View Full Version : slight clamping down on MM
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 09:50
unofficial min. is now 35 sq m excluding balcony and a/c ledge.
Developers nudged to rightsize shoebox homes BT May 16
(SINGAPORE) The Urban Redevelopment Authority seems to be encouraging developers of shoebox units to increase the size of their apartments. The minimum apartment size that URA is likely to approve these days, especially in projects with many micro apartments, seems to be 35 square metres, up from 28 sq m a couple of years ago, developers told BT recently.
Analysts say that promoting an increase in the size of shoebox units may help to cool the property market since these micro apartments have been blamed for fuelling increases in per square foot prices at some property launches.
A URA spokeswoman stressed that the planning authority does not stipulate a minimum size for apartments to give developers flexibility to build apartments of varying sizes to cater to home buyers' needs. Rather, it adopts a consultative approach, working closely with developers and architects in a negotiated process to enhance the quality of new developments in Singapore.
'When we receive development proposals comprising many small residential units, our immediate concern would be the quality and liveability of the space for home owners as well as the potential impact on the living environment of the neighbourhood and the local traffic situation. In such cases, URA's planners will work with the developers and architects to finetune the design of the development, unit size and unit layout.
'Thus far, the revised (minimum) unit sizes are typically in the range of 35-50 sq m gross floor area, excluding features such as bay windows, balconies and air-con ledges.'
Where necessary, the applicant and URA may jointly do studies to determine the impact of the development proposal on traffic in the location, she added.
The concern is whether the location can handle the additional traffic load arising from an increase in car population if a project with many small apartments is built. This is because the more units a developer packs into a residential development, the higher would be the number of car park lots it has to provide in the project.
BT understands that since around Q3 last year, developers planning to build projects with a substantial number of smallish apartments have been given 'verbal advice' by URA that apartments should be no smaller than 35 sq m in gross floor area excluding balconies and air-con ledges.
This 'verbal advice' seems to have been issued to developers and their architects when they made enquiries after their applications had been turned down, according to some market players.
Industry participants suggest that URA has thus effectively increased the minimum apartment size it would allow, which was previously understood to be 28 sq m (or around 300 square feet), as reported by BT in October 2009.
It was reported then that URA had turned down some applications involving apartments below 28 sq m. In that year, the market had seen what was believed to be Singapore's smallest ever apartment - at 258 sq ft - at the Suites@Guillemard.
In URA's response to BT last week, its spokeswoman said that in processing development proposals, it assesses, among other things, the overall building design, site configuration, unit layout as well as the localised traffic situation to ensure that a proposed development involving small units can provide a good living environment for home buyers. 'In general, residential units should be self-contained with basic amenities such as a living area, bedroom, kitchen and bathroom.'
A developer estimates that an apartment with gross floor area of 35 sq m (excluding balcony and air-con ledge) may have saleable area of about 40.5 sq m (about 436 sq ft) including the balcony and air-con ledge. He reckons that URA is more likely to be stringent about ensuring that apartment sizes are not too small for projects with a large proportion of one bedders and one-bedroom-plus study units.
'But if the one bedders make up a relatively small proportion of units in a large development, which also has bigger units like two, three and four-bedroom apartments, URA's planners may allow a few units even if they're under 35 sq m. A lot will also depend on the layout of these units,' said the developer.
UOL Group president (property) Liam Wee Sin, said: 'Ultimately, what is important is that buyers are made fully aware of the size of apartments they're purchasing and the new requirement for showflats to accurately reflect the actual size and layout of the units will help in this aspect.'
Another developer who declined to be named said that URA's approach to encourage bigger units may have an impact on developers who specialise in shoebox apartments. 'Very often they have been able to achieve relatively high psf prices on these small apartments since they've been able to keep the lumpsum price affordable, at below $500,000. They can price say a 320 sq ft unit at around $1,400 psf and it would cost $448,000. If they now charge the same psf price rate for say a 435 sq ft, the absolute price would be $609,000.'
DTZ executive director Ong Choon Fah suggests that the completion of some of these shoebox developments over the past year or so may have called into question the practicality of living in these small spaces and highlighted the impact of this housing type on the lives of residents and social fabric in the neighbourhood.
DTZ executive director Ong Choon Fah suggests that the completion of some of these shoebox developments over the past year or so may have called into question the practicality of living in these small spaces and highlighted the impact of this housing type on the lives of residents and social fabric in the neighbourhood.Impractical to live in such a small space??? Maybe must ask HK people. They have miserable units there too but all living decently mah... Anyway, those who've bought units smaller than 436 sq ft will huat coz they bought cheap but can still rent at same price as the larger but still studio apartments... :D
Anyway, I seriously doubt the impact of raising the size of MM. At 100k more, most are still decently affordable by investors... Must target at other areas if govt really want to see results.. :spliff:
devilplate
16-05-11, 10:14
Fragrance n oxley goto suck thumb liao:p
450sqft is about right....:D
No more disgusting 3xxsqft mm:cheers6:
Whether isit a gd news for existing owners holding on to 3xxsqft mms?:beats-me-man:
Good news - their units now Exclusive and Rare...can rent higher
devilplate
16-05-11, 10:17
Impractical to live in such a small space??? Maybe must ask HK people. They have miserable units there too but all living decently mah... Anyway, those who've bought units smaller than 436 sq ft will huat coz they bought cheap but can still rent at same price as the larger but still studio apartments... :D
Anyway, I seriously doubt the impact of raising the size of MM. At 100k more, most are still decently affordable by investors... Must target at other areas if govt really want to see results.. :spliff:
Can curb ridiculous mm psf la....easily curb 100-200psf:D
So 3xxsqft become rare now? Hahaha
devilplate
16-05-11, 10:19
Good news - their units now Exclusive and Rare...can rent higher
Sure anot.....gg forward all bigger den them wor....tenants will choose bigger or smaller?:rolleyes:
thomastansb
16-05-11, 10:28
I seriously doubt it. Have a friend who whack 300sf MM only. He has one at Tyrwhitt 139 and Soho 188. Around $5 psf only. Both rent out less than 2k just fyi. But at the price he bought, it is still good rental. He buy around 1.1k psf.
Of course, we can't stop people from buying at 2k psf thinking that crap (sorry my friend) can fetch 4k a month. Both units are within walking distance to MRT.
Good news - their units now Exclusive and Rare...can rent higher
Sure anot.....gg forward all bigger den them wor....tenants will choose bigger or smaller?:rolleyes:I both also don't choose... must put TV on air con ledge le... hahaha!!!
Good news - their units now Exclusive and Rare...can rent higherYes yes... higher than 1990s but not higher than other bigger studios today, all else being equal, like convenience, etc... :D
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 10:30
i agree. this is one thing u dun want to be rare about. :ashamed1:
but this is unofficial and for approvals since Q3 2010. if they want to clamp down further, they can simply put in even stricter rules in a few months time when they officially announce the showflat rules thinghy.
Sure anot.....gg forward all bigger den them wor....tenants will choose bigger or smaller?:rolleyes:
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 10:32
how much is the maintenence? if maintainence fees are relatively high as a proportion of the rental, then the net yield is even much lower.
