View Full Version : Property Market Sentiments 2012
It is time to start this yearly thread.
Just hope that this thread is a better thread with good contributions.
So far I think the predictions are mixed. Some say up some say down. For me I think it will most probably be flat, depending on how the current euro crisis develop.
:beats-me-man:
Well if its dependent on the Euro crisis, then probably it'll have slight correction coz Euro is unlikely to recover so quickly... its a long road ahead... :(
It is time to start this yearly thread.
Just hope that this thread is a better thread with good contributions.Btw thx for starting a 2012 new thread a week ahead of 2012.... Cheers! :cheers4:
Generally, property price will tend to go up in land scare singapore....unless worsen economic derail it, which i think is highly to happen in 2012...but that is IMHO
All property prices will fall to $0.
According to the Mayan Calender :not-worthy:
http://mayancalendar2012.org/mayan-calendar-2012.html
Everyone will perish :im-a-gonna-get-u: :gun3: :gun2: :gun4: :violent-shooting: :axekiller: :samurai-killa: :witches-brew: :hell-hath-no-fury: :please-die:
:scared-3: :scared-5: :scared-1: :scared-4: :scared-5: :jaw-dropping:
So fast start new thread? Heh. Wish everyone good health first. And as for predictions. I think we'll see home price flat at at the end of 2012 assuming we don't perish in December. During the year, the price may do a V shape move.
Imho, we will not see property crashing in 2012
But sentiments may get dodgy towards end 2012 though
Euro should remain cloudy throughout the year while pockets of good news coming from USA side
Not expecting anymore new CM but some fine tuning to existing ones perhaps
Commodities and equities to remain volatile while interest rate inching up, especially towards 2013
Merry Christmas to all !
2012 will be a volatile but opportunity year.
2012 will be a volatile but opportunity year.Must know when to seize the opportunity.... indeed!
Watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqN3amj6AcE&feature=player_embedded
Watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqN3amj6AcE&feature=player_embeddedThat about sums up what to expect for 2012, isn't it? :scared-3:
Mr B may be a follower of him or a trader like him.
iwantgizmos
25-12-11, 18:56
year of the Dragon... Let's all huat huat...
Yes huat huat to all irregardless of market
Yes huat huat to all irregardless of market
xiang gam tia.
bargain hunter
25-12-11, 21:04
i think stock markets will be volatile but property market won't be for 2012.
more like a slow and gradual slide for ppty mkt in 2012. boring. :sleep: :ashamed1:
Merry X'mas and a Happy New Year to all! :cheers1:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=220165qNVig&feature=player_embedded
THERE is probably no bubble in Singapore's property market, Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew said yesterday (25 Jun 2010).
The sharp price rises that have been seen are 'part of the total liquidity in the whole world system(1)', said Mr Lee, noting that interest rates are low(2), and foreigners still see properties as affordable.
'Even if we cap our excess, people in Hong Kong, Indonesia, will say, compared to what I have to pay, Singapore is cheap, let's buy it,' he added.
'And apart from landed properties, they can buy into any condos.'
1. ECB Stealth QE Euro 489 Billion Money Printing to Prevent Eurozone Banking System Collapse.
2. MoneyRates.com Interest Rate Forecast: 2011-2012
January 24th-25th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
March 13th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
April 24th-25th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
June 19th-20th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
July 31st, 2012: 0.25 percent
September 12th, 2012: 0.25 percent
October 23rd-24th, 2012: 0.25 percent
December 11th, 2012: 0.25 percent
THERE is probably no bubble in Singapore's property market, Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew said yesterday (25 Jun 2010).
The sharp price rises that have been seen are 'part of the total liquidity in the whole world system(1)', said Mr Lee, noting that interest rates are low(2), and foreigners still see properties as affordable.
'Even if we cap our excess, people in Hong Kong, Indonesia, will say, compared to what I have to pay, Singapore is cheap, let's buy it,' he added.
'And apart from landed properties, they can buy into any condos.'
1. ECB Stealth QE Euro 489 Billion Money Printing to Prevent Eurozone Banking System Collapse.
2. MoneyRates.com Interest Rate Forecast: 2011-2012
January 24th-25th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
March 13th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
April 24th-25th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
June 19th-20th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
July 31st, 2012: 0.25 percent
September 12th, 2012: 0.25 percent
October 23rd-24th, 2012: 0.25 percent
December 11th, 2012: 0.25 percent
but why will they buy your condos in singapore?
the 10% asd cold hard cash is confirmed sign-off $ for them.:cheers6:
after that,they still gotta wait another 4yrs to avoid ssd.
just too many fickle rules n regulations to follow n update..
just like our taxi system here,too many surcharges implemented constantly.
China's National Social Security fund last week spent CNY 10 billion ($1.6bn) buying domestic-listed shares, according to Shanghai Securities News.
Singapore's latest national project, Gardens by the Bay, overcame funding difficulties to reach its first milestone on Tuesday with the capping of one of its two giant conservatories, the Flower Dome.
The project faced rising construction costs when work started in 2007, leading overall cost to increase by more than 10 percent to over S$1 billion.
Think for a moment you are a PIIGS (Portugal, Italy, Ireland, Greece and Spain) with a million euro in the bank. What will you do?
Or you are an American? What will you do?
http://sg.finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=EURSGD=X#symbol=;range=my;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=;
http://sg.finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=SGD=X#symbol=;range=my;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=;
Think for a moment you are a PIIGS (Portugal, Italy, Ireland, Greece and Spain) with a million euro in the bank. What will you do?
Or you are an American? What will you do?
http://sg.finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=EURSGD=X#symbol=;range=my;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=;
http://sg.finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=SGD=X#symbol=;range=my;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_United_Kingdom_bank_rescue_package
http://sg.finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=GBPSGD%3DX#symbol=;range=my;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=;
1. ECB Stealth QE Euro 489 Billion Money Printing to Prevent Eurozone Banking System Collapse.
2. MoneyRates.com Interest Rate Forecast: 2011-2012
January 24th-25th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
March 13th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
April 24th-25th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
June 19th-20th, 2012: 0 to 0.25 percent
July 31st, 2012: 0.25 percent
September 12th, 2012: 0.25 percent
October 23rd-24th, 2012: 0.25 percent
December 11th, 2012: 0.25 percentThis is only a forecast. Anything can still go off tangent depending on how Europe works itself out of debt. Going forward, what type of mortgage is preferred? SIBOR or SOR or board rate? Lock in or no lock in? :rolleyes:
By www.MoneyMatters.sg (http://www.MoneyMatters.sg) | Property Blog (http://sg.news.yahoo.com/blogs/property-blog/) – Mon, Dec 26, 2011
http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/6A.0Pokxp5O51YyDK7q74w--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTMxMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en-SG/blogs/propertyblog/512afp_sgconstruction.jpg (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=12ts1dupp/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//media.zenfs.com/en-SG/blogs/propertyblog/512afp_sgconstruction.jpg) The additional buyers' stamp duty may be the straw that breaks the camel's back in Singapore's property market. …
By Mr. Propwise
As 2011 comes to an end (how time flies!), we polish our crystal ball, take stock of the key takeaways from some of our previous articles, and try and peer into 2012 to see what the new year will bring for the Singapore property market.
Worrying trends in 2011
In a previous article Worrying Trends in the Singapore Property Market (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=12qenekc2/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//www.propwise.sg/recent-trends-in-the-singapore-property-market/) I highlighted four disturbing trends in the Singapore market:
HDB prices are rising faster than private property prices
Private home buyers are in a cautious mood, especially in the high end segment
Developers are turning cautious too
Investors are going into industrial and commercial propertiesI think these trends are signalling that we are near a turning point in the property bull market. The insiders are turning cautious while the "man on the street" average investors are still rushing in. Middle income families are rushing to buy high-priced HDB flats and mass market residential properties and small-time investors are snapping up "shoebox" industrial units with a fairly ambiguous rental market.
At the same time the wealthy and developers (the "insiders") are turning cautious on the market, and the weakening global economic situation means that the yields of the industrial and commercial properties could be at risk. Which group do you think has a better grasp of what is going on in the market?
