View Full Version : Waterfront condominium sails into troubled waters
Residents of waterfront condominium The Sail@Marina Bay have prepared a war chest to embark on a legal battle against its developer over damaged fixtures.
Yesterday, about 100 owners and residents attended a tense, six-hour Extraordinary General Meeting (EGM), where they approved up to $250,000 in management funds to be used as legal fees.
However, three other key motions to resolve the property's issues - which ranged from falling glass panels and card access security to council members allegedly misusing their power to further their careers - failed to pass.
The long-running saga hit new heights last month, when The Sail's Management Corporation Strata Title (MCST) sent three letters of demand to its developer City Developments (CDL), calling for it to rectify the alleged defects.
http://www.straitstimes.com/sites/straitstimes.com/files/imagecache/story-gallery-featured/20130908/ST_20130908_JYSAIL08C_3828071e.jpg
Price is going to drop for the Sails. This Sails and H2O give CDL bad reputation.
H2O quite rash job may turn out to be nightmare.
lol.. But you must give credit to the 3 agents.
They actually managed to secure 60% PROXY votes.
Very enterprising..
Imagine they can convince landlords to rent to them.. and they just refurbish and re-rent at service apartment rates.
I am not sure how many units DKSG pick up since the last time he spoke about it a few months back.
lol.. But you must give credit to the 3 agents.
They actually managed to secure 60% PROXY votes.
Very enterprising..
Imagine they can convince landlords to rent to them.. and they just refurbish and re-rent at service apartment rates.
is that in line with URA guidelines? to re-rent it?
I am not sure how many units DKSG pick up since the last time he spoke about it a few months back.
This news has been circulating for a while already.
Those in the know has been using this information to depress prices.
But regret to inform all of you that not many owners are prepared to accept a lower price than comparable last done.
Regardless of this (I am not vested), this development is certainly a much better buy than a Jurong Studio for $1,7xx.
DKSG
is that in line with URA guidelines? to re-rent it?
From internal sources, many owners are starting to turn against these agents and trying to get them OUT of The Sail.
More news to follow, cant reveal much here.
DKSG
This news has been circulating for a while already.
Those in the know has been using this information to depress prices.
But regret to inform all of you that not many owners are prepared to accept a lower price than comparable last done.
Regardless of this (I am not vested), this development is certainly a much better buy than a Jurong Studio for $1,7xx.
DKSG
Yes, I am aware of that as I was the one who highlighted how you like to sugar coat things with hidden agenda.
So sad for you that you didnt pick up the sail because I got the impression that you were real. what else have your pick up recently? Or should I say, what other project have you been talking recently?
As for J Gateway, its a up and coming project, the sail? Its a down and going project waiting for en bloc. like I said before, The Sail was built with $800psf budget, not $3000psf
From internal sources, many owners are starting to turn against these agents and trying to get them OUT of The Sail.
More news to follow, cant reveal much here.
DKSG
they can't do short stays cos it is against ura guidelines and to sublet they need landlord's approval. interesting, will like to see what happens next.
stalingrad
09-09-13, 09:06
You should see the comments on Sail on propertyguru.com. Not even one good comment. All comments are vitriolic and scathing.
This place is falling apart and the owners are going to lose a bundle. Basically the CBD is full of such white elephants, nice to look at from the outside but inside shit is literally under your feet and over your head.
I won't pay even $800 psf for this shitty place.
thomastansb
09-09-13, 09:44
I would say furnishing is so so but still better than many developments. It is certainly not 5 stars but it is not that crappy. At least not like you said, falling apart or shit over your head.
The attraction is not the furnishing. MBR has better furnishing so if you have the money, just get MBR. Sail attraction is its solid location and most importantly, the view is priceless.
You should see the comments on Sail on propertyguru.com. Not even one good comment. All comments are vitriolic and scathing.
This place is falling apart and the owners are going to lose a bundle. Basically the CBD is full of such white elephants, nice to look at from the outside but inside shit is literally under your feet and over your head.
I won't pay even $800 psf for this shitty place.
thomastansb
09-09-13, 09:46
I doubt Sail will get en bloc. I mean, I don't mind getting more money but seriously, I don't think so. The area is so small and there are 1.1k units. How much they can pay? 3000 psf/ppr? Selling price at what? Unless plot ratio double.