I seriously doubt it. Have a friend who whack 300sf MM only. He has one at Tyrwhitt 139 and Soho 188. Around $5 psf only. Both rent out less than 2k just fyi. But at the price he bought, it is still good rental. He buy around 1.1k psf.
Of course, we can't stop people from buying at 2k psf thinking that crap (sorry my friend) can fetch 4k a month. Both units are within walking distance to MRT.
I was being sacastic - but I love the reactions...
Perhaps that what an agent will market these 3xx sft units as ...rare!
MM units sld be in Inner City and perhaps only 10-20% in other districts...where is MBT when you need him?
Good news - their units now Exclusive and Rare...can rent higher
devilplate
16-05-11, 10:35
I seriously doubt it. Have a friend who whack 300sf MM only. He has one at Tyrwhitt 139 and Soho 188. Around $5 psf only. Both rent out less than 2k just fyi. But at the price he bought, it is still good rental. He buy around 1.1k psf.
Of course, we can't stop people from buying at 2k psf thinking that crap (sorry my friend) can fetch 4k a month. Both units are within walking distance to MRT.
5-6psf rental damn good liao....like norm sized psf in novena area n even orchard for eg:D
devilplate
16-05-11, 10:37
how much is the maintenence? if maintainence fees are relatively high as a proportion of the rental, then the net yield is even much lower.
I tot u shd noe abt tyrwhitt....:confused:
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 10:43
why would i know? :confused: i m not MM supporter leh. its MCM, our MM king who is likely to know. :)
I tot u shd noe abt tyrwhitt....:confused:
thomastansb
16-05-11, 10:44
I think maintenance doesn't really matter if we use the psf rent x 12 / psf bought to compare.
$5 x 12 / 1100 psf = 5.4% yield. Not bad already. But nowadays, I see people rushing for 1800 psf. 1.8k psf x 350 sf = 630k. Quantum looks low but if rent out at $5 psf, then you get like 3.3% yield. Worse still, no MRT. Maybe can fetch $4 psf now or $3 psf during crisis. $3 x 12 / 1800 = 2%. Good luck to them :)
how much is the maintenence? if maintainence fees are relatively high as a proportion of the rental, then the net yield is even much lower.
proud owner
16-05-11, 10:53
I was being sacastic - but I love the reactions...
Perhaps that what an agent will market these 3xx sft units as ...rare!
MM units sld be in Inner City and perhaps only 10-20% in other districts...where is MBT when you need him?
u need him for what ?
to test if his midget frame can live comfortably in a 3xx sqft unit ?
devilplate
16-05-11, 11:07
why would i know? :confused: i m not MM supporter leh. its MCM, our MM king who is likely to know. :)
Err...tot u told me smthing abt tyrwhitt?:confused: :beats-me-man:
Anyway nvm
u need him for what ?
to test if his midget frame can live comfortably in a 3xx sqft unit ?Hahaha... small MM is for skinny people not midget people.... short people go to low ceiling homes... hahaha! Sorry!
proud owner
16-05-11, 11:11
Hahaha... small MM is for skinny people not midget people.... short people go to low ceiling homes... hahaha! Sorry!
developers should invite MBT and WKS to grace their show flats ...
to visually deceive the viewers on TV ...how BIG the MM units are ...
devilplate
16-05-11, 11:12
I think maintenance doesn't really matter if we use the psf rent x 12 / psf bought to compare.
$5 x 12 / 1100 psf = 5.4% yield. Not bad already. But nowadays, I see people rushing for 1800 psf. 1.8k psf x 350 sf = 630k. Quantum looks low but if rent out at $5 psf, then you get like 3.3% yield. Worse still, no MRT. Maybe can fetch $4 psf now or $3 psf during crisis. $3 x 12 / 1800 = 2%. Good luck to them :)
Bigger units mostly below 4%now too....
3%yield consider ok oredi:doh:
Gd luck everyone:D
Being short will no longer be a liability...can get those skinny models to do runway walk up and down the showflat...
On the opposite end...can you imagine GCT attending a MM show-flat?
Like playing squash - stand in the centre of the "T" and he can reach everything..
developers should invite MBT and WKS to grace their show flats ...
to visually deceive the viewers on TV ...how BIG the MM units are ...
Everyone waiting for interest rates to start moving up ...music stops then...
Bigger units mostly below 4%now too....
3%yield consider ok oredi:doh:
Gd luck everyone:D
devilplate
16-05-11, 11:28
Everyone waiting for interest rates to start moving up ...music stops then...
Again dun fully agree...u nid int rate to spike up .....aussie rates spike up but nvr crash leh....
Everyone waiting for interest rates to start moving up ...music stops then...New music just started... new blood will rush in to snatch the fire sales from desperate sellers due to high interest rates.. Not very defined for MM units lah coz low loan amounts.... its the bigger units that will kana jialat jialat... :cheers1:
I agree with you...but once rates form a floor and creep up, it marks the beginning of the end (of the up and up cycle). It needs to creep up above the prevailing nett rental yield before the tipping point, then when rates exceed the gross yield - thats when the fat lady sings..
Again dun fully agree...u nid int rate to spike up .....aussie rates spike up but nvr crash leh....
devilplate
16-05-11, 11:42
I agree with you...but once rates form a floor and creep up, it marks the beginning of the end (of the up and up cycle). It needs to creep up above the prevailing nett rental yield before the tipping point, then when rates exceed the gross yield - thats when the fat lady sings..
Haha...but in 07, int rates abt 3.5-4%.....music nvr stop until subprime surface wor....i remember icon rental in 07 abt 3-3.5k....now 3.8-4k...However, icon px abt 15xxpsf tat time whereas now 18xxpsf liao....
Watch out guys...hehe:D
Best is buy properties without loan.. then don't care about interest rates... just concern with rental... sit down and collect $! :D
devilplate
16-05-11, 11:52
Best is buy properties without loan.. then don't care about interest rates... just concern with rental... sit down and collect $! :D
Mortgage loan is the cheapest loan in sg....die die must take one
Let say u got 1mil cash, buy a 1mil ppty n at least take 50%loan la....den if px super drop or silver gold super crash...can buybuybuy!:D
Mortgage loan is the cheapest loan in sg....die die must take one
Let say u got 1mil cash, buy a 1mil ppty n at least take 50%loan la....den if px super drop or silver gold super crash...can buybuybuy!:DYup yup.. spread out your portfolio but don't enter a market without doing homework... can get burnt easily.... :p
developers should invite MBT and WKS to grace their show flats ...
better not, WKS falls into the planter no one will notice. :p
450sqft - with & without HS make a difference too.
Deviplate is a Financial Savvy investor. Millionaire does not become billionaire without getting leverage from the banks.
Mortgage loan is the cheapest loan in sg....die die must take one
Let say u got 1mil cash, buy a 1mil ppty n at least take 50%loan la....den if px super drop or silver gold super crash...can buybuybuy!:D
better not, WKS falls into the planter no one will notice. :p
450sqft - with & without HS make a difference too.How many studio apartments come with HS??? Not many lah!!!
devilplate
16-05-11, 14:26
How many studio apartments come with HS??? Not many lah!!!
