a letter confirming as much from the selected lawyers if this is one of your criteria for signing.
If they plot ratio is not increase, dont be fooled into thinking that you can develop more units because of the town houses etc.
The developer will only be allowed to make as much as the current Gross Floor Area, regardless of how that is currently configured, i.e. duplex's townhouses etc.... They can then build lots of tiny apartments but are still bound by the same GFA. Where's the enormous benefit to the developer? Next door plot is empty, cheaper & faster to aquire, doesnt have cost of demolishing the old buildings.
This will only be attractive to enbloc after the surrounding plots have been consumed and then the plot ratio increased.
This is really the key. The other arguments put out are typical fear mongering and should be ignored. Having served on my old condo MC for many years it was hard not to laugh at the blatant desperate fear mongering in the circular letter put out by the pre CSC team.
Tennis courts being resurfaced described as a disaster. Give me a break, this is called periodic maintainance.... a little hint, it's what the maintainance fee is for! You move elsewhere, they also have facilities to be maintained, watch out for all the potential disasters in your new condo too!
The maintainance fund at AGM was proposed to be increased by 12% .... wow $50 to $56, 2 plates of chicken rice, and probably has been static for years for 50 (though being new to lakepoint, I'm not sure of this, just a gut feel from experience elsewhere)
99 years lease...... erm, everyone new it was 99 yr leasehold when they bought it! come on, this is a suprise to you all? Can buy freehold to pass onto the next generation..... really? with enbloc I am living proof that is not so.
as for the qualification level..... Not impressed. Bsc in physics, chemistry etc... how is that relevent to property sales? In the CSC of my old development we had lawyers, architects, business owners, multiple property owners, good old fashioned well heeled speculators who could see a bargain and knew how to operate. People who are already independently wealthy, no desperados who need the sale. Our neighbours had a very poor CSC and ended up getting everyone who had signed collectively sued (another reason to stay in the minority)
They got a ridiculously high price, but mainly because the market was really hot (it's now as dead as dead can be) and location,location,location. Downtown orchard area, there is no spare land for developers to buy. You want to build something, you need to buy from the enbloc market. At lakepoint..... well look at google earth and you get the picture pretty fast.
By the time we got the money property downtown had doubled and couldn't realise any gains in property.... but that is another story. My old home was downtown district 9. I have to move out here to be able to hold onto any of the money without getting another mortgage. You will be competing with all your old neighbours to buy the same nearby developments at the same time. Supply-demand will ensure whatever the marketing agent tells you about replacement property is not true by the time you sell.
Go figure where you will have to move to if your starting point is Jurong.... JB perhaps?
At the end of the day you have to decide what your objectives for signing are. I would recommend you be cautious and get educated as you can and get legal advice before signing anything, not just the mandatory lawyer that comes with the new legislation. CSC's will push hard for signatures.
At the EOGM held to explain our CSA they tried getting people to sign before leaving the room!!!! amazing. sign away your rights in 5 mins flat.
I may even be up for the collective sale if the conditions are right eg reserve price of 1000psf/plot ratio, but as it stands right now , from someoone with experience in this matter, it really doesnt look attractive at all. Let's see what the reserve price comes back as.
One last thing. It also creates unpleasant environments. This will happen, don't think it wont. Going home will be like running the gauntlet of people asking have you signed, you must sign, you musn't sign, it gets old really quick.
Newbie
normally yes. It will build i a premium from speculative action if the market is hot.
In fact when you look at other enbloc targets in the east coast, even though the market is dead and they dont have a realistic hope of selling even if they hit 80% support, people who bought into speculate will just keep this thing rolling forever. Why? if they have to get out by selling the unit by itself, they need the extra cushion, the speculator types will have bought in at a premium and need to keep the facade of enbloc going, otherwise the price will correct downwards and they will lose substantial money. And the sad thing is as soon as one effort has come to a close with no takers and the 12 months is up, there is nothing to stop the process repeating immediately.
However the market is now kind of stagnant. All the lots nearby are empty, it will take a really dumb speculator to believe they can make money knowing the governments plans for the area. Then again, there's one born every minute......
Newbie
Hi EBD, thanks for the much needed advice. i'm very new at this so am open to see how the whole situation works out. Very frankly, i knew i bought my home at a high so somehow, i may make a loss if sold at the wrong time (either through en bloc or personal sale) but when you have a family and your landlord asked for high rental rates ($1100 for just a room), i had to act somehow.
Coming in as a new resident i'm against the en bloc cuz i really hate to move my family again so soon and hope to stay at least 7 years or more before thinking about new location. However, as with everyone, if good amount of $ is dangled in front of me, it is hard to resist too cuz more $ means more security esp in these tough times.
Once again, thanks for the advice and i will look out for these factors with the CSC.
Newbie
Your welcome, bottom line is you have to do what is right for you and your family.
Not what is best for stayer, pro enbloc etc...
Do lots of homework, read around what has happened/ is happening elsewhere.
Don't allow anyone to pressure you into a decision one way or the other.
We got lucky in timing and price, our neighbours sale is a disaster for them, they would have got more per unit on the open market by not getting involved in the collective sale.