Property market turning point likely in 2012
The argument that we are reaching a turning point in the market is also backed up by the eight straight quarters of decelerating growth in the URA's Property Price Index till 3Q11 (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=13oburio0/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//www.propwise.sg/singapore-property-prices-still-rising-%25e2%2580%2593-but-at-a-slowing-pace/), which is likely due to concern over the slowing economy, worrying global economic situation especially with the troubles in Europe and weak growth in the US, combined with the dampening effect of the government measures.
We had previously seen this decelerating price growth trend preceding the property bear markets that began in 3Q2000 and 3Q2008 (but not the one in 3Q1996).
Property consultant and developer Getty Goh is also calling for a property bear market (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=13esh21bs/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//www.propwise.sg/property-outlook-for-the-next-few-months-%25e2%2580%2593-an-update/) based on his proprietary Ascendant Assets Indicator. To recap, the basic premises of the AAI are (1) there is a lead-lag relationship between the stock and property market and (2) we are able to tell how the property market is performing by analysing the correlation between the stock and property market.
Based on the URA's 3Q11 numbers the AAI has dropped, indicating a change in market sentiments. Simplistically speaking, we can observe that the URA PPPI index in the yellow zone after each green zone has contracted during the last two cycles (red boxes), and it is probable that it will do so going forward.
And I believe that the government's recent announcement of the Additional Buyer's Stamp Duty (ABSD) will be the straw that breaks the camel's back (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=14s688893/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//www.propwise.sg/additional-buyer%25E2%2580%2599s-stamp-duty-%25E2%2580%2593-the-straw-that-breaks-the-camel%25E2%2580%2599s-back/). The impact of the ABSD is that the transaction cost for investors will increase substantially, killing investment demand. Thus transaction volumes will fall and prices are likely to be impacted. Foreigners will shrink as a percentage of all buyers, with the impact on the high-end market larger than for the other segments.
How much will prices fall?
Beyond just the price movement, we have to worry about things like the large upcoming supply of completed private and public housing that may "flood" the market and global economic uncertainty due to the troubles in the U.S. and Europe.
So while I'm pretty confident that property prices will not increase significantly (if at all) in 2012, it is much harder to predict the amount of downside in the market. There are also supportive forces in the market, including the current low interest rate environment, and foreign investor perception of Singapore as a "safe haven" to park their money in.
Thus while we can know with some certainty what the medium term supply is going to look like, the big unknown is demand. Demand is influenced by many factors — market sentiment, unemployment levels, immigration policy of the government, etc. In fact, some analysts have argued that the upcoming surge in supply will not cause property prices to fall (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=132iafsld/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//www.propwise.sg/will-the-upcoming-supply-cause-property-prices-to-fall/). So if you're expecting prices to fall significantly, don't hold your breath as it may not happen.
Getty Goh thinks that the best-case scenario is that private property prices remain stable while non-residential property prices could still increase, but it is possible in the worst-case scenario for Singapore property prices for all sectors to tank (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=12rdtn4dd/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//www.propwise.sg/a-look-back-on-2011-and-looking-forward-to-2012/).
As I have been doing for a while, I caution all investors to study the market carefully before and do your sums (http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/SIG=13f9q69pm/EXP=1326239214/**http%3A//www.propwise.sg/how-to-calculate-your-property%25e2%2580%2599s-return-on-investment/) before committing your hard earned cash and credit to a property investment. The outlook for 2012 may seem especially uncertain, but for the well-prepared investor, it may be a year of great bargains as well!
The author in rather dramatic language talks of how ABSD will break the proverbial camel's back. But remains uncommital as to how much it will break by, and even suggesting the view of some analyst that prices may not come off.
I would think commercial and industrial should fall faster than residential, as they are usually more expensive, has lesser years of LH, lower demand due to contraction of economy next year and there is no price floor. Developers and owners holding power are much lower due to the 60 years lease.
see popwise's report
I am not sure anyone in the forum read about this "Property consultant and developer Getty Goh".
I read his book and I was laughing all the way...
My reaction to Mr Propwise' article is...
"Tell me something I don't already know." :sleep:
see popwise's report
I am not sure anyone in the forum read about this "Property consultant and developer Getty Goh".
I read his book and I was laughing all the way...Good read for comic relief or when you need some cheering up... :)
On 5 Jan, PM Lee will meet PM of Malaysia, look like something big will be announced on Iskandar...
any sharing about there?
rattydrama
28-12-11, 13:03
On 5 Jan, PM Lee will meet PM of Malaysia, look like something big will be announced on Iskandar...
any sharing about there?
ask people in the banks if there is any huge funds moving out... :D
see popwise's report
I am not sure anyone in the forum read about this "Property consultant and developer Getty Goh".
I read his book and I was laughing all the way...
What was the amusing part?
I heard gov announced 5000 EC for 2012 last nite (at the Redas dinner).
Is this confirmed ?
If yes this further enforces my view on the SG gov's post GE stand: "help Singaporeans to afford a private condo"
phantom_opera
28-12-11, 15:07
5000 units of EC is a lot of supply ... if one project average 500 units, means 10 EC projects in 1y
Let's see whether the ECs are in decent location ... otherwise no taker also
I heard gov announced 5000 EC for 2012 last nite (at the Redas dinner).
Is this confirmed ?
If yes this further enforces my view on the SG gov's post GE stand: "help Singaporeans to afford a private condo"
Its garment's very long-term plan, eventually there will not be any HDB. Not in the next 5 to 10 years, but longer-term then tat. ECs (and those DBSS) was suppose to be a infant spring-board. ECs when first launched in the 90s and after its ups and downs, had today being accepted by many people.
Did MoS mention within 1 year? KBW did not dare to last nite's function. MoS must be rather stress in front of all the developer and seated next to Mr Kwek.
5000 units of EC is a lot of supply ... if one project average 500 units, means 10 EC projects in 1y
Let's see whether the ECs are in decent location ... otherwise no taker also
EC is popular only if PCs are out of reach... and I do agree that at today's PC prices, EC is the way to bridge the gap. However, if PC prices undergo mild correction, govt's EC projects might take a big hit... 2012 is gonna be exciting... :spliff:
devilplate
28-12-11, 16:41
one fine day Mr B shall be correct.....?
one fine day....
Will you buy a EC if let say property price is coming down?
EC is popular only if PCs are out of reach... and I do agree that at today's PC prices, EC is the way to bridge the gap. However, if PC prices undergo mild correction, govt's EC projects might take a big hit... 2012 is gonna be exciting... :spliff:
devilplate
28-12-11, 16:42
Will you buy a EC if let say property price is coming down?
not even hdb bto
President of REDAS already said that the ABSD may bring about a recession that will also affect the Banks.
President of REDAS already said that the ABSD may bring about a recession that will also affect the Banks.
He is a con man. His statements tantmount to threatening the Minister.
President of REDAS already said that the ABSD may bring about a recession that will also affect the Banks.
How much does housing contribute to GDP?
I will do the same if I am in his position. He has to answer to all the developers.
He is a con man. His statements tantmount to threatening the Minister.
I heard gov announced 5000 EC for 2012 last nite (at the Redas dinner).
Is this confirmed ?
If yes this further enforces my view on the SG gov's post GE stand: "help Singaporeans to afford a private condo"
And gov also says that "Priority to be given to second-time home buyers next year".
Is there any more queuing system for applying the HDB flat or each time need to pay $10 to ballot a flat?
Will you buy a EC if let say property price is coming down?Of course not lah... :cheers1:
I will do the same if I am in his position. He has to answer to all the developers.
Recession already started before CM5. Lookout for GDP Q4.
Recession already started before CM5. Lookout for GDP Q4.
Every analyst expects a contraction in Q4, what's new ? In fact this further validates redas's point : what's the need for cm5 ?
devilplate
29-12-11, 01:01
Every analyst expects a contraction in Q4, what's new ? In fact this further validates redas's point : what's the need for cm5 ?
so tat MAS can devalue SGD(main reason)
and also politically right(collateral benefit)
CCR ppty owners suffers collateral damage
Every analyst expects a contraction in Q4, what's new ? In fact this further validates redas's point : what's the need for cm5 ?
The point is CM5 did not start off the recession as REDAS has tried to put it. Not due to slump in the property market.
devilplate
29-12-11, 01:07
The point is CM5 did not start off the recession as REDAS has tried to put it. Not due to slump in the property market.
but u cant deny the fact cm5 surely worsen the oredi bad economy
but u cant deny the fact cm5 surely worsen the oredi bad economy
That's not important now. SG property correction won't destroy the economy as much as the Euro crisis.