Yes, I am aware of that as I was the one who highlighted how you like to sugar coat things with hidden agenda.
So sad for you that you didnt pick up the sail because I got the impression that you were real. what else have your pick up recently? Or should I say, what other project have you been talking recently?
As for J Gateway, its a up and coming project, the sail? Its a down and going project waiting for en bloc. like I said before, The Sail was built with $800psf budget, not $3000psf
Something has to be done with those agents or fund houses who have bought multiple units of a development and wants to influence policy at AGM.
lol.. But you must give credit to the 3 agents.
They actually managed to secure 60% PROXY votes.
Very enterprising..
Imagine they can convince landlords to rent to them.. and they just refurbish and re-rent at service apartment rates.
Unfortunately, rental yield is quite poor at MBR.
I would say furnishing is so so but still better than many developments. It is certainly not 5 stars but it is not that crappy. At least not like you said, falling apart or shit over your head.
The attraction is not the furnishing. MBR has better furnishing so if you have the money, just get MBR. Sail attraction is its solid location and most importantly, the view is priceless.
stalingrad
09-09-13, 10:02
I would say furnishing is so so but still better than many developments. It is certainly not 5 stars but it is not that crappy. At least not like you said, falling apart or shit over your head.
The attraction is not the furnishing. MBR has better furnishing so if you have the money, just get MBR. Sail attraction is its solid location and most importantly, the view is priceless.
Rusty oil tanker view is priceless? I think not. The view from San Francisco high rises, devoid of rusty oil tankers, would be much better. And the prices are much lower.
thomastansb
09-09-13, 10:30
Haha.. Well, let's just take it that Sail has rusty oil tanker view then ;)
Rusty oil tanker view is priceless? I think not. The view from San Francisco high rises, devoid of rusty oil tankers, would be much better. And the prices are much lower.
evolutionx
09-09-13, 11:05
I would say furnishing is so so but still better than many developments. It is certainly not 5 stars but it is not that crappy. At least not like you said, falling apart or shit over your head.
The attraction is not the furnishing. MBR has better furnishing so if you have the money, just get MBR. Sail attraction is its solid location and most importantly, the view is priceless.
yup. i think out of all the posts i always read, you seem to think along the same lines as me.
the sail will always be about the prestige. no matter how you look at it, there will always be a certain prestige when living there, (at least, till the place literally falls apart at the seams). i am not vested there as i tend to stay away from residential (tenants tend to be fussy, and i dont have the patience to deal with bs). did pick up some commercial nearby and hopefully with all the residential properties coming up, it will improve my yields.
thomastansb
09-09-13, 13:11
I like to stay there because of its accessibility. 3 MRT lines and 1 more opening by end of this year. Weekend just walk down and drink coffee. So it fits my needs perfectly.
But I am sure some people will have different opinion like rusty tanker view but I am fine with it. There will be more residential there. V on shenton, One Marina (or something like that. The malaysia land one), robinson suites and MBS. I expect rental for residential to be very competitive but commercial wise, it should be good. Everything is shifting towards D1 area.
yup. i think out of all the posts i always read, you seem to think along the same lines as me.
the sail will always be about the prestige. no matter how you look at it, there will always be a certain prestige when living there, (at least, till the place literally falls apart at the seams). i am not vested there as i tend to stay away from residential (tenants tend to be fussy, and i dont have the patience to deal with bs). did pick up some commercial nearby and hopefully with all the residential properties coming up, it will improve my yields.
shauntanzs
09-09-13, 13:38
D1 my fav :D
yup. i think out of all the posts i always read, you seem to think along the same lines as me.
the sail will always be about the prestige. no matter how you look at it, there will always be a certain prestige when living there, (at least, till the place literally falls apart at the seams). i am not vested there as i tend to stay away from residential (tenants tend to be fussy, and i dont have the patience to deal with bs). did pick up some commercial nearby and hopefully with all the residential properties coming up, it will improve my yields.
definition of prestige is vague. Location wise is good, but the interior fittings and management are horrible for that kind of price.
For wannabe, The Sail will be perfect because people can brag about location D1 etc, for those who looking for something more private and exclusive, they will sure to look else where.
And when NDP moves to sport hub, residents at the sail will have less fireworks to enjoy.
evolutionx
09-09-13, 15:20
definition of prestige is vague. Location wise is good, but the interior fittings and management are horrible for that kind of price.