Nowadays getting lesser...but still got lor....most fragrance mm units comes wif hs....i dun mind actually bcoz can store barang2.....hate planter n big a/c ledge the most
Nowadays getting lesser...but still got lor....most fragrance mm units comes wif hs....i dun mind actually bcoz can store barang2.....hate planter n big a/c ledge the mostTotally agreed.. those irritating a/c ledges where the compressors occupy like less than half of that space and the rest are wasted space... :doh:. Planter box can still cover up and bay windows can still put stuff but a/c ledge ???? We pay for a space we cannot even use???
Must recommend a/c ledges be compartmentalized inside the toilet or something, i.e. must access through toilets or something so it can also be accessible for reasonable amount of further storage space...
Maybe when service air-con, can ask the guy to put some catcus plants or so to add some life...
Maybe when service air-con, can ask the guy to put some catcus plants or so to add some life...I actually recommended reno contractors to build a storage facility at the a/c ledge like cabinets, etc... :D
Trouble is accessibility...but good on you...
Developers are really raping the public with planters/Air-con ledges.
I reckon adds 5-8% additional profits to their bottom lines...
I actually recommended reno contractors to build a storage facility at the a/c ledge like cabinets, etc... :D
Trouble is accessibility...but good on you...
Developers are really raping the public with planters/Air-con ledges.
I reckon adds 5-8% additional profits to their bottom lines...
The public willing to be "raped". :D
Willing buyer, willing seller. So many units out there, why must buy units with big ac ledge.
The public willing to be "raped". :D
Willing buyer, willing seller. So many units out there, why must buy units with big ac ledge.Whether big or small a/c ledge, they are all unusable space so actually no choice lah... anyway, come to think properly... a/c ledge space is probably the least of a buyer's concern... they are more concerned with accessibility, nearby amenities, condo facilities, near to schools, etc than a/c ledge so cannot say why buy units with big a/c ledge... its just irritating that developers are exploiting the rules like that... :simmering:
And even in down market, this will be true...they can market at lower psf but based in GFA it's still high. Agree on being irritating - coz you can't do much abt it.
So far I'm unaffected - but each time I see a flr-plan I :banghead:
Whether big or small a/c ledge, they are all unusable space so actually no choice lah... anyway, come to think properly... a/c ledge space is probably the least of a buyer's concern... they are more concerned with accessibility, nearby amenities, condo facilities, near to schools, etc than a/c ledge so cannot say why buy units with big a/c ledge... its just irritating that developers are exploiting the rules like that... :simmering:
So since developers exploit the rules with all those lousy spaces that can't really be used to the max, we as buyers must counter it by thinking innovative ideas on how to overcome those constraints.. :D
Trouble is accessibility...but good on you...
Developers are really raping the public with planters/Air-con ledges.
I reckon adds 5-8% additional profits to their bottom lines...I didn't do it.. just suggesting... coz a/c ledge is on the outside so will affect the overall image of condo therefore must apply for permit and mostly will be rejected... I'm just saying can try innovative ways of overcoming those irritating problems... :spliff:
Honestly, how big should a air-con ledge be? 50%/100% of the volume of the compressor?
My home, air-con is stuck onto a bracket...one of those classics...
I didn't do it.. just suggesting... coz a/c ledge is on the outside so will affect the overall image of condo therefore must apply for permit and mostly will be rejected... I'm just saying can try innovative ways of overcoming those irritating problems... :spliff:
I didn't do it.. just suggesting... coz a/c ledge is on the outside so will affect the overall image of condo therefore must apply for permit and mostly will be rejected... I'm just saying can try innovative ways of overcoming those irritating problems... :spliff:
isn't a/c ledge usually facing inside? like kitchen, yard, laundry area etc all facing inside.
So if a/c ledge face inside, can we hang the compressor on brackets instead and use a/c ledge as storage.
For example, put the compressor on top a cabinet. secured of course...
So if a/c ledge face inside, can we hang the compressor on brackets instead and use a/c ledge as storage.
For example, put the compressor on top a cabinet. secured of course...If a/c ledge faces inward, you can do anything you want... you can even build a TV console and watch TV there or make a dining area, whatever... :D
Jonathan0503
16-05-11, 19:08
If interest rate increase, wouldn't it mean that the economy is doing well. And if that's the case, rental rate should also increase in tandem right?
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 19:09
how do we calculate? if 35 sq m before anything is the min. min. area + 10% balcony and a little bit for a/c ledge means all units can now not be smaller than 39 sq m = 420 sq ft? that alone already makes me feel a little more comfortable that there is hope. that quality of living in sg has stopped getting worse hahaha.
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 19:12
normal circumstances yes, but property market is still a function of demand and supply. if there is a lot of units up for rent at the same time, but demand is not increasing proportionately, even if economy is doing alright, do you think rental can go up?
If interest rate increase, wouldn't it mean that the economy is doing well. And if that's the case, rental rate should also increase in tandem right?
Bedroom = 14 sqm
Kitchen+yard = 10 sqm
Store = 3 sqm
Toilet = 4 sqm
Total = 31 sqm already (without including a living room)!
So 35 sqm is actually still quite small for a full housing unit, but this is at least a good start!
how do we calculate? if 35 sq m before anything is the min. min. area + 10% balcony and a little bit for a/c ledge means all units can now not be smaller than 39 sq m = 420 sq ft? that alone already makes me feel a little more comfortable that there is hope. that quality of living in sg has stopped getting worse hahaha.
Economy doing well => jobs created => not enough singapore workers => foreigners come in => strong rental demand => higher rental price!
A lot of units coming up but building houses are slower than foreigners moving in so higher rental is still true. The reverse can also happens but definitely not for now or the next 5 years as we have just recovered from 1 of the worst recession in the century (and not just decade)!
normal circumstances yes, but property market is still a function of demand and supply. if there is a lot of units up for rent at the same time, but demand is not increasing proportionately, even if economy is doing alright, do you think rental can go up?
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 19:25
i m more concerned about the MMs (since we r discussing some not very viable MM sizes e.g. 2xx to certain 3xx sq ft types:scared-1: ) when they are completed. but that's untested yet so i really don't know how it will be like.
Economy doing well => jobs created => not enough singapore workers => foreigners come in => strong rental demand => higher rental price!
A lot of units coming up but building houses are slower than foreigners moving in so higher rental is still true. The reverse can also happens but definitely not for now or the next 5 years as we have just recovered from 1 of the worst recession in the century (and not just decade)!
Studio or 1bedders & +study good for single or couple without kid for own stay. MM definitely no-no! I doubt they are viable.
i m more concerned about the MMs (since we r discussing some not very viable MM sizes e.g. 2xx to certain 3xx sq ft types:scared-1: ) when they are completed. but that's untested yet so i really don't know how it will be like.
