View Full Version : Land Parcel at Commonwealth Avenue
any news on the tender?:D
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 14:25
should be at 5+ or 6+pm
any news on the tender?:D
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 14:28
guesses so far (in psf per plot ratio):
bargain hunter 845
Pro888 888.88
jeaprp 900 +/- 50
Ilikeu 900 to 950
kane 970
any other damn free soul, please feel free to participate. :ashamed1:
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 14:31
wheelock incorporated another 2 shell companies yesterday. wonder if they will participate.
http://info.sgx.com/webcoranncatth.nsf/VwAttachments/Att_BAD5E324D8672FFE48257B080036D65D/$file/WPSL_ANN_Subsidiaries.pdf?openelement
Colonnade and Cone
phantom_opera
05-02-13, 14:39
950psf ... 100psf above Bishan
bargain hunter 845
Pro888 888.88
jeaprp 900 +/- 50
Ilikeu 900 to 950
kane 970
leesg123 988
guesses so far (in psf per plot ratio):
bargain hunter 845
Pro888 888.88
jeaprp 900 +/- 50
Ilikeu 900 to 950
kane 970
any other damn free soul, please feel free to participate. :ashamed1:
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 15:32
added phantom. at this rate leesg is gonna win the bid. :D
bargain hunter 845
Pro888 888.88
jeaprp 900 +/- 50
Ilikeu 900 to 950
phantom 950
kane 970
leesg123 988
1
Intrepid Investments Pte Ltd, Verwood Holdings Pte. Ltd. and Hong Realty (Private) Limited
$562,818,171
2
Acresvale Investment Pte Ltd
$549,290,000
3
FCL Topaz Pte. Ltd., Far East Orchard Limited, Sekisui House, Ltd. and China Construction (South Pacific) Development Co. Pte Ltd
$541,880,000
1
Intrepid Investments Pte Ltd, Verwood Holdings Pte. Ltd. and Hong Realty (Private) Limited
$562,818,171
2
Acresvale Investment Pte Ltd
$549,290,000
3
FCL Topaz Pte. Ltd., Far East Orchard Limited, Sekisui House, Ltd. and China Construction (South Pacific) Development Co. Pte Ltd
$541,880,000
$883 psf ppr. Me very close to my prediction. :D
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 16:35
wah, only 3 bidders?! and 882,85psf. and Pro888 is indeed 888.88 zhun! :D
1
Intrepid Investments Pte Ltd, Verwood Holdings Pte. Ltd. and Hong Realty (Private) Limited
$562,818,171
2
Acresvale Investment Pte Ltd
$549,290,000
3
FCL Topaz Pte. Ltd., Far East Orchard Limited, Sekisui House, Ltd. and China Construction (South Pacific) Development Co. Pte Ltd
$541,880,000
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 16:36
so land bids did cool a bit lah. other forumers very optimistic leh. even more bullish than mr. kwek. :)
so land bids did cool a bit lah. other forumers very optimistic leh. even more bullish than mr. kwek. :)
Indeed, CM is taking some effects. From what i see, they are more selective (vicinity development) / huge quantum has to pay.
FEO gang getting in China Con. and also as their builder.
so land bids did cool a bit lah. other forumers very optimistic leh. even more bullish than mr. kwek. :)
developers focus is now on OCR property where they will be targeting on first timer.
phantom_opera
05-02-13, 16:56
Echelon II ?How about naming this The Elitist ke ke ke
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 17:05
1. Pro888 888.88 (CDL 882.85)
2. jeaprp 900 +/- 50 (Kepland 861.63)
3. bargain hunter 845 (FCL FEO 850.01)
u guys are too bullish (overbid for the "COE") hehehe:
Ilikeu 900 to 950
phantom 950
kane 970
leesg123 988
1
Intrepid Investments Pte Ltd, Verwood Holdings Pte. Ltd. and Hong Realty (Private) Limited
$562,818,171
2
Acresvale Investment Pte Ltd
$549,290,000
3
FCL Topaz Pte. Ltd., Far East Orchard Limited, Sekisui House, Ltd. and China Construction (South Pacific) Development Co. Pte Ltd
$541,880,000
we put in our guesses before CM7 mah. hahaha.
sell cheaper also good lah.
bargain hunter
05-02-13, 22:05
guess is after CM7 ok. it was last tues, after the jurong west site closed, remember? ;)
we put in our guesses before CM7 mah. hahaha.
sell cheaper also good lah.