More importantly it's to devalue SGD like you said :hell-hath-no-fury:
and to prevent a sharper drop later when Euro goes bust.
Euro going bust is probably, like what many said, a matter of time. However, with so much funds and measures pumped in, it may take longer rather than sooner, therefore, on the back of a weakened SGD over a prolong period of time, our inflation rate will simply escalate and hit the roof in no time and that is certainly not helpful to the people...
Govt, in their bid to soften the effects of a potentially hazadous Eurocrisis, has inevitably prolonged the people's agony with high inflation rate. This round it has just hit 5,7% and has been hovering above 5% in recent times. Going forward in 2012, 6% inflation rate might be the norm if property demand is sustained, not forgetting COE quota will fall further in 2012, pushing car prices up even more... :doh:
Before any Eurocrisis hit, we're hit by our own crisis liao...
Jonathan0503
29-12-11, 08:03
How much does housing contribute to GDP?
Yesterday's report mentioned that property and related contributed 5.2% of the total GDP.
So if property market shrink by 25%, GDP will drop 1.3% which is very significant.
Yesterday's report mentioned that property and related contributed 5.2% of the total GDP.
So if property market shrink by 25%, GDP will drop 1.3% which is very significant.So how much does property prices contribute to the inflation rate?
devilplate
29-12-11, 09:25
So how much does property prices contribute to the inflation rate?
ppty px dun contribute to inflation at all....it is the rental px
and ppty rental and car px dun contribute to core inflation
so stop saying car and ppty pushing up inflation.....which is actually misleading
Uncle Kwek hasn't replenish as fast as selling in the last 2 years.
He's has his father's nose for property cycles.
It's the smaller unlisted developers/pure hi-end developers (Simon Chong) that will lobby against latest move.
Did MoS mention within 1 year? KBW did not dare to last nite's function. MoS must be rather stress in front of all the developer and seated next to Mr Kwek.
devilplate
29-12-11, 09:27
Uncle Kwek hasn't replenish as fast as selling in the last 2 years.
He's has his father's nose for property cycles.
It's the smaller unlisted developers/pure hi-end developers (Simon Chong) that will lobby against latest move.
actually latest cm5 dun really make sense rite?
might as well ban foreigner from buying :D
KBW must have got some news abt Chinese/Indians buying up condos indiscrimately...eg whole towers in Reflections, OCR, etc etc.
But core Cabinet sure want to maintain our 'open/transparent' policy to foreign capital.
I'm sure it was a tough decision to do this ABSD but again votes count and 60% mandate is kinda absolute minimum mandate. Any lower than 58% mandate really translate to loss of 5-10 seats in Parliament - which is logically unacceptable. (Play ard with the maths under our first-at-post system)
actually latest cm5 dun really make sense rite?
might as well ban foreigner from buying :D
ppty px dun contribute to inflation at all....it is the rental px
and ppty rental and car px dun contribute to core inflation
so stop saying car and ppty pushing up inflation.....which is actually misleadingThat is what I hear from radio stations about CPI and inflation rate but ok... good to learn new things... ;)
How's the rental nowadays?
Garment will say they have offers but no buyers. Recent policies are obviously fulfilling the Singapore's first motto. Resale hdb flats already have negative impact with the market flooded with BTO flats. There will be more negative impact on hdb resale market once the BTO flats are offered to second time buyers.
Of course not lah... :cheers1:
so tat MAS can devalue SGD(main reason)
and also politically right(collateral benefit)
CCR ppty owners suffers collateral damage
hey with 5000 EC coming online, BTO to 2nd timers, etc, OCR ppty owners are going to be the next collateral damage. (or rather, collateral "benefit" as most HDB owners can upgrade).
we need to manage this policy risk now.
hey with 5000 EC coming online, BTO to 2nd timers, etc, OCR ppty owners are going to be the next collateral damage. (or rather, collateral "benefit" as most HDB owners can upgrade).
we need to manage this policy risk now.
I believe EC prices are currently rising but it will be over-supplied next year. By Q2 2012, it should be quite clear whether the market is able to digest so many new launches, unsold and TOP sub-sale condos. I'm expecting sales figures to plunge from this Dec onwards. This will deter developers from putting in bids for GLS sites that are poorly located.
I believe EC prices are currently rising but it will be over-supplied next year. By Q2 2012, it should be quite clear whether the market is able to digest so many new launches, unsold and TOP sub-sale condos. I'm expecting sales figures to plunge from this Dec onwards. This will deter developers from putting in bids for GLS sites that are poorly located.
not just 'deter developers putting in bids for GLS sites that are poorly located', buyers will also be opening their eye big big - going for reasonably well located FH projects or well located LH99 projects near MRT (300to500m) stations and facilities.
not just 'deter developers putting in bids for GLS sites that are poorly located', buyers will also be opening their eye big big - going for reasonably well located FH projects or well located LH99 projects near MRT (300to500m) stations and facilities.
Yup, there is buffet of good sites next year. No hurry to bite the cherry now really. 2012 will be quite an interesting year to see the + and - factors interacting with one another.
phantom_opera
29-12-11, 16:38
EC location all cmi
devilplate
29-12-11, 16:41
oversupply story always there......got cash buffer to ride out during bad times can oredi....no worries bro/sis :D
40% DP + 3yrs buffer shd be VERY SOLID liao...wahaha
oversupply story always there......got cash buffer to ride out during bad times can oredi....no worries bro/sis :D
40% DP + 3yrs buffer shd be VERY SOLID liao...wahaha
haha... thats veri true and upto now seems no golden durian drop yet despite about 2 months of shouting. I mentioned before, i go for long term investment (not speculate, cannot after cm4), so principle is 40% DP (and 40% buffer) and take 60% loan... swee!
devilplate
29-12-11, 16:50
haha... thats veri true and upto now seems no golden durian drop yet despite about 2 months of shouting. I mentioned before, i go for long term investment (not speculate, cannot after cm4), so principle is 40% DP (and 40% buffer) and take 60% loan... swee!
wah u play so safe.....got 80% cash den buy.....wow....but i like it :D
when px crashed liao.....i on FULL gearing.....LOL......i can even sell my car last time and showhand.....wakakaka
wah u play so safe.....got 80% cash den buy.....wow....but i like it :D
when px crashed liao.....i on FULL gearing.....LOL......i can even sell my car last time and showhand.....wakakaka
you rite, i always play veri safe... and the buffer when market turn ie. price down/crash - got bullet to chiong, if price up :) ... if price dun move - back to stick to principle... now with all the cm# etc. its will jus take longer, so have to stay as 'long term' investors and hold on to all stock first... Huat Ah!!!
With out current economy, many billionaire and millionaire don't know where to park their money... :scared-3:
"Singapore's Q4 GDP grows by 3.6% on-year, contracts by 4.9% on-quarter..."
With out current economy, many billionaire and millionaire don't know where to park their money... :scared-3:
ok... and this thread gone quiet !!!
phantom_opera
13-01-12, 14:23
We have technical divergence, China-A performed poorly while Dow is strong ... what is going on :confused:
Hillier sold 300+ units liao, Nautical also selling like hotcakes ... supported by HDB UPGRADERS who can sell their flats at 900k+ :beats-me-man:
We have technical divergence, China-A performed poorly while Dow is strong ... what is going on :confused:
Hillier sold 300+ units liao, Nautical also selling like hotcakes ... supported by HDB UPGRADERS who can sell their flats at 900k+ :beats-me-man:
xiao liao la, dont tell me another bombshell(CM6) maybe on the way..who knows when...:o
xiao liao la, dont tell me another bombshell(CM6) maybe on the way..who knows when...:oIt will strike without warning... better start scouting if one is looking to buy or sell... wait kana slapped with 10% AABSD and 10% ASSD... :scared-1:
It will strike without warning... better start scouting if one is looking to buy or sell... wait kana slapped with 10% AABSD and 10% ASSD... :scared-1:
u are rite for sell(resale)...but for buy now quite uncertain so observing for 2Q to see effect fo CM5 setting in...just my humble view... :o now TCSS ..hee hee
cannot control property market like this lah....