Regulators
16-05-11, 19:44
an agent I know doing rental for robertson edge told me that a family of 3 (incl a baby) renting a 3xxsf unit had no choice but to move out after a while coz they felt too claustrophobic. Imo there will be demand for tiny mm units if single expat tenants keep coming in, but buying an mm will always limit the tenants. My advice for anyone buying to rent out is to get at least a two bedroom. That being said, there is a new concept that is catching up in singapore, which is the condotel concept (renting out condo like a hotel on short term), but owners have to tie up with housekeeping companies to visit the condo regularly. I am not sure if there are laws prohibiting these short term leases, but I can see owners of mm units in the ccr resorting to that when there is a crunch for tenants in future
However you look at this, there is always only this limited number of buyers for MM units... it is not sustainable in the long run so developers better watch the market carefully and when more MM units TOP over the next 2 years, the market will reach saturation and reality will sink in when no rentals are coming in... :D
an agent I know doing rental for robertson edge told me that a family of 3 (incl a baby) renting a 3xxsf unit had no choice but to move out after a while coz they felt too claustrophobic. Imo there will be demand for tiny mm units if single expat tenants keep coming in, but buying an mm will always limit the tenants. My advice for anyone buying to rent out is to get at least a two bedroom. That being said, there is a new concept that is catching up in singapore, which is the condotel concept (renting out condo like a hotel on short term), but owners have to tie up with housekeeping companies to visit the condo regularly. I am not sure if there are laws prohibiting these short term leases, but I can see owners of mm units in the ccr resorting to that when there is a crunch for tenants in futureResort to condotel only when no choice coz the maintenance and upkeeping of the unit is always a problem... need to get a chamber maid to clean up everytime after the tenants leave... :doh:
devilplate
16-05-11, 19:53
Remember i tok abt condo master room...mm always got renter one la...only how much rental la...haha:p
Now those big units suffering from super low rental yield too....
So the ideal is to get the optimum size just comfy enuff tonstay n rental yield still got at least 4%:D
Private properties are prohibited from daily rental, same for service apts - only hotels can provide daily rental. Service apts usually 1 mth or more. Private properties definitely must be longer than 1 mth to protect service apt industries (same as SP cannot rent on daily lease to protect hotel industries). Those buying into "condotel" concept better be careful because clamp down is inevitable when the practise become blatant just like the govt's previous clamp down on service apts when they try to do daily rent business.
an agent I know doing rental for robertson edge told me that a family of 3 (incl a baby) renting a 3xxsf unit had no choice but to move out after a while coz they felt too claustrophobic. Imo there will be demand for tiny mm units if single expat tenants keep coming in, but buying an mm will always limit the tenants. My advice for anyone buying to rent out is to get at least a two bedroom. That being said, there is a new concept that is catching up in singapore, which is the condotel concept (renting out condo like a hotel on short term), but owners have to tie up with housekeeping companies to visit the condo regularly. I am not sure if there are laws prohibiting these short term leases, but I can see owners of mm units in the ccr resorting to that when there is a crunch for tenants in future
devilplate
16-05-11, 19:57
Those mm owners better prepared to accept 1.2-1.5k rental when market turns...
Same goes to decent sized units....rental can easily drop by half when market turns....sars period might just haunt us again:hell-hath-no-fury:
Back to 2003-2005, rental for a 3bedder like maplewoods only 3k..i quote the max figure liao....gentle reminder:)
Hdb 4rm flat near tpy mrt abt 1.2k tat time too:D
Regulators
16-05-11, 20:20
I think current mm owners still don't see a need to resort to this, but my feeling is that this will be something very common, especially condos strategically situated in hotel belts in the town like in clarke quay, boat quay, orchard etc. I think agents can always exercise creativity in the tenancy agreement, draft a one month tenancy agreement but give tenants an option to terminate on giving twenty four hours notice, that should solve the legal problem
Private properties are prohibited from daily rental, same for service apts - only hotels can provide daily rental. Service apts usually 1 mth or more. Private properties definitely must be longer than 1 mth to protect service apt industries (same as SP cannot rent on daily lease to protect hotel industries). Those buying into "condotel" concept better be careful because clamp down is inevitable when the practise become blatant just like the govt's previous clamp down on service apts when they try to do daily rent business.
If really can then service apts can also do that Liao! :o
I think current mm owners still don't see a need to resort to this, but my feeling is that this will be something very common, especially condos strategically situated in hotel belts in the town like in clarke quay, boat quay, orchard etc. I think agents can always exercise creativity in the tenancy agreement, draft a one month tenancy agreement but give tenants an option to terminate on giving twenty four hours notice, that should solve the legal problem
Regulators
16-05-11, 20:35
From what I know tenancy agreement can be very flexible so you can draft it any way you like, so the only way for the government to put a cap on this is to restrict rental of condos for those on tourist visa
If really can then service apts can also do that Liao! :o
bargain hunter
16-05-11, 20:50
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/listing/3853566/for-rent-the-marq-on-paterson-hill
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/listing/3853360/for-sale-the-marq-on-paterson-hill
2.5% GROSS yield? hahahahahhahaha! :tongue3:
Best is buy properties without loan.. then don't care about interest rates... just concern with rental... sit down and collect $! :D
Some people may prefer to pay the interest rates and use their extra cash for some other investment that can help them to generate more revenue.
Regulators
16-05-11, 21:02
Even at 2.5%, it will take ages to rent out the unit at this kind of five digit rental
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/listing/3853566/for-rent-the-marq-on-paterson-hill
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/listing/3853360/for-sale-the-marq-on-paterson-hill
2.5% GROSS yield? hahahahahhahaha! :tongue3:
Impractical to live in such a small space??? Maybe must ask HK people. They have miserable units there too but all living decently mah... Anyway, those who've bought units smaller than 436 sq ft will huat coz they bought cheap but can still rent at same price as the larger but still studio apartments... :D
Anyway, I seriously doubt the impact of raising the size of MM. At 100k more, most are still decently affordable by investors... Must target at other areas if govt really want to see results.. :spliff:
i have stayed in 280sqft apt in hk. is ok because i treat it as a place for bed and dats all. i could actually jump onto my bed upon entering the main door. kitchen is just a platform to put a small electric heater. frankly speaking, is not livable if you want to spend most of your time in apt. i think minimally 460 sqft and above is still ok.
devilplate
16-05-11, 22:23
i have stayed in 280sqft apt in hk. is ok because i treat it as a place for bed and dats all. i could actually jump onto my bed upon entering the main door. kitchen is just a platform to put a small electric heater. frankly speaking, is not livable if you want to spend most of your time in apt. i think minimally 460 sqft and above is still ok.
For single or couple who hates to do hsework...500sqft will b perfect....Nowadays part time maid hrly rates not cheap aso..anybody got cheap lobang?
10min vacuum,10min mop...:D
Jonathan0503
16-05-11, 22:35
Studio or 1bedders & +study good for single or couple without kid for own stay. MM definitely no-no! I doubt they are viable.
How big is your definition of MM in this case? Less than 400sqft?
Thought quite a no. of studio and 1 bedders are now less than 400sqft...
This is a Savvy Investor.
Some people may prefer to pay the interest rates and use their extra cash for some other investment that can help them to generate more revenue.
Anything <600 sqft is not liveable for a unit complete with bedroom, kitchen+yard, living, toilet, storeroom.
How big is your definition of MM in this case? Less than 400sqft?
Thought quite a no. of studio and 1 bedders are now less than 400sqft...
Regulators
17-05-11, 00:13
Singapore's smallest unit, how can one live inside? :doh: :doh: :doh:
http://www.h88.com.sg/images/content/2009-09-29/suitesatguillemard_studio_t.jpg
devilplate
17-05-11, 00:15
Singapore's smallest unit, how can one live inside? :doh: :doh: :doh:
http://www.h88.com.sg/images/content/2009-09-29/suitesatguillemard_studio_t.jpg
The bathroom so big:D
Regulators
17-05-11, 00:16
already dying for space inside but look at the bay windows? :doh:
The bathroom so big:D
kingkong1984
17-05-11, 06:02
already dying for space inside but look at the bay windows? :doh:
Action in the tiolet? Sitting on the bay, bumping my butt? Seriously, it is not normal.