For wannabe, The Sail will be perfect because people can brag about location D1 etc, for those who looking for something more private and exclusive, they will sure to look else where.
And when NDP moves to sport hub, residents at the sail will have less fireworks to enjoy.
but that's the beauty of property.
management - can change (eventually if everyone cant stand them)
fittings - can rip out everything and replace (if you got $$$)
location wise, not so easy/cheap to change/replicate :)
and yes, the whole point about living at the sail is to tell people you are living at the sail. otherwise, yes, there probably are better places (but like you said, with less bragging rights)
but that's the beauty of property.
management - can change (eventually if everyone cant stand them)
fittings - can rip out everything and replace (if you got $$$)
location wise, not so easy/cheap to change/replicate :)
and yes, the whole point about living at the sail is to tell people you are living at the sail. otherwise, yes, there probably are better places (but like you said, with less bragging rights)
Managements are put there by the owners and if majority of the owners are only interested in short term gain then there is nothing one could do to change it.
thomastansb
09-09-13, 16:51
The interior fittings are fine actually. My standard not too high. Can use good already. I mean not top notch but they give Electrolux, Grohe etc lor.
Just want to clarify something - We are not wannabe. I just think the location and amenities fits me perfectly. 700 sq ft studio is more than enough for me (1 person living). Easily a 2 bedroom nowadays anyway. Below 900k, I find it pretty attractive as compared to 800k at Seaview previously and so I bought it for my own stay. Never regretted it.
The main attraction isn't quality (obviously). For me, I like the multiple MRT lines, starbucks, lau pa sat and banks around the area. And it is so quiet during weekends so it fits my needs perfectly. Don't think I can find something like that but that is just me and my requirements. Some don't need MRT or starbucks.
As for fireworks, doesn't matter to me. The lesser the better. Everytime got fireworks, the lifts will be over crowded. Hopefully no more fireworks. And lastly, the management sucks.
definition of prestige is vague. Location wise is good, but the interior fittings and management are horrible for that kind of price.
For wannabe, The Sail will be perfect because people can brag about location D1 etc, for those who looking for something more private and exclusive, they will sure to look else where.
And when NDP moves to sport hub, residents at the sail will have less fireworks to enjoy.
thomastansb
09-09-13, 16:53
Fittings are fine actually. I don't see a big problem with it but even if I renovate and change all fittings, 20k will be more than suffice I feel.
but that's the beauty of property.
management - can change (eventually if everyone cant stand them)
fittings - can rip out everything and replace (if you got $$$)
location wise, not so easy/cheap to change/replicate :)
and yes, the whole point about living at the sail is to tell people you are living at the sail. otherwise, yes, there probably are better places (but like you said, with less bragging rights)
http://www.straitstimes.com/archive/sunday/premium/news/story/condo-sails-troubled-waters-20130908
Condo sails into troubled waters
Owners approve $250,000 to fight developer over alleged defects
Published on Sep 08, 2013
By Joyce Lim And Charissa Yong
Residents of waterfront condominium The Sail@Marina Bay have prepared a war chest to embark on a legal battle against its developer over damaged fixtures.
Yesterday, about 100 owners and residents attended a tense, six-hour Extraordinary General Meeting (EGM), where they approved up to $250,000 in management funds to be used as legal fees.
However, three other key motions to resolve the property's issues - which ranged from falling glass panels and card access security to council members allegedly misusing their power to further their careers - failed to pass.
The long-running saga hit new heights last month, when The Sail's Management Corporation Strata Title (MCST) sent three letters of demand to its developer City Developments (CDL), calling for it to rectify the alleged defects.
Residents claim the property developer has yet to carry out any rectification work at The Sail - Singapore's tallest condominium, which has 1,100 units.
CDL confirmed that it had received the MCST's three letters. A spokesman said the MCST council had been responsible for The Sail's estate management and general upkeep since 2010.
"There were service contracts that have lapsed and repairs long overdue," he said. "There are numerous internal issues of management and maintenance against the MCST council. (Our subsidiary), having handed over the property more than three years ago, should not be dragged into their internal disputes."
Yesterday's meeting saw the condo's management council receive a mandate to take the developer to task.
Residents told The Sunday Times that barely two years after moving into their homes in 2008, numerous defects started popping up which have become almost impossible to live with.