Will not work... just release a lot of BTO and ECs and then when the price gap too big people will generaly buy EC instead of condo and that will naturally keep condo prices in check...
Isnt that better than the harsh draconian measures...
cannot control property market like this lah....
Will not work... just release a lot of BTO and ECs and then when the price gap too big people will generaly buy EC instead of condo and that will naturally keep condo prices in check...
Isnt that better than the harsh draconian measures...I also say so... just release land for EC and not for PC. Also, take in less profit for BTO and launch 20 000 units a year... sure housing market will stabalize in next 1 year. :spliff:
I also say so... just release land for EC and not for PC. Also, take in less profit for BTO and launch 20 000 units a year... sure housing market will stabalize in next 1 year. :spliff:
That Climenti land tender close, bid go to foreign developer company, 12% to 13% higher then the second bidder. This shows that foreign developer still prefer to develop here rather then build/sell else where. Of course PC land sales is selective, in this case, Climenti area very long no PC launch therefore its expecting 'pent-up demand'... breakeven about $1000/psf, selling could be...? you guess? i think up to $1300 to $1400 no problem, small size units $1500/1600 also possible...
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 12:42
only 632 PCs + 38 ECs = 670 units sold in Dec. note that all of THE HILLIER's sales have been recorded as sold in Jan 2012 and a big fat ZERO in dec.
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 12:58
Archipelago 103
Nautical 84
Palette 61
Cardiff Resi 30
Bedok Resi 28
Residences 88 25
Nottinghill Suites 22
Prime Residence 20
Arc at Tampines (EC) 18
Scotts Tower 16
Seawind 16
Waterfront Isle 13
Central Imperial 12
Austville (EC) 11
Euhabitat 10
Luxus Hills 10
Minton 10
Parc Vera 8
Woodhaven 8
Centro 7
My Manhattan 7
Boathouse 6
Floridan 6
Blossom Resi (EC) 5
Studio8 5
Terrasse 5
Thomson Grand 5
Waterview 5
Ascentia Sky 4
Goodwood Resi 4
Hillsgrove 4
Seastrand 4
Studios @ Marne 4
The Vue 4
only 632 PCs + 38 ECs = 670 units sold in Dec. note that all of THE HILLIER's sales have been recorded as sold in Jan 2012 and a big fat ZERO in dec.Jan figures may dip further... loudest indication that prices cannot tahan any more liao... :rolleyes:
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 13:06
jan figures sure chiong back to 1000+ level. hillier alone already 332 units and counting wat.
Jan figures may dip further... loudest indication that prices cannot tahan any more liao... :rolleyes:
jan figures sure chiong back to 1000+ level. hillier alone already 332 units and counting wat.Then its gonna be like the Bedok Residences that provides a very skewed picture of the housing market... Hmmm...
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 13:12
dunno why far east insisted on clearing all cheques only in 2012.
maybe:
1) books for 2011 closed liao
2) to make 2012 look good
3) boast of top selling project in jan 2012 (they could have been top seller of both dec 11 and jan 12)
or a whole host of other reasons. :)
Then its gonna be like the Bedok Residences that provides a very skewed picture of the housing market... Hmmm...
You mean the figures that is captured is based on the clearance of cheque and not the exercising of the option or the number who submitted the 5%? Hmmm... ok.
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 13:19
by right its based on "granting of options". so its likely the options are dated 1/1/2012 for those granted in dec 11.
You mean the figures that is captured is based on the clearance of cheque and not the exercising of the option or the number who submitted the 5%? Hmmm... ok.
by right its based on "granting of options". so its likely the options are dated 1/1/2012 for those granted in dec 11.Maybe that is the reason why its 2012 instead of dec 2011. :cheers1:
Archipelago 103
Nautical 84
Palette 61
Cardiff Resi 30
Bedok Resi 28
Residences 88 25
Nottinghill Suites 22
Prime Residence 20
Arc at Tampines (EC) 18
Scotts Tower 16
Seawind 16
Waterfront Isle 13
Central Imperial 12
Austville (EC) 11
Euhabitat 10
Luxus Hills 10
Minton 10
Parc Vera 8
Woodhaven 8
Centro 7
My Manhattan 7
Boathouse 6
Floridan 6
Blossom Resi (EC) 5
Studio8 5
Terrasse 5
Thomson Grand 5
Waterview 5
Ascentia Sky 4
Goodwood Resi 4
Hillsgrove 4
Seastrand 4
Studios @ Marne 4
The Vue 4
Very interesting to see some projects did better then others down the list in the month of Dec. For serious buyers whom are not really affected by CM, they must have seen its good/below value or the location compared to other projects or resales.
Very interesting to see some projects did better then others down the list in the month of Dec. For serious buyers whom are not really affected by CM, they must have seen its good/below value or the location compared to other projects or resales.Also interesting to note that last time those units whose sales figure was single digit will not be reflected but now even projects which only sold 4 units are readily reflected... :D
Also interesting to note that last time those units whose sales figure was single digit will not be reflected but now even projects which only sold 4 units are readily reflected... :D
i wonder as well, juz did not have time to check where the list came from.
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 18:32
for dec only lah. prob jan no more liao.
Also interesting to note that last time those units whose sales figure was single digit will not be reflected but now even projects which only sold 4 units are readily reflected... :D
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 18:34
i took the data from URA, put it in a spreadsheet and sort by units sold in the month to get the list. :)
i wonder as well, juz did not have time to check where the list came from.
bargain hunter
16-01-12, 18:45
nautical total 150 sold-84 sold in dec = 66 sold in jan so far
riversound 60 sold vs 0 in dec
the hillier 332 sold vs 0 in dec
these 3 alone already 458 sold after 15 jan.
EC rainforest 150 (definitely more than this no. by now) alone also already way surpassed the 38 ECs in total sold in dec.
For the year, some info from the interest and inner circle;
- price /psf will generally hold
- no drop in new launch prices
- volumn of new sales stay low and eventually pick up
- for resale movement of the +/- 5% the norm, more short term pressure in CCR
- rental hold steady due to FTs reduction not significant, less foreign buys turn to rental for time being
- HDB rentals holds and may move forward, supporting HDB resale price, balance by more BTOs released
- LH99 older resale projects in some OCR areas may face more pressure
- Longer term (4 to 5 yrs due to SSD, MOP etc.) property in Singapore remain a viable investment.
- Interest rate 2 to 3 years remain low of 1.x% to 2%
bargain hunter
30-01-12, 18:37
add watertown 700, parc rosewood 165, total already 1323. new home sales easily doubled from dec figures, question is only whether it will triple. LOL. :D
nautical total 150 sold-84 sold in dec = 66 sold in jan so far
riversound 60 sold vs 0 in dec
the hillier 332 sold vs 0 in dec
these 3 alone already 458 sold after 15 jan.
EC rainforest 150 (definitely more than this no. by now) alone also already way surpassed the 38 ECs in total sold in dec.
add watertown 700, parc rosewood 165, total already 1323. new home sales easily doubled from dec figures, question is only whether it will triple. LOL. :D
Don't want triple lah. Otherwise cm6 come sooner.
bargain hunter
31-01-12, 00:17
not within our control.
Don't want triple lah. Otherwise cm6 come sooner.
Is the year of the dragon an auspicious year to be buying a house? Why is everyone rushing out to buy one.
bargain hunter
31-01-12, 07:30
sorry ah, according to BT today:
watertown 744, parc rosewood 181, hillier 386
+ previously, 66 nautical and 60 riversound (no updates from these 2 since jan 15).
total is already 1437. we r well on our way to tripling dec sales. :ashamed1:
add watertown 700, parc rosewood 165, total already 1323. new home sales easily doubled from dec figures, question is only whether it will triple. LOL. :D
Far east champion. One company sell 1k plus units. Just give the company cm6 can cool Liao lor
Is there anymore such integrated projects launching this year?
Despite very low quantum for Parc rosewood, the figures was not as stunning compared to WT.
sorry ah, according to BT today:
watertown 744, parc rosewood 181, hillier 386
+ previously, 66 nautical and 60 riversound (no updates from these 2 since jan 15).
total is already 1437. we r well on our way to tripling dec sales. :ashamed1:
Pte condos alone could be close to 1800 units. If ECs are included, it will be over 2000 units in Jan 2012. I think it is a blip, unless Capitaland launches its Bishan project to sustain the new launch sales in Feb.