Anything <600 sqft is not liveable for a unit complete with bedroom, kitchen+yard, living, toilet, storeroom.Do away with yard and storeroom. These are less associated with MM units so size will be ok at 500sqft. :D
Geylang OKT
17-05-11, 09:31
Singapore's smallest unit, how can one live inside? :doh: :doh: :doh:
http://www.h88.com.sg/images/content/2009-09-29/suitesatguillemard_studio_t.jpg
I strongly disagree that MM units are unsuitable for residential living :simmering: :simmering: :simmering:
Such MM units are indeed suitable for midgets, dwarfs and stunted people :D :D :D
devilplate
17-05-11, 09:37
I strongly disagree that MM units are unsuitable for residential living :simmering: :simmering: :simmering:
Such MM units are indeed suitable for midgets, dwarfs and stunted people :D :D :D
Too big for my doggies:D
Jonathan0503
17-05-11, 10:47
Singapore's smallest unit, how can one live inside? :doh: :doh: :doh:
http://www.h88.com.sg/images/content/2009-09-29/suitesatguillemard_studio_t.jpg
No dining table? Use coffee table instead?
People living in MM has no broom, tools' set, extra chairs (for visitors) etc to keep in store-room? :beats-me-man:
They also no need to wash clothings (since no yard), can use washer cum dryer but when using dryer cannot cook, cannot stay in that small living room. :doh: Can't imagine how unhygenic it is to use the dryer in the kitchen!
Do away with yard and storeroom. These are less associated with MM units so size will be ok at 500sqft. :D
They should design it to use the bedside as sofa, coffee table as dining table, bedroom shelves for storing barang barang, to make efficient use of space! Also build double-decker, upstairs got study table. :p
No dining table? Use coffee table instead?
For single or couple who hates to do hsework...500sqft will b perfect....Nowadays part time maid hrly rates not cheap aso..anybody got cheap lobang?
10min vacuum,10min mop...:D
Not only for single and couple who hates to do the housework but for older people also. As age is catching up, no more energy already.
I have a friend who got a part-time cleaner, I think she paid about $40 to $50 per hour, just tell the cleaner what you want her to do, but most of the time, her cleaner only wash the toilet and clean the windows.
devilplate
17-05-11, 13:01
Not only for single and couple who hates to do the housework but for older people also. As age is catching up, no more energy already.
I have a friend who got a part-time cleaner, I think she paid about $40 to $50 per hour, just tell the cleaner what you want her to do, but most of the time, her cleaner only wash the toilet and clean the windows.
So expensive 40 per hr!:scared-1:
Tot 4hr 80buck abt market rate now....
Still prefers 900-1000psf with 2 bedroom even for a couple.
Not only for single and couple who hates to do the housework but for older people also. As age is catching up, no more energy already.
I have a friend who got a part-time cleaner, I think she paid about $40 to $50 per hour, just tell the cleaner what you want her to do, but most of the time, her cleaner only wash the toilet and clean the windows.
devilplate
17-05-11, 13:06
Still prefers 900-1000psf with 2 bedroom even for a couple.
Own stay wif part time maid 1300sqft will b perfect even for couple:D
1guest rm n 1 study rm:D
So expensive 40 per hr!:scared-1:
Tot 4hr 80buck abt market rate now....
Where to find such a good deal, only $20 per hour, any lobang? Never use any part time maid before because I find it too expensive, $40 per hour.
A lot of maids are skving on weekends to make extra income.
Where to find such a good deal, only $20 per hour, any lobang? Never use any part time maid before because I find it too expensive, $40 per hour.
No need guest room. Just masterbedrm and study room to double up as guest room will do. Storerm/utility room/bombshelter must have.
Own stay wif part time maid 1300sqft will b perfect even for couple:D
1guest rm n 1 study rm:D
devilplate
17-05-11, 13:15
Where to find such a good deal, only $20 per hour, any lobang? Never use any part time maid before because I find it too expensive, $40 per hour.
Got many coy....but nid to engage 4times a mth to get such rates....
I want cheaper leh:banghead:
Own stay wif part time maid 1300sqft will b perfect even for couple:D
1guest rm n 1 study rm:D
Currently, staying in a 14xx sf with 3 bedrooms, already find it too big when come to doing housework because we have lots of rubbish, things always come in but never go out. My husband has to help me especially during CNY and he always complain that he doesn't like CNY, haha.
Can arrange with a few neighbours and give the maid a better deal as each visit can clean 4-5 households. So can clean alternate week instead of every week for each household. I am sure there are people who are serving as middleman and making a cut out of it.
Got many coy....but nid to engage 4times a mth to get such rates....
I want cheaper leh:banghead:
devilplate
17-05-11, 13:22
Currently, staying in a 14xx sf with 3 bedrooms, already find it too big when come to doing housework because we have lots of rubbish, things always come in but never go out. My husband has to help me especially during CNY and he always complain that he doesn't like CNY, haha.
If no maid, den 500sqft lor...hehe:D
I am going to move into a two-bedder condo after my children get married. 3-storey landed is just too big.
Currently, staying in a 14xx sf with 3 bedrooms, already find it too big when come to doing housework because we have lots of rubbish, things always come in but never go out. My husband has to help me especially during CNY and he always complain that he doesn't like CNY, haha.
Eldenfirefly
17-05-11, 13:27
I remain unconvinced about the potential for MM units. Who exaxctly are the kind of people who will rent such a place? People who are middle management, high enough income to consider, will probably be in their 30s, or 40s.
And got high chance such people will have family. If so, would they really want a MM unit? Espcially since they could easily get a much bigger unit if they top up just a bit more, or if they don't mind slightly further away location?
So, they are going for the singles. But if its singles, then they can much more easily do some sharing arrangement, or just rent a room instead of a whole unit. And Singles usually have less ability to pay, so the rent cannot be so high also, if its high, they might as well get a full condo unit which is much bigger already.
So, seriously, I don't think the rental is going to be as high as what these agents claim. And if the rental can't be that high, then the price of the unit itself will also be questionable.
If no maid, den 500sqft lor...hehe:D
Ya lor, thought of shifting to a smaller unit when my 2 children are married but don't know when lol.:scared-3:
Do you normally tell the maid what to clean or she just clean up the whole house, does it include washing and ironing of clothing. My friend told me that don't ask them to wash and iron because is a waste of time.
devilplate
17-05-11, 13:31
3xxsqft currently commands 1.8-2k rental....actual tx
But i prefer 500-600sqft....safer:D
I do have a tenant who rented a 2-bedder unit at quite high rental. Well, he is a director in a bank and hardly cooked. He only wanted a microwave oven.
I remain unconvinced about the potential for MM units. Who exaxctly are the kind of people who will rent such a place? People who are middle management, high enough income to consider, will probably be in their 30s, or 40s.
And got high chance such people will have family. If so, would they really want a MM unit? Espcially since they could easily get a much bigger unit if they top up just a bit more, or if they don't mind slightly further away location?