You can win big, you can lose big. By lose I mean not in absolute $$ which cannot happen, but in terms of what you can get afterwards with the sale proceeds.
Are they building a showflat in the empty plot of land next to Lakepoint? If yes, when is it going to be launched? Heard Frasers Centrepoint last won the bid for the plot. Cheers.
Newbie
am not sure but yup, heard that there is a showroom building there now. Details will probably be clearer when it's launched (we can all go and see) and interesting to find out how much they will launch it at since Lakeshore still selling on a very high as well.
Newbie
Anyupdate ?
Newbie
hehe, with the other threads for west having people condemn the air, land and people in the west, you still interested (joking la)? Anyway, they're putting the sign boards up but i saw Frasers Centerpoint also got sign up. Did not investigate whether it's 2 different projects building side by side or the same one. Please double check.
Newbie
Just an update, the project beside lakeside mrt is by Fraser's. Am not sure how their quality is so anyone who can give a comment would be appreciated.
The long awaited disaster in the economy is finally coming! So am sure those of you (you know who you are) who are waiting for prices to drop, this is the time to slowly start hunting.
Yipee!
get lost chao chee by
do you know that a disaster in the economy is going to cause a lot of people their jobs? do you know that a lot of people will suffer? and yet you have been long awaiting for it to happen just because you are hoping for property prices to drop??? you must be the most inhumane, self-centred and conceited idiot i come across!!
Yes. Death to the over streched. Pray they jump down from their condos and die!
Be careful with what you said. Your god is watching you.
Newbie
Dont worry about the "quality" replies you will get. Crisis always present great opportunities to those who have positioned themselves properly. After my place went enbloc in late 2007, virtually no-one bought prime property , in fact most didn't buy any property with the proceeds as we expected the prices to be heading south as the credit crunch starts reeking its effects into asia.
Some of the responses you will be getting will be from people who are way over leveraged and could lose everything.
Apparently it's ok for these guys to be happy that prices shot up at your expense, but not ok for you to be happy they are coming down.
As for re-entering the market, I am beginning to look too, but really have no intention of buying for another 6 months to a year. I will monitor stockm banks and property transactions closely.
ps, do you know what is happening with the sale committee? I saw the notice from July 27th about selecting potential lawyers and agents (missed out the biggest 2 in my opinion). Our enbloc had the agent and lawyer in 2 weeks. It's now 2 months at lakepoint, did I miss a notice? If not this is a telling sign. We tried enbloc in 1999 in the aftermath of asian economic crisis, agents basically told us "no chance" and didnt want to waste their time. This was for prime district 9 property. I have my suspicions about what is going on, but clarification from SC would be much better.
Newbie
Hi EBD! So far nothing from the sales committee. I last asked someone in the condo MC what's happening she said nothing cuz no one's willing to take up this project in the current situation so that's good news for me actually. After taking up so much time to renovate the whole house, am really quite happy staying here for a while.I think when people in condo say they feel it's a downgrade to live in HDB, i understand. Every afternoon when i've nothing to do, i go to the gym, have a swim. Neighbours are friendly. It's really a boom staying in this kind of environment.As for the prices, i'm also starting to look again. May not even buy anything till 5 years or more since the last time after 1997, it took more than 5 years to bottom out. Hopefully this rescue package makes things even worse for US, then it's really shopping time! Yeah!As for those who are suffering in this coming recession, am really sorry. Not my intention to irritate you. Just happy i get to do what i wanted to for a while but the sky rocketing prices last year really threw everything out of the window.For those who are over stretch am sure if they survive this episode, they will come out of this much better than everyone else, so hang on.
the en bloc will not take plc look at all the stocks of property and losses they have to write off better quickly sell before it get worse, remember more supply new flats pple will be willing to pay old houses will drop this is a fact and also be careful there is already a large supply in west ad centris coming up and new one just launched.. not good
agree. those who wish ill of others will have ill befall on themselves. though i don't think well of flippers, it is not right to wish ill of them. after all, in all property transactions, it is a buy and sell situation. if you think a property is overpriced, then don't buy, simple as that. no one asks you to put your head on the chopping board.
Kudos for those overstreched.
With the construction of the Fraser project, will the price of LP drop cos' of noise, dust, foreign workers etc.?
kudos to you too. good luck!
perhaps you may be the first to lose your job.
Also the LEXUS ,MITSUBISHI, MAZDA & FORD . Too many numbers to remember. The only unit with the house extensively renovated. Good luck.
FYI.. THE MC chairman of this LP which owns a lot of phones already sold his place last yr ! He is a firm believer of enbloc and have yrs of experience running the place etc..
So, for those whom still believe this place have enbloc potential... Gd luck !
PS : With even seragoon gdns hosting only 600 FTs.. suspect jurong will be the next target for big scale hosting of Fts since the MP have supported it citing no objections from the grassroots for yrs ! So .......
Lucky he doesn't stay at Laguna Park, or else sure kena scratch by chairman one... hahahahahaha
Heard Ivory Hts also trying very hard for enbloc but so far no gd news leh...
Agree with you ... reckon those at IH are not as desperate as those at Laguna Park !
Some goes as much as making a list of those not signing and take revenge on their cars. Think better avoid such places !
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