In March 2011, they began to experience water leak issues at the lift and escalator areas.
In April this year, an underground water pipe which supplies water to one of the condo's two towers burst and cut off water supply to residents living in that tower.
"The burst pipe is a big issue," said Mr Alvin Tan, 60, a business management consultant who owns several units at The Sail. "The whole building is being compromised. The lifts were affected. There were also cracks on the glass panels of the lifts."
A 39-year-old resident, who declined to be named, said: "As an interim measure to the burst pipe, a temporary pipework connection had to be put up to supply water to the affected tower.
"This pipe runs over a path and driveway and across a postal room. It's not just unsightly, but a nuisance for people collecting their mail and a trip hazard, especially for the handicapped.
"About two weeks ago, another piece of glass shattered and fell from the glass canopy at the lobby. More than 10 such pieces have shattered in the past two years. This is seriously dangerous for people walking under it."
CDL said that the cause of the burst pipe had not been determined by the MCST.
Yesterday's motions to fit the condo's lifts with new internal finishes which are easier and cheaper to replace, as well as upgrade its security access system to encrypted card keys, were not voted through.
The Sunday Times understands that about 75 per cent of the vote share present yesterday was represented by proxy.
Yesterday's EGM also saw the failure of a motion to remove three council members accused of misusing their powers.
"They are property agents and have been subletting the units as serviced apartments," claimed Mr Tan. "This is a residential property but now we have people going in and out. It's like Geylang. I bought the units as residential units and now it's like a hotel. The Sail is located at a strategic area, but its security is a joke. Anybody can walk in.
"At the last Annual General Meeting in June, these three council members held more than 60 per cent of the proxy votes. It's a mockery for the subsidiary proprietors."
An online search showed several websites advertising short- term stays at The Sail. Under Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) guidelines on leasing and subletting of residential properties, such properties are meant for stays of six months or more.
The URA confirmed that it has received feedback that some units in The Sail are being leased for less than six months and is investigating. If investigations establish that a residential unit is being misused, the person responsible may be fined up to $200,000, imprisoned for a term of up to 12 months, or both.
[email protected]
[email protected]
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 19:03
I always see the news differently from the rest.
In particular, the agents having to take risks to defy the law and resort to subletting the units as service apartments means that the rental is weakening in CCR.
Good Luck.
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 19:09
Another point is human beings are jealous by nature and I would like owners to be aware.
In general and not referring to this case: if you have very good rental returns/good projects, people ( I let you guess who ) can be jealous and you know there will be shitty around to sabotage you.
So you need a very strong management council made up of real strong owners.
Good Luck.
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 19:17
I am THE KING OF REAL ESTATE. Any project I go, I can lift up the rental subtaintially through my business MNC networks.I can help the owners in those projects secure very good rental returns. ( I AM NOT A PROPERTY AGENT HOR )
The Managing Agents will also become kittens and kuai kuai listen to me and do their jobs. ( Because of my BILLIONAIRE FAMILY background & networks )
Any project I leave can say BYE BYE to good rental returns.
WATCH THIS SPACE and I will reveal to you where my next targets are.
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 19:33
All boast and no action proves nothing.
Because now I have not park in the various projects properly yet ( because of the ABSD is giving me a big headache ), I will pick one example project with poor rental and show you how I am able to secure a rental 2x her current transacted rental in the market.
But that have to be in October or after because the sales completion of this project I just bought is in October and the current tenancy will only end in Jan 2014.
Good Luck.
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 19:35
In 2008, I told the owners in Robertson 100 and Vida the same thing. And the agents and owners laughed at me. Now they are asking me to go back.
Too late liao, who ask them to laugh at me like some of you guys here last time?
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 19:45
Any projects I go, my business associates will set up support structures like medical services, food, restaurants, childcares, supermarkets etc... for my tenants. That is one of the reasons why I have an edge over the rest of the investors.
I AM THE KING, THE LION, THE THIRD EYE.
Good Luck.
http://www.straitstimes.com/archive/sunday/premium/news/story/condo-sails-troubled-waters-20130908
Condo sails into troubled waters
Owners approve $250,000 to fight developer over alleged defects
Published on Sep 08, 2013
By Joyce Lim And Charissa Yong
Residents of waterfront condominium The Sail@Marina Bay have prepared a war chest to embark on a legal battle against its developer over damaged fixtures.