So, they are going for the singles. But if its singles, then they can much more easily do some sharing arrangement, or just rent a room instead of a whole unit. And Singles usually have less ability to pay, so the rent cannot be so high also, if its high, they might as well get a full condo unit which is much bigger already.
So, seriously, I don't think the rental is going to be as high as what these agents claim. And if the rental can't be that high, then the price of the unit itself will also be questionable.
devilplate
17-05-11, 13:34
Ya lor, thought of shifting to a smaller unit when my 2 children are married but don't know when lol.:scared-3:
Do you normally tell the maid what to clean or she just clean up the whole house, does it include washing and ironing of clothing. My friend told me that don't ask them to wash and iron because is a waste of time.
Nvr include windows....
Vacuum, mop, wash toilet, clean kitchen...left abt 30min to do some ironing:D
Clean windows will take 3-4hrs oredi if one person doing it...lol....usually do it once a yr rite? 350buck spring cleaning for abt 5-6hrs...3pax:D
kingkong1984
17-05-11, 13:43
The highest psf will be the hardest hit.
The smallest sized will be the highest rejected.
The largest number will become the largest risk.
If u still duno what the problem is,
Go blow your bubble with your kids.
It floats higher before it pops.
Go for the smallest unit that fits your requirement.
Eldenfirefly
17-05-11, 13:43
There's all kinds of people. My question is. Out of all the directors of banks, how many will be married with a family and how many will be single? I suspect far more bank directors will be married rather than single. :)
And see, even that guy you mentioned rented a 2 bedder. Why didn't he go for a one bedroom studio? I am sure he could have afforded it. The thing is, even if you know you could get by with just one bedroom, if you are earning a high income, and prepared to pay for some comfort, why would you be ok with a small small place like a MM unit? Its not just about location, finishing, etc. Its just that psycologically, if you are alraedy paying so much to rent, then you would want a slightly bigger place.
Suprising, I saw a one bedder unit has 4 people in there. It is about the depth of their pockets to trade off with comfort.
There's all kinds of people. My question is. Out of all the directors of banks, how many will be married with a family and how many will be single? I suspect far more bank directors will be married rather than single. :)
And see, even that guy you mentioned rented a 2 bedder. Why didn't he go for a one bedroom studio? I am sure he could have afforded it. The thing is, even if you know you could get by with just one bedroom, if you are earning a high income, and prepared to pay for some comfort, why would you be ok with a small small place like a MM unit? Its not just about location, finishing, etc. Its just that psycologically, if you are alraedy paying so much to rent, then you would want a slightly bigger place.
devilplate
17-05-11, 13:51
There's all kinds of people. My question is. Out of all the directors of banks, how many will be married with a family and how many will be single? I suspect far more bank directors will be married rather than single. :)
And see, even that guy you mentioned rented a 2 bedder. Why didn't he go for a one bedroom studio? I am sure he could have afforded it. The thing is, even if you know you could get by with just one bedroom, if you are earning a high income, and prepared to pay for some comfort, why would you be ok with a small small place like a MM unit? Its not just about location, finishing, etc. Its just that psycologically, if you are alraedy paying so much to rent, then you would want a slightly bigger place.
As i said, mm rental 1.8-2k....those 450-500 sqft can hit 2.5k....clift,icon,sail 1bedder fetch 3.8-4.5k
B42007, 2bedder vy popular for single n couples....but bcoz their package din raise enuff....so no choice but to take 1bedder....tats wat i gather from my tenants
Sb one bedder fetch about 3.8-4k on high floors.
As i said, mm rental 1.8-2k....those 450-500 sqft can hit 2.5k....clift,icon,sail 1bedder fetch 3.8-4.5k
B42007, 2bedder vy popular for single n couples....but bcoz their package din raise enuff....so no choice but to take 1bedder....tats wat i gather from my tenants
kingkong1984
17-05-11, 13:56
Hey, how about 1 bedder in the north? Near to Sembawang shopping centre should have some. The one near to jalan shaer?
I think 500-600 sf should be okay but not smaller than 400 sf. Some people just need it to rest after a day work, don't need to have a bigger unit unless they have children which maybe need more space for them to "explore".
Does anybody know what is the size for a 3 room HDB flat (ie 2 bedrooms)?
devilplate
17-05-11, 14:02
Sb one bedder fetch about 3.8-4k on high floors.
Can get 3k for lower flrs:D
devilplate
17-05-11, 14:03
I think 500-600 sf should be okay but not smaller than 400 sf. Some people just need it to rest after a day work, don't need to have a bigger unit unless they have children which maybe need more space for them to "explore".
Does anybody know what is the size for a 3 room HDB flat (ie 2 bedrooms)?
65sqm....rooms r big but living rm damn small....kitchen vy big tough
65sqm....rooms r big but living rm damn small....kitchen vy big tough
Wow, 65sqm is about 700sf, quite big hor.
Lower floor unit could be either desperate owners as I understand there are a few of them or they could be original buyer who can afford lower rent can still can get good yield. Quite a bit of the higher floor units have change a few times. U probably know the view is very different between a low floor and a high floor unit.
Can get 3k for lower flrs:D
Eldenfirefly
17-05-11, 14:09
You know why Hong Kongers are always out until so late at night ? I think the biggest reason is because their homes are so small. So, really their place is just to go back and sleep only.
If stretch out your hands, can reach and touch everything and take on step means reaching the wall in any direction, after a while, you won't want to stay at home much. It will just feel very caustrophbic. :)
The thing is, if people don't have a choice, then they may go for a small unit. But if they had a choice, then such MM units will not be the top priority. And for now, there are still quite enough normal sized units and HDB flats for rental out there still.
People in Singapore have a choice as the public housing is good and sizeable as compared to public housing in HK.
You know why Hong Kongers are always out until so late at night ? I think the biggest reason is because their homes are so small. So, really their place is just to go back and sleep only.
If stretch out your hands, can reach and touch everything and take on step means reaching the wall in any direction, after a while, you won't want to stay at home much. It will just feel very caustrophbic. :)
The thing is, if people don't have a choice, then they may go for a small unit. But if they had a choice, then such MM units will not be the top priority. And for now, there are still quite enough normal sized units and HDB flats for rental out there still.
You know why Hong Kongers are always out until so late at night ? I think the biggest reason is because their homes are so small. So, really their place is just to go back and sleep only.
If stretch out your hands, can reach and touch everything and take on step means reaching the wall in any direction, after a while, you won't want to stay at home much. It will just feel very caustrophbic. :)
The thing is, if people don't have a choice, then they may go for a small unit. But if they had a choice, then such MM units will not be the top priority. And for now, there are still quite enough normal sized units and HDB flats for rental out there still.
If you have been staying in a bigger house all along might not be used to staying in a MM house. The advantage of staying in a MM unit is, you need not use too many energy to walk from one room to another room, haha.
People who bought the MM unit might have a budget constraint and yet they hope to have their own private ppty or that they are not allowed to purchase any more unit from the HDB. Nowadays, HDB unit are quite small too as compared to last time.
Eldenfirefly
17-05-11, 14:25
Even small also not as small as a MM unit! :)
You know why Hong Kongers are always out until so late at night ? I think the biggest reason is because their homes are so small. So, really their place is just to go back and sleep only.