$883 psf ppr. Me very close to my prediction. :D
Owners of Queens will be very happy!
guess is after CM7 ok. it was last tues, after the jurong west site closed, remember? ;)
totally losing track of time. was it that recent?? hahaha.
saw technically with this kind of psf, we should see about $1,300 +/- psf as the final price?
bargain hunter
06-02-13, 01:24
dream on. hong leong has an echelon to defend. ;)
totally losing track of time. was it that recent?? hahaha.
saw technically with this kind of psf, we should see about $1,300 +/- psf as the final price?
dream on. hong leong has an echelon to defend. ;)
Can't agree more. $1300 is more like breakeven price. Some more Queens just across the road, which is much older, is already transacting at $1500. And I am not even talking about mm unit.
QUEENS* STIRLING ROAD Condominium 1 1,390,000 915 Strata 1,519 Jan-13
dream on. hong leong has an echelon to defend. ;)
Quite agree. 1300 psf is more like break even price.
dream on. hong leong has an echelon to defend. ;)
They defend with such a fairly modest bid ah?
bargain hunter
06-02-13, 07:48
they will not undercut echelon prices to sell too low. at the same time, of course they won't overpay for the land lah. if echelon is 1700psf average, this one at least must be 1500psf average.
They defend with such a fairly modest bid ah?
phantom_opera
06-02-13, 08:02
what is $500m when US Feb prints 85b USD every month and Japan central bank has just joined the unlimited printing club :scared-5:
Assuming 85b USD = 100b SGD, it can buy close to 200 prime lands in Singapore in one month :rolleyes:
they will not undercut echelon prices to sell too low. at the same time, of course they won't overpay for the land lah. if echelon is 1700psf average, this one at least must be 1500psf average.
At 1500psf. Their profit margin ba-ba, can still afford to absorb absd. Heh.
They defend with such a fairly modest bid ah?
fairly modest bid doesnt = modest selling price.
Owners of Queens will be very happy!
Y very happy? its not as if the prices of bidding is way above the Queen's transacted price....and the new development is brand new...
totally losing track of time. was it that recent?? hahaha.
saw technically with this kind of psf, we should see about $1,300 +/- psf as the final price?
CDLbought the Echelon land at approx. $754 psf. Avg prices $1700 psf. Some 1-bedder touched $2,300psf mark....
fairly modest bid doesnt = modest selling price.
It will give the competitors to undercut them had they won they auction with some a few % higher bid. But wah. Didn't realise their margin for echelon was so ba ba.
Expect selling at min 16xx psf..
Will this be MMful with the new ruling?
1. Pro888 888.88 (CDL 882.85)
2. jeaprp 900 +/- 50 (Kepland 861.63)
3. bargain hunter 845 (FCL FEO 850.01)
u guys are too bullish (overbid for the "COE") hehehe:
Ilikeu 900 to 950
phantom 950
kane 970
leesg123 988
of course need to overbid CDL to win the bid...! haha...
jeaprp and bargain hunter underbid and wasted their effort! just kidding.
Capland no money to join the bid this time har?
Cm7 is taking effect.
Prime location with only 3 bids.
Quantum will be too high and unaffordable for hdb upgradders and first timers.
bargain hunter
06-02-13, 17:07
not bad leh, i think like far east. *smug look* :ashamed1:
capland busy ah, cut price selling a lot of d'leedon, not sure how is interlace sales though after the additional 10% cut. anyone knows?
of course need to overbid CDL to win the bid...! haha...
jeaprp and bargain hunter underbid and wasted their effort! just kidding.
Capland no money to join the bid this time har?
Cm7 is taking effect.
Prime location with only 3 bids.
Quantum will be too high and unaffordable for hdb upgradders and first timers.
All dare not bid until some brave souls test the market for all these plum plots.
Fraser also missing, perhaps due to their recent take over.
bargain hunter
06-02-13, 17:37
fraser is there, as usual, partnering far east seksui and now added china construction to their usual joint venture to bid. :scared-1:
Fraser also missing, perhaps due to their recent take over.