Yesterday, about 100 owners and residents attended a tense, six-hour Extraordinary General Meeting (EGM), where they approved up to $250,000 in management funds to be used as legal fees.
However, three other key motions to resolve the property's issues - which ranged from falling glass panels and card access security to council members allegedly misusing their power to further their careers - failed to pass.
The long-running saga hit new heights last month, when The Sail's Management Corporation Strata Title (MCST) sent three letters of demand to its developer City Developments (CDL), calling for it to rectify the alleged defects.
Residents claim the property developer has yet to carry out any rectification work at The Sail - Singapore's tallest condominium, which has 1,100 units.
CDL confirmed that it had received the MCST's three letters. A spokesman said the MCST council had been responsible for The Sail's estate management and general upkeep since 2010.
"There were service contracts that have lapsed and repairs long overdue," he said. "There are numerous internal issues of management and maintenance against the MCST council. (Our subsidiary), having handed over the property more than three years ago, should not be dragged into their internal disputes."
Yesterday's meeting saw the condo's management council receive a mandate to take the developer to task.
Residents told The Sunday Times that barely two years after moving into their homes in 2008, numerous defects started popping up which have become almost impossible to live with.
In March 2011, they began to experience water leak issues at the lift and escalator areas.
In April this year, an underground water pipe which supplies water to one of the condo's two towers burst and cut off water supply to residents living in that tower.
"The burst pipe is a big issue," said Mr Alvin Tan, 60, a business management consultant who owns several units at The Sail. "The whole building is being compromised. The lifts were affected. There were also cracks on the glass panels of the lifts."
A 39-year-old resident, who declined to be named, said: "As an interim measure to the burst pipe, a temporary pipework connection had to be put up to supply water to the affected tower.
"This pipe runs over a path and driveway and across a postal room. It's not just unsightly, but a nuisance for people collecting their mail and a trip hazard, especially for the handicapped.
"About two weeks ago, another piece of glass shattered and fell from the glass canopy at the lobby. More than 10 such pieces have shattered in the past two years. This is seriously dangerous for people walking under it."
CDL said that the cause of the burst pipe had not been determined by the MCST.
Yesterday's motions to fit the condo's lifts with new internal finishes which are easier and cheaper to replace, as well as upgrade its security access system to encrypted card keys, were not voted through.
The Sunday Times understands that about 75 per cent of the vote share present yesterday was represented by proxy.
Yesterday's EGM also saw the failure of a motion to remove three council members accused of misusing their powers.
"They are property agents and have been subletting the units as serviced apartments," claimed Mr Tan. "This is a residential property but now we have people going in and out. It's like Geylang. I bought the units as residential units and now it's like a hotel. The Sail is located at a strategic area, but its security is a joke. Anybody can walk in.
"At the last Annual General Meeting in June, these three council members held more than 60 per cent of the proxy votes. It's a mockery for the subsidiary proprietors."
An online search showed several websites advertising short- term stays at The Sail. Under Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) guidelines on leasing and subletting of residential properties, such properties are meant for stays of six months or more.
The URA confirmed that it has received feedback that some units in The Sail are being leased for less than six months and is investigating. If investigations establish that a residential unit is being misused, the person responsible may be fined up to $200,000, imprisoned for a term of up to 12 months, or both.
[email protected]
[email protected]
Glass fall is indeed very dangerous. The Sails got many glass people might one day get killed. Life is more important. Don't really care about view or near mrt so what if it got good location life is number one priority.
Another important thing to note about the sails at marina bay is this project TOP in 2008 only 5yrs already so many glass panels fell, if leave it another 10yrs likely whole building might goes shatter. Better avoid this project for your own safety and your family. Maintenance fee will rocket high in near future.
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 21:46
Another important thing to note about the sails at marina bay is this project TOP in 2008 only 5yrs already so many glass panels fell, if leave it another 10yrs likely whole building might goes shatter. Better avoid this project for your own safety and your family. Maintenance fee will rocket high in near future.
How come so many glasses fell never reported in newspaper? Or did I miss those news?
:scared-5:
blackjack21trader
09-09-13, 21:47
Glass fall is indeed very dangerous. The Sails got many glass people might one day get killed. Life is more important. Don't really care about view or near mrt so what if it got good location life is number one priority.