If stretch out your hands, can reach and touch everything and take on step means reaching the wall in any direction, after a while, you won't want to stay at home much. It will just feel very caustrophbic. :)
The thing is, if people don't have a choice, then they may go for a small unit. But if they had a choice, then such MM units will not be the top priority. And for now, there are still quite enough normal sized units and HDB flats for rental out there still.
Some people staying in a bigger unit in Singapore also out until very late at night.
Eldenfirefly
17-05-11, 14:29
Singapore more happening nowadays mah. And kids these days, I swear they are all night owls. You see lots of them, quite young, but still bright eyed and energetic at 11pm at night. lol
But there is a reason why most of the shops in Singapore start closing at 10pm la. :) Its because after that, less people out and about already.
Hope they are not working hard to make money to pay off their home loan. That will be a really sad.
Some people staying in a bigger unit in Singapore also out until very late at night.
about 750 sqft.
I think 500-600 sf should be okay but not smaller than 400 sf. Some people just need it to rest after a day work, don't need to have a bigger unit unless they have children which maybe need more space for them to "explore".
Does anybody know what is the size for a 3 room HDB flat (ie 2 bedrooms)?
Even small also not as small as a MM unit! :)
I have come across a HDB flat, which is a 1 bedroom unit (ie no bedroom at all) in an old estate. When you enter the house, hall and bedroom is together, you have to do your own partition to divide the bedroom and the hall but there is a kitchen, which maybe allows only 1 - 2 people to enter. At the door entrance, you can see the whole view of the inside. Looks like a square box.
Now up know why some msny people rui upset with minister pension.gT
I have come across a HDB flat, which is a 1 bedroom unit (ie no bedroom at all) in an old estate. When you enter the house, hall and bedroom is together, you have to do your own partition to divide the bedroom and the hall but there is a kitchen, which maybe allows only 1 - 2 people to enter. At the door entrance, you can see the whole view of the inside.
bargain hunter
17-05-11, 14:48
hdb 1 and 2 rm flats are not available to non low income singaporeans.
I have come across a HDB flat, which is a 1 bedroom unit (ie no bedroom at all) in an old estate. When you enter the house, hall and bedroom is together, you have to do your own partition to divide the bedroom and the hall but there is a kitchen, which maybe allows only 1 - 2 people to enter. At the door entrance, you can see the whole view of the inside.
Now up know why some msny people rui upset with minister pension.gT
Sorry, I didn't follow up, what is it all about actually?
Where to find such a good deal, only $20 per hour, any lobang? Never use any part time maid before because I find it too expensive, $40 per hour.Plenty of $20/hr part timer... Just as recent as last year CNY, my part time maid only charge $13/hr. We feel bad and paid her extra $20 for a 5 hour spring cleaning work.
hdb 1 and 2 rm flats are not available to non low income singaporeans.
I was actually trying to say that HDB also has MM unit.
People in Singapore have a choice as the public housing is good and sizeable as compared to public housing in HK.Want to buy also must qualify to buy... singles vs married, 35 years old, income ceiling, etc...
bargain hunter
17-05-11, 14:54
but there are differences. the hdb MM are for the genuine poor.
while private MMs are being marketed as luxury in some cases! real sad case.
That's why I say HDB also has MM unit.
Sorry, I didn't follow up, what is it all about actually?
There r quite a lot ofc poor peope ard and they need help to mke ends meet.
Plenty of $20/hr part timer... Just as recent as last year CNY, my part time maid only charge $13/hr. We feel bad and paid her extra $20 for a 5 hour spring cleaning work.
$13 per hour is cheap, did you get it from agency?
but there are differences. the hdb MM are for the genuine poor.
while private MMs are being marketed as luxury in some cases! real sad case.Most of these HDB MM units are not sold but rather are rented instead...
but there are differences. the hdb MM are for the genuine poor.
while private MMs are being marketed as luxury in some cases! real sad case.
I think ysyap is right, it is for rental only.
$13 per hour is cheap, did you get it from agency?My wife just reminded me its $10/hr... Got it from agency like 3 years ago but periodically still get her back to help when my full time maid is not around or during CNY cleaning... :D She didn't raise her fee for years already and very hardworking...
devilplate
17-05-11, 15:10
My wife just reminded me its $10/hr... Got it from agency like 3 years ago but periodically still get her back to help when my full time maid is not around or during CNY cleaning... :D She didn't raise her fee for years already and very hardworking...
Freelance? Or? Legal? Can pm me? I want:D
I dun mind paying her 15/hr:D
My wife just reminded me its $10/hr... Got it from agency like 3 years ago but periodically still get her back to help when my full time maid is not around or during CNY cleaning... :D She didn't raise her fee for years already and very hardworking...
Thanks. Is she a Singaporean?
My maid has told me abt this freelance opportunity. It's illegal. Wait till they injure while carrying the work.
Thanks. Is she a Singaporean?A mainland Chinese in her late 30s early 40s.
Freelance? Or? Legal? Can pm me? I want:D
I dun mind paying her 15/hr:DHere is the tricky part... She is with a company so not illegal but she cannot accept so low rate according to the company so company will call us to check on her rate. I am not very sure how this works coz I don't deal directly with the maid's stuff...
A mainland Chinese in her late 30s early 40s.
Thank you.
devilplate
17-05-11, 15:25
Y some tenants pay 2k for a 3xxsqft mm and not a 3rm flat which is bigger?
Bcoz, majority of the 3rm flats condition vy jialat....i noe bcoz i tried helping my fren to look for one....condition damn jialat....not willing to paint....can see bugs etc...:scared-3: and yet asking 1.8k....duno whether the landlords will return the deposit anot too....:eek:
A mainland Chinese in her late 30s early 40s.
Even auntie job is robbed by foreigner.
devilplate
17-05-11, 15:30
Even auntie job is robbed by foreigner.
Got any auntie willing to do for 15/hr? :D
Even auntie job is robbed by foreigner.
Some of the jobs, Singaporean don't want to work either the pay is too low or job is too tough. Sighhhh... no foreigner die, got foreigners also die.
Even auntie job is robbed by foreigner.CEO job more difficult to do also kanna robbed... what do u expect about auntie;s job which is much easier to do... :p
devilplate
17-05-11, 15:34
CEO job more difficult to do also kanna robbed... what do u expect about auntie;s job which is much easier to do... :p
If dun allow such cheap labour to come in....our cost of living gona spiral up...
How many locals willing to work long hrs as waitress for just 1200/mth?
If employ locals n pay 1600-1800...u tink biz owners will up the food px anot?:rolleyes:
If dun allow such cheap labour to come in....our cost of living gona spiral up...
How many locals willing to work long hrs as waitress for just 1200/mth?
If employ locals n pay 1600-1800...u tink biz owners will up the food px anot?:rolleyes:Agreed... I frequent this eating outlet managed by all filipinos and only 1 local... how they can get by the MOM required ratio I also dont know... maybe higer management all locals???:D
Cld bk the high rental. I still can get $2 fishball noodle in maxwell market as owners may hve lower rental.
Though it seems that the labour cost for the China people are cheap but do you all realise, the food stall that they set up, price for the food are not cheap. I have come across an old HDB coffee shop, Singaporeans selling Hor Fun at $3 /plate, after the China people take over the stall, it increases to $4 /plate, then I think no sales, so it dropped to $3.50 /plate.