Allthepies
06-02-13, 18:13
All dare not bid until some brave souls test the market for all these plum plots.
Think all are busy playing in the stock market buying up their own shares. One construction company price rises 10% just today!
fraser is there, as usual, partnering far east seksui and now added china construction to their usual joint venture to bid. :scared-1:
sorry missed that. how come this group always like to bid project together?
whats the synergy?
Think all are busy playing in the stock market buying up their own shares. One construction company price rises 10% just today!
possible, can make money and faster turn around on the trade.
Allthepies
06-02-13, 22:01
possible, can make money and faster turn around on the trade.
Today WE holdings up 50% with 500 million shares transacted! :eek:
Today WE holdings up 50% with 500 million shares transacted! :eek:
any insider buying?
bargain hunter
07-02-13, 00:04
first it was far east/fraser with their waterfront collection at bedok reservoir. since dunno when added seksui. and now added china construction?!!!??!
sorry missed that. how come this group always like to bid project together?
whats the synergy?
sorry missed that. how come this group always like to bid project together?
whats the synergy?
just tinking only... just like if three of us pool resources, we can buy 3 PCs in diff part of sgp and spread risk. assuming we have common investment goals, we diversify risk and can ride the different waves together (eg: 1 CCR, 1 OCR and 1 whatever).
Be careful. It's difficult buying with other people. Suddenly their priorities might change. For example, family or financial circumstances. Then there will be a crisis. I had to dispose one of my props at a loss because of conflict with the other party. I also bought one of my props at a good price because the multiple owners (siblings) decided to sell when they had only just about broke even on their investment.
Be careful. It's difficult buying with other people. Suddenly their priorities might change. For example, family or financial circumstances. Then there will be a crisis. I had to dispose one of my props at a loss because of conflict with the other party. I also bought one of my props at a good price because the multiple owners (siblings) decided to sell when they had only just about broke even on their investment.
definitely agree. thats why i caveat assuming all have same investment goals (and of course economic circumstances, holding power, etc etc)...
real life example, i know of 2 sisters who bot together. one every night cannot sleep. after that sell her half to the sister (who bot at higher price and must pay stamp duty somemore). and lots of squabble over the price becoz one felt it was too high, the other felt it was too low.
Decision making will always be sub optimal when multiple parties are involved.
Not sure should we be extending our exposure to property when signal from govt is to stay on side lines for those who already own more than one prop. Perhaps we should look elsewhere and leverage on other products at this point in time. The rental yields are falling. And I anticipate might fall more as many projects are TOPing. Equities are looking attractive. PE ratios very decent for some international blue chip cos. And dividends are also decent (much more than the 3+% yield on residential prop rentals for SG prop).
If you purchase a BUC, with the DP and ABSD, and all of this not generating income for 4 years or thereabouts, you might have lost some good opportunities during these 4 years.
If you purchase a BUC, with the DP and ABSD, and all of this not generating income for 4 years or thereabouts, you might have lost some good opportunities during these 4 years.
no need 4 years, i already lost alot of good opportunity from the time i liquidated my stocks in Q4 last year to fund my purchase :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
no need 4 years, i already lost alot of good opportunity from the time i liquidated my stocks in Q4 last year to fund my purchase :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
You see my point. If you lost a lot of good opportunity in that short period so far, just think you will lose more opportunities going forward until the time your unit TOP. Since our LTV is so low, we have to put in so much cash, this cash not generating any returns for us in the meantime, is it really worth it to plough into property at this stage?
If you can leverage on 80% LTV for property it is a very different ball game from 60% or 40% LTV.
The circumstances are not the same as before.
This extra cash tied up in property cannot be used for other investments whereas before there was not so much cash tied up.
If you want to play this game, you can afford to forgo the opportunity cost of putting aside this amount of cash.
no need 4 years, i already lost alot of good opportunity from the time i liquidated my stocks in Q4 last year to fund my purchase :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
That is why i do not understand why buyer prefer new launches.
3-4years later interest rate may not be as low as now already.
That is why i do not understand why buyer prefer new launches.
3-4years later interest rate may not be as low as now already.
It is because in the past, they do not have to come up with so much CASH.