Very good point. Safety comes first :)
How come so many glasses fell never reported in newspaper? Or did I miss those news?
:scared-5:
Bro BJ, go and read about it on the strait times on sunday, september 8, page 21.
1) 1,100 units in 1 estate! What do you expect? Wear & tear faster than they can repair!
2) I already warned in 2009/2010 about those condos where walls are totally glasses! People buy at their own risk!
3) What security can you talk about when there is no fence around the estate, and any tom, dick and harry can walk in and anybody can drive into their car park? :doh:
http://www.straitstimes.com/archive/sunday/premium/news/story/condo-sails-troubled-waters-20130908
Condo sails into troubled waters
Owners approve $250,000 to fight developer over alleged defects
Published on Sep 08, 2013
By Joyce Lim And Charissa Yong
Residents of waterfront condominium The Sail@Marina Bay have prepared a war chest to embark on a legal battle against its developer over damaged fixtures.
Yesterday, about 100 owners and residents attended a tense, six-hour Extraordinary General Meeting (EGM), where they approved up to $250,000 in management funds to be used as legal fees.
However, three other key motions to resolve the property's issues - which ranged from falling glass panels and card access security to council members allegedly misusing their power to further their careers - failed to pass.
The long-running saga hit new heights last month, when The Sail's Management Corporation Strata Title (MCST) sent three letters of demand to its developer City Developments (CDL), calling for it to rectify the alleged defects.
Residents claim the property developer has yet to carry out any rectification work at The Sail - Singapore's tallest condominium, which has 1,100 units.
CDL confirmed that it had received the MCST's three letters. A spokesman said the MCST council had been responsible for The Sail's estate management and general upkeep since 2010.
"There were service contracts that have lapsed and repairs long overdue," he said. "There are numerous internal issues of management and maintenance against the MCST council. (Our subsidiary), having handed over the property more than three years ago, should not be dragged into their internal disputes."
Yesterday's meeting saw the condo's management council receive a mandate to take the developer to task.
Residents told The Sunday Times that barely two years after moving into their homes in 2008, numerous defects started popping up which have become almost impossible to live with.
In March 2011, they began to experience water leak issues at the lift and escalator areas.
In April this year, an underground water pipe which supplies water to one of the condo's two towers burst and cut off water supply to residents living in that tower.
"The burst pipe is a big issue," said Mr Alvin Tan, 60, a business management consultant who owns several units at The Sail. "The whole building is being compromised. The lifts were affected. There were also cracks on the glass panels of the lifts."
A 39-year-old resident, who declined to be named, said: "As an interim measure to the burst pipe, a temporary pipework connection had to be put up to supply water to the affected tower.
"This pipe runs over a path and driveway and across a postal room. It's not just unsightly, but a nuisance for people collecting their mail and a trip hazard, especially for the handicapped.
"About two weeks ago, another piece of glass shattered and fell from the glass canopy at the lobby. More than 10 such pieces have shattered in the past two years. This is seriously dangerous for people walking under it."
CDL said that the cause of the burst pipe had not been determined by the MCST.
Yesterday's motions to fit the condo's lifts with new internal finishes which are easier and cheaper to replace, as well as upgrade its security access system to encrypted card keys, were not voted through.
The Sunday Times understands that about 75 per cent of the vote share present yesterday was represented by proxy.
Yesterday's EGM also saw the failure of a motion to remove three council members accused of misusing their powers.
"They are property agents and have been subletting the units as serviced apartments," claimed Mr Tan. "This is a residential property but now we have people going in and out. It's like Geylang. I bought the units as residential units and now it's like a hotel. The Sail is located at a strategic area, but its security is a joke. Anybody can walk in.
"At the last Annual General Meeting in June, these three council members held more than 60 per cent of the proxy votes. It's a mockery for the subsidiary proprietors."
An online search showed several websites advertising short- term stays at The Sail. Under Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) guidelines on leasing and subletting of residential properties, such properties are meant for stays of six months or more.
The URA confirmed that it has received feedback that some units in The Sail are being leased for less than six months and is investigating. If investigations establish that a residential unit is being misused, the person responsible may be fined up to $200,000, imprisoned for a term of up to 12 months, or both.