Based on my rough calculations, we have about 350k households with monthly income over $8k* in 2010. If each household only buys 1 additional condo for investment, and assuming (optimistically) 18k new units are sold every year, we can have a bull run of 19 years before every households is committed with 1 investment condo. Since 2005 (except around 2008-2009) we have property bull runs, so it is still quite some years to go before the property bubble bursts. Of course, every year there are more households with >$8k monthly income.
* 30% of $8k = $2.4k i.e. enough for monthly instalment for a 1 or 2 bedder MM.
phantom_opera
31-01-12, 09:53
Sim Lian must be laughing after high bid for Bukit Panjang integrated dev plot, same sales strategy of 60% 1br+SOHO coming soon
Sim Lian must be laughing after high bid for Bukit Panjang integrated dev plot, same sales strategy of 60% 1br+SOHO coming soon
another mixed devpt that people will hoot kao lat kao lat???...:p
I suspect only integrated projects are selling well in current market condition.
WT is indeed a unique piece of development with the integration of a Mall, MRT and waterway.
Is there anymore such integrated projects launching this year?
Despite very low quantum for Parc rosewood, the figures was not as stunning compared to WT.
Mother of integrated project.... SOUTHBEACH... should be soon after so much delay...
Don't even dare ask what price....:eek:
Mother of integrated project.... SOUTHBEACH... should be soon after so much delay...
Don't even dare ask what price....:eek:
I am waiting for the one on top of tanjong pagar MRT. Developer bought it relatively cheap at around 1kpsf ppr.
I am waiting for the one on top of tanjong pagar MRT. Developer bought it relatively cheap at around 1kpsf ppr.
Plenty of other condos in Tanjong Pager.... nothing around Southbeach... so it will be interesting to watch....:)
Watch only hor... will be super expensive even though 10yrs of the 99yrs will be up by the time you get the keys...:(
Can't find a right place to post
so place it here
Singaporean property buyers and investors have been urged to be cautious when buying property in London (http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/search?q=London+&search_select=4&search_btn=Go) amid on-going concerns they are sometimes paying too much for homes in undesirable locations.
Buyers from Southeast Asia are currently responsible for more than 40 percent of off-plan purchases in London, with Singaporeans responsible for a quarter of that figure. Many of these properties have been transacted at one of the numerous exhibitions which have taken place during the past couple of years.
Prices at these exhibitions are often what one agent described as being “full prices”, meaning units are offered without the discount that would be on offer to a British buyer. Developers understand that London is extremely popular with Singaporean property buyers (http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/overseas-property-for-sale), and as such feel no real need to offer discounts.
Some 18 months ago reports began to surface that property buyers from Southeast Asia, some of whom were from Singapore, were being misled by agents and developers. One agent, James Moss of Curzon Property Investments, was forthright in his claims. He said, “People are being ripped off because they are paying for properties that aren't actually in the best locations and are not getting the rental income they were told they were going to get by estate agents.”
Things don’t seem to have changed much since then.
Camilla Dell, Managing Partner of Black Brick Property Solutions, told PropertyGuru this week, “It is often the case that new build developments are sold on overseas road shows in the Far East before being offered on the London market. We caution investors against buying off-plan at weekend launches, especially in locations they are not familiar with. We have come across many disappointed buyers, who have bought off-plan, and then come to London, only to realise what they bought isn't what they thought it was.”
Part of the problem is location. London is a large city and those who are unfamiliar with its geography are the ones who are most likely to end up with something far less than they hoped.
Dell, who acts as a buyers’ agent in the UK capital, added, “Often developers will advertise a new development as prime Central London when the reality is very different. We have seen evidence of developers playing around with tube maps to make it look like their development is close to well-known landmarks.”
She added that some developers are offering big rental guarantees that look attractive, but in reality are masked within the asking price.”
Juliet Rawlings of Rawlings Property Consulting agreed that some rental promises are often totally unrealistic. She cited another issue with buying off-plan developments for rental returns.
“Developers tend to offer furnishing packs, so you end up with a block where the only thing a tenant can choose from is whether they like a green sofa or cream sofa. The developer is sometimes the furnisher supplier too and the quality is sometimes not great.”
Urging that potential buyers really do their homework about the location, she added, “A property in a ‘Grade C’ area may well not be worth what you paid for it, as those areas are not increasing in value. Council taxes in badly run boroughs can also be high, so when taken into account with increasing travel costs, tenants are not getting the cost savings they might have initially hoped for. You then end up with landlords getting worried and desperate, and Housing Benefit tenants move in and that immediately devalues the development."
For London properties, the management charges can be very high. This means maintenance charge and agents fees for acquiring the tenant and for helping to arrange repairs. The fees are subject to VAT (GST). It can add up to a large sum. There are also unscrupulous agents who collect rent from the tenant but never pay into landlord's account. And the tenants can also default on their payment and who is to chase them (again more fees incurred). Supposing both agent and tenant refuse to pick up the handphone then how......you have to get on the plane and fly there yourself? Think carefully before committing to overseas property when you are half way round the world. Unless you are familiar with the territory.....you can be buying yourself more problems than you expect. I am a landlord of London property for more than 20 years and although the capital gains and returns are good....but there's a lot of headaches along the way.
Good post.
If people are ready/prepared to work for it, then hopefully they invest at a suitable timing as well. Nothing worse than a 'losing headache'.
For London properties, the management charges can be very high. This means maintenance charge and agents fees for acquiring the tenant and for helping to arrange repairs. The fees are subject to VAT (GST). It can add up to a large sum. There are also unscrupulous agents who collect rent from the tenant but never pay into landlord's account. And the tenants can also default on their payment and who is to chase them (again more fees incurred). Supposing both agent and tenant refuse to pick up the handphone then how......you have to get on the plane and fly there yourself? Think carefully before committing to overseas property when you are half way round the world. Unless you are familiar with the territory.....you can be buying yourself more problems than you expect. I am a landlord of London property for more than 20 years and although the capital gains and returns are good....but there's a lot of headaches along the way.
if really keen to buy, why dont make a personal trip down to London since you are plonking at least 1m on it.... make it a two weeks holiday
watch up HK market
sign of bottoming
as Shanghai index, look like the downside risk is now limited
watch up HK market
sign of bottoming
as Shanghai index, look like the downside risk is now limited
Already go on to over-weight on equity last week ESP Asia stocks, look forward to next few months.
watch up HK market
sign of bottoming
as Shanghai index, look like the downside risk is now limited
I agree on shanghai index having perhaps limited downside. But i don't think HK is a good catch at these levels.
I agree on shanghai index having perhaps limited downside. But i don't think HK is a good catch at these levels.
Ooops, I refer to HK property market and Shanghai share market
East Lover
13-02-12, 10:41
watch up HK market
sign of bottoming
as Shanghai index, look like the downside risk is now limited
How about US market?
if i want to send my child to US for univeristy study in 6-8 years time, it's good time to invest US property now?
What's the connection between sending your child to Uni in the US and buying US property?
How about US market?
if i want to send my child to US for univeristy study in 6-8 years time, it's good time to invest US property now?
buttercarp
13-02-12, 11:41
What's the connection between sending your child to Uni in the US and buying US property?
So that the child can stay in the house without having to rent one.
So that the child can stay in the house without having to rent one.
You have to decide which university first right? I think 6-8years ahead is quite a bit of a stretch to decide.
If the intention is to invest than you go for locations with the best returns. The property market in the US is very varied from state to state, city to city, street to street.
There are many universities in the US and the university that your child goes to may not necessarily be the best place to invest even if you have decided on where you want to study now.
So that the child can stay in the house without having to rent one.
Not a good idea to buy cheap property (non investment grade) in the USA. Cost too much to maintain, need to be a bit of handyman. Singapore children+american house=ground zero disaster area. By the time u finish mowing the front yard grass, the back yard need another mowing. Better renting and destroy other people property.
Yep... agree
Not a good idea to buy cheap property (non investment grade) in the USA. Cost too much to maintain, need to be a bit of handyman. Singapore children+american house=ground zero disaster area. By the time u finish mowing the front yard grass, the back yard need another mowing. Better renting and destroy other people property.