Another case is at the shopping centre near HDB, at first the Singaporean/Malaysian selling the herbal chicken soup at $5 each but after the China people take over, it increases to $6.00, then after 2 months, it goes up to $6.50 and the half chicken is also getting smaller and the soup was so diluted. I got it from another HDB coffee shop cum neighbourhood shopping centre for only $5 each and it is a big drumstick. Even though 2 different shopping centres, the difference also cannot be so great, maybe $0.50 - $1.00 is still acceptable but now is $1.50 and the size also shrink and drinking the soup is like drinking plain water.
I think they think that Singapore is a "gold mine".
Newly renovated hawker centre or coffee shop rui more expensive becos landlord has raise the rent.central n off central has different price.
Though it seems that the labour cost for the China people are cheap but do you all realise, the food stall that they set up, price for the food are not cheap. I have come across an old HDB coffee shop, Singaporeans selling Hor Fun at $3 /plate, after the China people take over the stall, it increases to $4 /plate, then I think no sales, so it dropped to $3.50 /plate.
Another case is at the shopping centre near HDB, at first the Singaporean/Malaysian selling the herbal chicken soup at $5 each but after the China people take over, it increases to $6.00, then after 2 months, it goes up to $6.50 and the half chicken is also getting smaller and the soup was so diluted. I got it from another HDB coffee shop cum neighbourhood shopping centre for only $5 each and it is a big drumstick. Even though 2 different shopping centres, the difference also cannot be so great, maybe $0.50 - $1.00 is still acceptable but now is $1.50 and the size also shrink and drinking the soup is like drinking plain water.
I think they think that Singapore is a "gold mine".
Though it seems that the labour cost for the China people are cheap but do you all realise, the food stall that they set up, price for the food are not cheap. I have come across an old HDB coffee shop, Singaporeans selling Hor Fun at $3 /plate, after the China people take over the stall, it increases to $4 /plate, then I think no sales, so it dropped to $3.50 /plate.
Another case is at the shopping centre near HDB, at first the Singaporean/Malaysian selling the herbal chicken soup at $5 each but after the China people take over, it increases to $6.00, then after 2 months, it goes up to $6.50 and the half chicken is also getting smaller and the soup was so diluted. I got it from another HDB coffee shop cum neighbourhood shopping centre for only $5 each and it is a big drumstick. Even though 2 different shopping centres, the difference also cannot be so great, maybe $0.50 - $1.00 is still acceptable but now is $1.50 and the size also shrink and drinking the soup is like drinking plain water.
I think they think that Singapore is a "gold mine".If too expensive then don't buy from them lor... they'll get the msg after couple of months... my house nearby got a shop that sells stuff at least 10% above the other shops so I'll just walk further to buy cheaper... :spliff2:..
What's irritating is this... places like food fare are giving out discount coupons to subsidize the food price inflation so they can better justify the high food prices but after the coupons are used, people tend to forget that prices are actually raised coz they are accustomed to the new heightened price as the norm. Hence, such places will be remembered for being super nice to people coz they give coupons and they don't have to account for the high food prices...
No doubt food prices rose but the rental don't have to rise. Unfortunately this is not true for these big players... who is checking on them? :doh: In the end, customers are the biggest losers but the worse thing is they think they don't even know they are losers... still naively think they are benefitting from the kind gestures of these big players... :scared-4:
If like what someone in this forum suggested that MBT is reading this forum, then really hope that new guidelines will be implemented on MM units's shrinking size when new guidelines are rolled out on showflat requirements... If May sales data continue to rise, CM5 is on its way le... :scared-4:
bargain hunter
17-05-11, 19:19
2000 units in may and 350 units for EC will do the trick. :D
If like what someone in this forum suggested that MBT is reading this forum, then really hope that new guidelines will be implemented on MM units's shrinking size when new guidelines are rolled out on showflat requirements... If May sales data continue to rise, CM5 is on its way le... :scared-4:
i will avoid chinamen stall unless they are selling their specialty like siao long bao or la mian.
sometimes i don't understand their "accent"
rattydrama
17-05-11, 21:05
Though it seems that the labour cost for the China people are cheap but do you all realise, the food stall that they set up, price for the food are not cheap. I have come across an old HDB coffee shop, Singaporeans selling Hor Fun at $3 /plate, after the China people take over the stall, it increases to $4 /plate, then I think no sales, so it dropped to $3.50 /plate.
Another case is at the shopping centre near HDB, at first the Singaporean/Malaysian selling the herbal chicken soup at $5 each but after the China people take over, it increases to $6.00, then after 2 months, it goes up to $6.50 and the half chicken is also getting smaller and the soup was so diluted. I got it from another HDB coffee shop cum neighbourhood shopping centre for only $5 each and it is a big drumstick. Even though 2 different shopping centres, the difference also cannot be so great, maybe $0.50 - $1.00 is still acceptable but now is $1.50 and the size also shrink and drinking the soup is like drinking plain water.
I think they think that Singapore is a "gold mine".
These chinese operators could rent the stall at higher rental and the cost of the rental is charged to the food.
But it is bad to reduce the quality of the food as the business will surely fail.
I think end of the day, the government should step in and review how many stalls were sublet to China operators instead of Singaporeans. Where the Singapreans operators go to then? Casino and Turf Club?
devilplate
17-05-11, 21:10
Can usa raised debt ceiling again? R they allowed to default? Ponzi scheme burst? Raised so many times liao....so any exception this time?:scared-4:
Newly renovated hawker centre or coffee shop rui more expensive becos landlord has raise the rent.central n off central has different price.
The problem is the prices is high in the west (run by china people) while low in the central (run by Singaporean / Malaysian). Both are old estates.
If like what someone in this forum suggested that MBT is reading this forum, then really hope that new guidelines will be implemented on MM units's shrinking size when new guidelines are rolled out on showflat requirements... If May sales data continue to rise, CM5 is on its way le... :scared-4:
Sorry, what is CM5?
If too expensive then don't buy from them lor... they'll get the msg after couple of months... my house nearby got a shop that sells stuff at least 10% above the other shops so I'll just walk further to buy cheaper... :spliff2:..
What's irritating is this... places like food fare are giving out discount coupons to subsidize the food price inflation so they can better justify the high food prices but after the coupons are used, people tend to forget that prices are actually raised coz they are accustomed to the new heightened price as the norm. Hence, such places will be remembered for being super nice to people coz they give coupons and they don't have to account for the high food prices...
No doubt food prices rose but the rental don't have to rise. Unfortunately this is not true for these big players... who is checking on them? :doh: In the end, customers are the biggest losers but the worse thing is they think they don't even know they are losers... still naively think they are benefitting from the kind gestures of these big players... :scared-4:
Ya lor, I have never partronised the Hor Fun stall before because it is expensive, I would rather walk further to the hawker centre if feel like eating the Hor Fun and also will not partronise the expensive herbal chicken soup stall any more since now I know that there is another place that I can get it at a cheaper price, some more it is near to my office. :ashamed1:
rattydrama
17-05-11, 21:47
Sorry, what is CM5?
5th cooling measures by MBT
5th cooling measures by MBT
Oh, thanks.
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