[email protected]
[email protected]
proud owner
09-09-13, 23:58
1) 1,100 units in 1 estate! What do you expect? Wear & tear faster than they can repair!
2) I already warned in 2009/2010 about those condos where walls are totally glasses! People buy at their own risk!
3) What security can you talk about when there is no fence around the estate, and any tom, dick and harry can walk in and anybody can drive into their car park? :doh:
bro
I don't think being all glass is an issue... where I live in Manhattan ...so many full glassed buildings ... no such problem
I suspect its the weekly fireworks.... constant pounding by sound waves ...
thomastansb
09-09-13, 23:59
Not falling glasses. It is things that were dropped down and shattered the glass roof top.
How come so many glasses fell never reported in newspaper? Or did I miss those news?
:scared-5:
thomastansb
10-09-13, 00:02
Yup, security is a big concern. I don't like the lobby and carpark being opened to the public.
The lobby should be locked but then again, many condos have open carpark concept as well.
The wear and tear is similar to other condos IMO. 5 years old, so reasonable damage. But after it is damage, some of the things don't get fixed. That is the problem.
1) 1,100 units in 1 estate! What do you expect? Wear & tear faster than they can repair!
2) I already warned in 2009/2010 about those condos where walls are totally glasses! People buy at their own risk!
3) What security can you talk about when there is no fence around the estate, and any tom, dick and harry can walk in and anybody can drive into their car park? :doh:
dont worry, there will always be suckers who go for brand (D1) rather than substance.
But there is always hope for En bloc (IF) URA could increase the plot ratio after PLAB move out. But that might not happen for another 20 to 30 years.
darkseed73
10-09-13, 11:50
Yup, security is a big concern. I don't like the lobby and carpark being opened to the public.
The lobby should be locked but then again, many condos have open carpark concept as well.
The wear and tear is similar to other condos IMO. 5 years old, so reasonable damage. But after it is damage, some of the things don't get fixed. That is the problem.
Sorry, I am dumb - why sue CDL? the 1 year warranty period is over right? What does the resident expect CDL to do? I am confused by the sue CDL part.
Sorry, I am dumb - why sue CDL? the 1 year warranty period is over right? What does the resident expect CDL to do? I am confused by the sue CDL part.
structure is usually 5 years. 1 year is for appliances
isnt there only 2 residential projects that have full bayview?
no more additional supply coming up.
if sail enbloc, wouldn't owner have first choice to select the units?
even if plot ratio dont increase. developer can do the following.
1) balcony is ridiculously small, after enbloc, "normal size" balcony will give additional 10% free gfa for developer.
2) also sail no double volume void space, after enbloc, void space will give additional 30% (or more) free gfa for developer.
3) the ac ledge is ridiculously small, after enbloc, "normal size" ac ledge additional 10% free gfa for developer.
thomastansb
10-09-13, 16:22
There is no brand. Just convenience. Where in Singapore you can find 4 MRT lines? As I said, it fits my lifestyle perfectly. Weekend go down lim kopi or jog to barrage and back.
dont worry, there will always be suckers who go for brand (D1) rather than substance.
But there is always hope for En bloc (IF) URA could increase the plot ratio after PLAB move out. But that might not happen for another 20 to 30 years.
darkseed73
10-09-13, 16:36
structure is usually 5 years. 1 year is for appliances
I didn't know the sail have structural issues.
From what have being posted, it seems to be broken things are not fixed. Do MCST have to fix, amend or CDL have to send ppl in to fix - why must go to courts. Did CDL deny all responsibilties? Can any resident enlighten?
....Did CDL deny all responsibilties? Can any resident enlighten?
huh? face-2-palm.
if accept responsibilities, CDL has to come out with money la.
if dont accept responsibilities, then CDL no need to come out with money.
thomastansb
10-09-13, 17:08
If there are structural issues, BCA would have chased all of us out. There isn't any structural issues. Just many things unfixed. Actually the very first AGM, there are tons of things unresolved. CDL say they will fix but didn't. Then drag from 2009 till now. People go to court because we think it is CDL problem but CDL don't want to pay extra.
I didn't know the sail have structural issues.