Not a good idea to buy cheap property (non investment grade) in the USA. Cost too much to maintain, need to be a bit of handyman. Singapore children+american house=ground zero disaster area. By the time u finish mowing the front yard grass, the back yard need another mowing. Better renting and destroy other people property.
whats the problem? can send the maids there for weekend cleaning.
http://sg.news.yahoo.com/undergraduates-should-stop-being-%E2%80%98spoilt-brats%E2%80%99-.html
whats the problem? can send the maids there for weekend cleaning.
http://sg.news.yahoo.com/undergraduates-should-stop-being-%E2%80%98spoilt-brats%E2%80%99-.html
I know of one Singaporean family - both husband and wife doctors. Went to UK for sabbaticals with their young kids plus maid. The maid ran away.....big headache.
When you send yr maid over to do housekeeping for yr kid, be prepared for runaway maid. After all, there are a lot of illegals immigrants working in US.
East Lover
13-02-12, 13:30
You have to decide which university first right? I think 6-8years ahead is quite a bit of a stretch to decide.
If the intention is to invest than you go for locations with the best returns. The property market in the US is very varied from state to state, city to city, street to street.
There are many universities in the US and the university that your child goes to may not necessarily be the best place to invest even if you have decided on where you want to study now.
Not neccesary the same location.
Agreed with you. How about this?
1) Invest in place A where has higher return, accumilate $$$ for 6-8 years, as part of education fund.
2) When child goes for study, the place A's rental will be used to cover the rental in place B where the child is studying.
Not neccesary the same location.
Agreed with you. How about this?
1) Invest in place A where has higher return, accumilate $$$ for 6-8 years, as part of education fund.
2) When child goes for study, the place A's rental will be used to cover the rental in place B where the child is studying.
In 6-8 years usd and sgd will be on par (1=1). Ur children will more likely seeking a job here at home or asia region. In 6-8 years time they will be asking u why did u buy them a huge house in the USA instead of a small one bedroom condo in singapore?.
My know of some Hong Kongers' students whose parents bought condos for them during the course of their study in London. They eventually still make $ when they sell off before they leave the country. This will not work in the last few years with the drop in the value of teh Pounds and property market condition.
Not neccesary the same location.
Agreed with you. How about this?
1) Invest in place A where has higher return, accumilate $$$ for 6-8 years, as part of education fund.
2) When child goes for study, the place A's rental will be used to cover the rental in place B where the child is studying.
Ok... so I gather the primary intention is to cover kid's university education. So theoretically location A or B needn't be in the US.
My know of some Hong Kongers' students whose parents bought condos for them during the course of their study in London. They eventually still make $ when they sell off before they leave the country. This will not work in the last few years with the drop in the value of teh Pounds and property market condition.
Not just the Hong Kongers but also many Singaporeans. I think London still attractive as both an investment and higher education destination. There is LSE, Imperial...etc The "Olympic" effect is stunted by the general weak econmic sentiment, otherwise now it should be chionging sky high.
Btw, pre-1997 Hong Kong civil servants were granted PR in the UK and many are naturalised British and bought properties there. This included firemen or even admin workers. After they and their children have milked the education and social welfare system, some are looking back to Asia for more job opportunities. Some have moved back to Hong Kong whilst others have settled in Singapore with still a foot in the UK.
I have known a family in jakarta who had to sell 5 shophouses worth sgd 100k each to cover for his children education at aussie university. So they use this sgd 500k to buy a house there and spend for education. 10 years later his son come back to jakarta and find out that the properties that they sold now worth sgd 1million each. The rent itself is more than his salary.
I have known a family in jakarta who had to sell 5 shophouses worth sgd 100k each to cover for his children education at aussie university. So they use this sgd 500k to buy a house there and spend for education. 10 years later his son come back to jakarta and find out that the properties that they sold now worth sgd 1million each. The rent itself is more than his salary.
Should have stay in Aussie, why go back to jakarta after 10 years.
I have known a family in jakarta who had to sell 5 shophouses worth sgd 100k each to cover for his children education at aussie university. So they use this sgd 500k to buy a house there and spend for education. 10 years later his son come back to jakarta and find out that the properties that they sold now worth sgd 1million each. The rent itself is more than his salary.
that's inflation for you.
I have known a family in jakarta who had to sell 5 shophouses worth sgd 100k each to cover for his children education at aussie university. So they use this sgd 500k to buy a house there and spend for education. 10 years later his son come back to jakarta and find out that the properties that they sold now worth sgd 1million each. The rent itself is more than his salary.
I think it was the patriach of the Thakral group who once said that a person's money can be stolen or lost, but a person's education can never be stolen or lost.
I also have friends who have sent their kids overseas to study medicine to the tune of $500k. That was years ago.... the money if used instead to speculate on property it would surely have at least doubled. Yet they feel the money was well spent and have no regrets.
I think it was the patriach of the Thakral group who once said that a person's money can be stolen or lost, but a person's education can never be stolen or lost.
I also have friends who have sent their kids overseas to study medicine to the tune of $500k. That was years ago.... the money if used instead to speculate on property it would surely have at least doubled. Yet they feel the money was well spent and have no regrets.
Patriach of the Thakral group should say it to Steve Job and Bill Gate.
Why?
I think you are mistaken if you think either Bill Gates or Steve Jobs does not value education.
Patriach of the Thakral group should say it to Steve Job and Bill Gate.
Why?
I think you are mistaken if you think either Bill Gates or Steve Jobs does not value education.
They value education, just that they don't have the time.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF8uR6Z6KLc
Table 13 Average Annual Household Income from Work
* Per Household Member Among Resident Households by Type of Dwelling, 2011
* Per Household Member Among Resident Households by Type of Dwelling, 2011 Dollar
Highest income per individual is in the condos and apts.
HDB 1- & 2- Room ($7,463)
HDB 3-Room ($21,221)
HDB ($24,469)
4-
Room
HDB 5- Room & Executive Flats ($31,856)
Condo-miniums & Private Flats ($69,003)
Landed Properties ($57,551)
Table 9 Median Monthly Household Income from Work
Among Resident Employed Households by Type of Dwelling for 2011
HDB 1- & 2- Room ($1,492)
HDB 3-Room ($4,169)
HDB 4-Room ($6,133)
HDB 5-Room & Executive Flats ($8,788)
Condo-miniums & Private Flats ($14,669)
Landed Properties ($17,464)
Table 9 Median Monthly Household Income from Work
Among Resident Employed Households by Type of Dwelling for 2011
HDB 1- & 2- Room ($1,492)
HDB 3-Room ($4,169)
HDB 4-Room ($6,133)
HDB 5-Room & Executive Flats ($8,788)
Condo-miniums & Private Flats ($14,669)
Landed Properties ($17,464)
No joke... now I know where I stand... Lol! :cheers6:
Table 13 Average Annual Household Income from Work
* Per Household Member Among Resident Households by Type of Dwelling, 2011
* Per Household Member Among Resident Households by Type of Dwelling, 2011 Dollar
Highest income per individual is in the condos and apts.
HDB 1- & 2- Room ($7,463)
HDB 3-Room ($21,221)
HDB ($24,469)
4-
Room
HDB 5- Room & Executive Flats ($31,856)
Condo-miniums & Private Flats ($69,003)
Landed Properties ($57,551)
Landed properties may be multi-generation so if it's per household member, the number may be in favor of condo since less dependent or non-working adults in the calculations.
what are the assumptions in calculating this?
Are they referring to monthly salary or annual salary divided by 12?
Does it include employer CPF?
Allthepies
14-02-12, 19:28
what are the assumptions in calculating this?
Are they referring to monthly salary or annual salary divided by 12?
Does it include employer CPF?
I think they use annual income submitted for income tax / 12
I think they use annual income submitted for income tax / 12There is a lot more data fm dept of statistic website.
http://www.ecb.int/press/pr/date/2011/html/pr111208_1.en.html
http://www.cnbc.com/id/46366751
http://www.cnbc.com/id/46322553/
http://www.cnbc.com/id/46252167/
Table 9 Median Monthly Household Income from Work
Among Resident Employed Households by Type of Dwelling for 2011
HDB 1- & 2- Room ($1,492)
HDB 3-Room ($4,169)
HDB 4-Room ($6,133)
HDB 5-Room & Executive Flats ($8,788)
Condo-miniums & Private Flats ($14,669)
Landed Properties ($17,464)
bro, if i see in from the other side.... can i afford to stay in a landed if i am earning 17k/ mth?