But today, they have to cough up some much cash that it doesn't make economics sense to me.
You are already down on your investment by the amount of the ABSD from the very start. And it is not a small sum hor. It is 10%. You have to hope your property appreciate by 10% quickly to square your position.
All of you guys are throwing bricks at the retail funds for imposing 5% sales charge.
For property, it is 10% sales charge. You think fair or not?
That is why i do not understand why buyer prefer new launches.
3-4years later interest rate may not be as low as now already.
in 2009, i also did not understand why pple prefer new launches. now i do, because i see them sitting on good profits. in that year, i bot a resale and collected rental for 3 yrs. it was sold in 2012.
late 2012 i entered the market again. for the record, it was on 80% LTV. this time, it was BUC, but for own stay (reason why i buy is personal reason, nothing to do with investment returns).
for this purchase, i lost some opportunity cost. but having gone thru 2008/2009, i know myself very well. what money i gain fr the skt mkt i will lose it all, so that mkt is not for me.
In 2009, we can find better deals in the resale market.
Perhaps new launches is for those who do not have time to look at resale market.
Once again, I reiterate that many players do not have the cash for the resale market. For BUC, they can pay in installments.
I believe that even now, there could be some good buys on the resale market.
Situation in 2009 was very very different. Don't look back at that boat and think you can climb on now so easily.
Now have ABSD, LTV drastically cut.
thomastansb
07-02-13, 09:33
I maintain my view that those who bought Echelon studio for rental, they will be in for a surprise.
Rental will definitely not be as good as now since rental has already peaked.
Interest will definitely not be as low as now since interest is already at its lowest and interest is creeping up slowly. About 0.2% over the last 3 months.
Echelon studio are sold mostly between 850 to 950k but the size is really small. Current rental is about 3 to 3.5k for such size and location and we know that is the maximum already.
If interest increase to a modest 2% in 2017 (my feel it is going to be 2.5 to 3%) and rental drop 10%, the landlord have to fork out cash every month. That is why I say, they are in for a surprise. If coincide with economic crisis (high chance based on economic cycle), then all the best.
That is why i do not understand why buyer prefer new launches.
3-4years later interest rate may not be as low as now already.
I maintain my view that those who bought Echelon studio for rental, they will be in for a surprise.
Rental will definitely not be as good as now since rental has already peaked.
Interest will definitely not be as low as now since interest is already at its lowest and interest is creeping up slowly. About 0.2% over the last 3 months.
Echelon studio are sold mostly between 850 to 950k but the size is really small. Current rental is about 3 to 3.5k for such size and location and we know that is the maximum already.
If interest increase to a modest 2% in 2017 (my feel it is going to be 2.5 to 3%) and rental drop 10%, the landlord have to fork out cash every month. That is why I say, they are in for a surprise. If coincide with economic crisis (high chance based on economic cycle), then all the best.
Good reminder.
Everyone seems to know this but somehow everyone just choose to put it right at the back of their minds and adopt an ostrich stance to it.
in 2009, i also did not understand why pple prefer new launches. now i do, because i see them sitting on good profits. in that year, i bot a resale and collected rental for 3 yrs. it was sold in 2012.
late 2012 i entered the market again. for the record, it was on 80% LTV. this time, it was BUC, but for own stay (reason why i buy is personal reason, nothing to do with investment returns).
for this purchase, i lost some opportunity cost. but having gone thru 2008/2009, i know myself very well. what money i gain fr the skt mkt i will lose it all, so that mkt is not for me.
Any reason why u sell and buy again? Why not stay at the previous unit? or u switch from LH to FH?? hehe
Any reason why u sell and buy again? Why not stay at the previous unit? or u switch from LH to FH?? hehe
i sold because garmen decided to build a flyover in front of my window.
as to why i bot in 2012, it was for personal reason. the new unit had attributes that i could not have found elsewhere.
i personally prefer resale units because WYSIWYG. and for investment, rental income starts immediately. you practically lose zero opportunity cost. it's a no brainer. and yes, i am not a risk taker, so i only buy what i can afford. that's why BUC theory of "no need to pay instalment" does not apply to me.
When rental market is bad and interest rate is high, it make sense to go for new launches. However, it is not the case now.
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