As long as you have at least 600k for 20% downpayment and take a loan for say a $3mil landed property. Someone in another blog said bank can loan a person $2mil with a salary of $7K over 40 years. It should not be a problem with $17k/mth salary. It depends on your age.
bro, if i see in from the other side.... can i afford to stay in a landed if i am earning 17k/ mth?
bargain hunter
15-02-12, 12:27
SINGAPORE: Demand for new private residential properties in Singapore rose sharply in January according to data from the Urban Redevelopment Authority.
Last month, 1,872 units of new homes, excluding executive condominiums (EC) were sold - more than double the 632 units moved in December.
The top selling project in January was Watertown situated at Punggol Central, with 770 units sold.
Other star performers for the month include The Hillier, which sold 387 units, as well as Parc Rosewood with sales of 198 units.
All three projects are located in the suburban areas.
Including executive condominiums, a total of 2,077 units new homes changed hands in January.
In particular, 172 units at The Rainforest, an EC project at Choa Chu Kang Avenue 3, have been sold last month.
2k units... A lot of money is changing hands. So december was a blip?
FEO is the big winner and will spoil market for other developers haa haa.... :D
Wah lau everything so rosy, CM7 coming? scared-4:
Stock market up, COE also up....
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1184489/1/.html
COE prices end higher
By Wayne Chan | Posted: 22 February 2012 1621 hrs
SINGAPORE: Certificates of Entitlement (COE) premiums ended higher in all categories in the latest bidding exercise which ended Wednesday.
The highest increase was seen in the big car category.
It jumped S$4,299 to S$78,189.
COE premium for small cars climbed S$4,200 to S$57,009.
Meanwhile, premium for goods vehicles and buses increased S$2,203 to S$52,004.
COE price for motorcycles rose S$210 to end at S$2,012.
The open category saw an increase of S$4,199 in premium, to S$78,000.
- CNA/wk
New Property Launches, psf also up...
NUS index for Jan 2012 is out.
as expected, CCR MoM -1.9%.
however, OCR MoM +1%
so the effect of CM5 is mostly felt in CCR only
NUS also updated the list to include many newly TOPed projects. now it's more relevant to the current market.
NUS index for Jan 2012 is out.
as expected, CCR MoM -1.9%.
however, OCR MoM +1%
so the effect of CM5 is mostly felt in CCR only
NUS also updated the list to include many newly TOPed projects. now it's more relevant to the current market.
mind pasting the link? :D
NUS index for Jan 2012 is out.
as expected, CCR MoM -1.9%.
however, OCR MoM +1%
so the effect of CM5 is mostly felt in CCR only
NUS also updated the list to include many newly TOPed projects. now it's more relevant to the current market.
I am a little apprehensive about the NUS SRPI methodology of excluding all projects above 10 years old. Basically this index tracks relatively new project only. And I wonder if many newly TOPed projects are added to the index, will that skewed prices with the index's locally weighted regression model?
bargain hunter
15-03-12, 12:50
2413 condo/apt units + 725 ECs = total 3138 units sold in Feb 2012 :scared-4:
Next CM maybe 1 property per NRIC/passport only. Excess properties must be disposed off within 3 months or else pay monthly fine.
bargain hunter
15-03-12, 13:11
Parc Rosewood 380
Guillemard Edge 275
Twin Waterfalls (EC) 257
Tampines Trilliant (EC) 187
Rainforest (EC) 186
Watertown 182
Bartley Resi 174
Casa Cambio 155
Riversound 126
Minton 116
Palette 102
Hillier 90
Austville (EC) 57
Nautical 52
Thomson Grand 51
Archipelago 43
Centra Residence 36
Bedok Rei 33
Cardiff Resi 28
Treescape 25
Parc Vera 22
Waterview 22
Luxurie 21
Nottinghill Suites 21
Arc at Tampines (EC) 20
Terrasse 18
Boathouse 17
Aspen Linq 17
Suites at bukit timah 16
Blossom Resi (EC) 14
Euhabitat 14
Suites @ Paya Lebar 14
Treasure Trove 13
Greenwich 13
Seawind 11
Allthepies
15-03-12, 13:22
Next CM maybe 1 property per NRIC/passport only. Excess properties must be disposed off within 3 months or else pay monthly fine.
:scared-5:
And HDB upgraders wanting to upgrade to private will be given bonus $$$ (maybe 50% of the price) to upgrade? :doh: Then no need to have so many CMs to cool the market for them to upgrade. Everyone will be happy, next GE 100% vote for PAP :D
MM for investors n EC for self stayers... High quantum prevents large units from flying.
How about new launch prices? Are they setting new highs too? If prices are tame, KBW might not pull the CM trigger just yet.........
Top 35 sales, not a single one in CCR, not even the "mass market CCR" dleedon, am I right ?
If KBW wants to do CM again, the target should be blatantly obvious.
devilplate
15-03-12, 20:06
dun tink got anymore CMs
from wat i read, cm5 actually initiated by MAS
i just hope to see those showflat rules being implemented
hate to see developers 'cheat'
Price index is now increasing more gradually, which is what the government wants. Government is quietly revenues from land sales, stamp duties, property taxes and GST from renovations. No cause for additional CM now to crash the market.
In short, property outlook for 2012 is up up and away! ;)
Price index is now increasing more gradually, which is what the government wants. Government is quietly revenues from land sales, stamp duties, property taxes and GST from renovations. No cause for additional CM now to crash the market.
That would break the hearts of many who are on the sidelines.
In short, property outlook for 2012 is up up and away! ;)
With all the Quantitative easing (Printing Money)
first the Americans and then the Europeans, value of cash is fast becoming "worthless". Can't blame people for wanting to buy into fixed asset.
To borrow the quote of Voltaire: "paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value - zero."
The central banks of all things had to prove him right sooner rather than later.
To borrow the quote of Voltaire: "paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value - zero."
The central banks of all things had to prove him right sooner rather than later.While the value of money is shrinking, the price of oil is pushed up, along with many other things... ahh... :(
rattydrama
20-05-12, 21:52
2487 PCs + 173 ECs = 2660 units sold!
rattydrama
20-05-12, 21:53
Katong Regency 244 (needless to say)
Ripple Bay 174
Hillsta 154
Palm Isles 153
Sky Habitat 131
The Promenade @ Pelikat 106
Archipelago 91
Eon Shenton 87
The Minton 69
Thomson Grand 68
Twin Waterfalls (EC) 60
Parc Vera 54
Natura @ Hillview 51
Riversound 49
18 Woodsville 46
Tampines Trilliant (EC) 39
Seletar Park Residence 36
Nautical 36
Presto 35
Palette 35
Luxurie 34
Bartley Residences 33
Smart Suites 32
91 Marshall 27
Seahill 26
Flamingo Valley 26
Blossom Residences (EC) 25
Rainforest (EC) 24
Cradels 23
Terrasse 20
rattydrama
20-05-12, 21:57
this thread is almost dead. Hope all formers could post some major events in this thread on and off... such as MM untested ground in ocr. We could track back the date later.
Need to go to theedgesingapore to find out how of them have hdb address. I am sure garment is tracking this.
rattydrama
20-05-12, 22:17
Newbies seeking advice with 450k pa income and Mr B shouting 50% drop in ppty price coming 2015.
While a group of forumers discussing choice of eating curry fish head.. in MBS, hawker center or restaurent. Seems like its better to have choice rather than no choice and the debate continues....
bargain hunter
20-05-12, 23:14
thanks for shifting my posts here! :)
the reason why i started new threads for the monthly sales data was becoz i noticed more pple read new threads than this thread! :confused: not sure why.
so what do u guys prefer? new thread or continue in this thread for every 15th of the month? :D
this thread is almost dead. Hope all formers could post some major events in this thread on and off... such as MM untested ground in ocr. We could track back the date later.
rattydrama
21-05-12, 17:19
I noticed there are more people joining this forum then before..the old folks are quieter these days...and our fast and furious dp is gone. Hope he will be back soon.
New thread created is all because of carbuncle lah! He is having fun here! :D
Well, for me, I prefer to continue here
I noticed there are more people joining this forum then before..the old folks are quieter these days...and our fast and furious dp is gone. Hope he will be back soon.
New thread created is all because of carbuncle lah! He is having fun here! :D
Well, for me, I prefer to continue hereSo you prefer the older folks??? :rolleyes:
bargain hunter
15-06-12, 12:49
1702 PC + 355 EC = 2057 total
This thread is still alive, I believe we will see more life here real soon...
bargain hunter
15-06-12, 13:01
FLO Resi 266
1 Canberra (EC) 209
Seahill 200
Eight Riversuites 192
Ripple Bay 61
Archipelago 48
Palm Isles 48
Vibes @ Upper Serangoon 44
Tampines Trilliant (EC) 43
Twin Waterfalls (EC) 37
Natura @ Hillview 36
Hillsta 34
My Manhattan 33
Palette 31
D'Leedon 30
Nautical 29
Rainforest (EC) 29
Bartley Resi 28
The Promenade @ Pelikat 23
Parc Vera 22
Luxurie 22
Flamingo Valley 20
Arc at Tampines (EC) 17
Stellar RV 17
Minton 17
8 Bassein 16
Eon Shenton 16
Riversound 16
Seletar Park Resi 16
Terrasse 16
bargain hunter
15-06-12, 13:03
our friend requested me to post the sales data here instead of new thread mah. bros and sis, please help to keep this thread alive. :)
This thread is still alive, I believe we will see more life here real soon...
FLO Resi 266
1 Canberra (EC) 209
Seahill 200
Eight Riversuites 192
Ripple Bay 61
Archipelago 48
Palm Isles 48
Vibes @ Upper Serangoon 44
Tampines Trilliant (EC) 43
Twin Waterfalls (EC) 37
Natura @ Hillview 36
Hillsta 34
My Manhattan 33
Palette 31
D'Leedon 30
Nautical 29
Rainforest (EC) 29
Bartley Resi 28
The Promenade @ Pelikat 23
Parc Vera 22
Luxurie 22
Flamingo Valley 20
Arc at Tampines (EC) 17
Stellar RV 17
Minton 17
8 Bassein 16
Eon Shenton 16
Riversound 16
Seletar Park Resi 16
Terrasse 16
My Manhattan 33 units sold in May, in Apr only 13.
I think with all the other newer launches at higher and higher price/psf, this one next to the Mall and MRT is showing stronger take-up rate now.
good healthy sales for May... not too high.... cooling measures kept at bay I guess
good healthy sales for May... not too high.... cooling measures kept at bay I guess
If any, they will be targeting at developers
rattydrama
15-06-12, 13:48
Mostly OCR and some RCR. Its a good take up rate.
So now is Bull or Bear? :D
phantom_opera
30-08-12, 06:42
Bulls and bears both are dead
This thread is still alive, I believe we will see more life here real soon...Still pretty dead after 3 months... :rolleyes:
could start right after the go / no go signal from botak ben
We are now 2/3 through 2012.... prices seems to still be holding steady... one month up, one month down.
Low interest rate, low unemployment, high inflation, many with cash watching the market like vultures and ready to pounce... no hope for correction in 2012.
phantom_opera
30-08-12, 09:05
Pimco gross said us fed is masterful at keeping market flat just the way they want it, so both stock and bond market will see low volatility until end of year
can start a new thread for 2013?
We are now 2/3 through 2012.... prices seems to still be holding steady... one month up, one month down.
Low interest rate, low unemployment, high inflation, many with cash watching the market like vultures and ready to pounce... no hope for correction in 2012.
some banks have started to close the IT shop and move to india and south afrca.
for one bank at least 1500 staff will go b4 christmas.
so enjoy national day n brace for more rocky times ahead
Wow! So large no? Local Bank?
some banks have started to close the IT shop and move to india and south afrca.
for one bank at least 1500 staff will go b4 christmas.
so enjoy national day n brace for more rocky times ahead
some banks have started to close the IT shop and move to india and south afrca.
for one bank at least 1500 staff will go b4 christmas.
so enjoy national day n brace for more rocky times ahead
Heard from my wife that the bank she is working for is still hiring sales people. The bank is ANZ. But I'm not surprise with what you are saying, there is slowdown in business for banks.
for one bank at least 1500 staff will go b4 christmas.
1500 ? R u sure ? The only "foreign" bank that has this capacity is Citi.
I know Credit Suisse and Standchart are moving some operations and IT stuff to India. Credit Agricole is retreating from Singapore also.
But Goldman is moving his Japan ppl here; StanChart also got some Europeans here.
1500 ? R u sure ? The only "foreign" bank that has this capacity is Citi.
I know Credit Suisse and Standchart are moving some operations and IT stuff to India. Credit Agricole is retreating from Singapore also.
But Goldman is moving his Japan ppl here; StanChart also got some Europeans here.
Credit Agricole is doing a Data center reloc .
:scared-5:
Heard from my wife that the bank she is working for is still hiring sales people. The bank is ANZ. But I'm not surprise with what you are saying, there is slowdown in business for banks.
ANZ after the aquisition is still under goin harmonisation of diffent groups.
phantom_opera
30-08-12, 22:18
Don't worry, lunch time crowd in Changi City Point still as scary as ever :cheers1:
But hoh, the cost of IT operation in Singapore has reached dangerous level.
Don't worry, lunch time crowd in Changi City Point still as scary as ever :cheers1:
But hoh, the cost of IT operation in Singapore has reached dangerous level.
yup the smell of CURRY is strong in the air...:scared-1:
yup the smell of CURRY is strong in the air...:scared-1:
Bro, you are really funny. Then again, I also crack jokes about Cina-man. Guess we are Singaporean first...
for one bank at least 1500 staff will go b4 christmas.
i think i know which bank you're referring to.
yup the smell of CURRY is strong in the air...:scared-1:
With such diverst group of people, and so many highly paid people who loves curry u sometimes wonder why things are still not moving. :doh:
I chance upon a situation in the hours of 4pm. For some people tea time which is not on the official HR policy guide can take as long as an hr.
This was when I was visiting the office at Changi City area. From there I realise hmmm. looks like some cost savings plan will soon be initiated .
Allthepies
31-08-12, 07:25
at least u can do tat in private sector to weed them out. in public,pseudo-public sector there r no relocation or retrenchment. and u know who r the majority there.
NorthernStar
31-08-12, 07:40
1500 ? R u sure ? The only "foreign" bank that has this capacity is Citi.
I know Credit Suisse and Standchart are moving some operations and IT stuff to India. Credit Agricole is retreating from Singapore also.
But Goldman is moving his Japan ppl here; StanChart also got some Europeans here.
My friend from citi told me they are also moving IT to India...
My friend from citi told me they are also moving IT to India...
not sure about citi. But there are other banks moving to africa which I found strange.
looks like goin to be a jump of PR applications now n the queue to join the govt sector is going to be long.
Not just curry. Generally IT folks in Operations do take quite a lot of breaks.
phantom_opera
31-08-12, 09:11
IT in India is not that cheap any more ... it still has advantage because their English is still better than Chinese :p
Prior to the last election, civil sector job is bestest ... now all under pressure liao after many big problems surface :mad:
i think i know which bank you're referring to.
Barclays? Stand Chart? Deutsche?
I think Civil svs sector still King ...
IT in India is not that cheap any more ... it still has advantage because their English is still better than Chinese :p
Prior to the last election, civil sector job is bestest ... now all under pressure liao after many big problems surface :mad:
phantom_opera
31-08-12, 12:15
I think Civil svs sector still King ...
MAS best ...nobody can challenge them because you need to be very good economists (opposition parties nobody know lol)
I think Civil svs sector still King ...
3 prefered choice by newly minted PRs during recession period.
MOE
IDA
MOH:D
Bro, you are really funny. Then again, I also crack jokes about Cina-man. Guess we are Singaporean first...
bro in the animal world if your a lion you make fun of other lions if your a tiger you make fun of other tigers...:cheers1:
MAS best ...nobody can challenge them because you need to be very good economists (opposition parties nobody know lol)
our forum also got a lot of CHAMPION economist...:doh:....B-2015:doh:
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