From what have being posted, it seems to be broken things are not fixed. Do MCST have to fix, amend or CDL have to send ppl in to fix - why must go to courts. Did CDL deny all responsibilties? Can any resident enlighten?
darkseed73
10-09-13, 17:21
If there are structural issues, BCA would have chased all of us out. There isn't any structural issues. Just many things unfixed. Actually the very first AGM, there are tons of things unresolved. CDL say they will fix but didn't. Then drag from 2009 till now. People go to court because we think it is CDL problem but CDL don't want to pay extra.
Thanks Thomastansb.
I read the Sail issues with great interest becos my office and gym is near there but didn't want to live near it....becos don't want to restrict my life in CBD lol
I go fitness first and always see the Sail when I gym.
It looks real fine from the outside, didn't expect it to have "lots of issue" but thanks for your response. It seems it's an issue which drag from 2009 till now, not really structural and hopefully your MCST has records that CDL promise to fix, else they may deny that they already done their due.
Good luck on this guys.
"In the event that latent defects are observed beyond the one-year defects liability period, purchasers can still take civil action against the developer, said a spokesman from the Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA). "Beyond the one-year defects liability period, purchasers can still take civil action against the developer for latent defects due to negligence or breach of contract, within six years from the date that the damage arose, or three years from the date that the damage was discovered, whichever is later."
However, developers should first be given an opportunity to rectify any genuine building defect, whether patent or latent, that the purchasers claim the developers are liable for."
SOURCE:
http://www.stproperty.sg/articles-property/singapore-property-news/buyers-rights-in-building-defect-disputes/a/102830
If need to set aside $250k for lawyer fees and yet can't fix all those problems, means it costs MUCH MUCH more than $250k to fix all those problem? Mmm...., looks like BIG PROBLEM indeed!
Let's say The Sail's MCST lose the law suit, have to come out with another $Million or more to fix the problems and lose another $250k on lawyer fees + may have to pay CDL costs for their legal fees? :scared-1:
If there are structural issues, BCA would have chased all of us out. There isn't any structural issues. Just many things unfixed. Actually the very first AGM, there are tons of things unresolved. CDL say they will fix but didn't. Then drag from 2009 till now. People go to court because we think it is CDL problem but CDL don't want to pay extra.
Oh is it? Strange, the straits times article below says it is glass shattering and falling down.
Not falling glasses. It is things that were dropped down and shattered the glass roof top.
Condo sails into troubled waters
Tuesday, Sep 10, 2013
Joyce Lim
Charissa Yong
The Sunday Times
SINGAPORE - Residents of waterfront condominium The Sail@Marina Bay have prepared a war chest to embark on a legal battle against its developer over damaged fixtures.
On Saturday, about 100 owners and residents attended a tense, six-hour Extraordinary General Meeting (EGM), where they approved up to $250,000 in management funds to be used as legal fees.
However, three other key motions to resolve the property's issues - which ranged from falling glass panels and card access security to council members allegedly misusing their power to further their careers - failed to pass.
The long-running saga hit new heights last month, when The Sail's Management Corporation Strata Title (MCST) sent three letters of demand to its developer City Developments (CDL), calling for it to rectify the alleged defects.
Residents claim the property developer has yet to carry out any rectification work at The Sail - Singapore's tallest condominium, which has 1,100 units.
CDL confirmed that it had received the MCST's three letters. A spokesman said the MCST council had been responsible for The Sail's estate management and general upkeep since 2010.
"There were service contracts that have lapsed and repairs long overdue," he said. "There are numerous internal issues of management and maintenance against the MCST council. (Our subsidiary), having handed over the property more than three years ago, should not be dragged into their internal disputes."
Saturday's meeting saw the condo's management council receive a mandate to take the developer to task.
Residents told The Sunday Times that barely two years after moving into their homes in 2008, numerous defects started popping up which have become almost impossible to live with.
In March 2011, they began to experience water leak issues at the lift and escalator areas.
In April this year, an underground water pipe which supplies water to one of the condo's two towers burst and cut off water supply to residents living in that tower.
"The burst pipe is a big issue," said Mr Alvin Tan, 60, a business management consultant who owns several units at The Sail. "The whole building is being compromised. The lifts were affected. There were also cracks on the glass panels of the lifts."
A 39-year-old resident, who declined to be named, said: "As an interim measure to the burst pipe, a temporary pipework connection had to be put up to supply water to the affected tower.
"This pipe runs over a path and driveway and across a postal room. It's not just unsightly, but a nuisance for people collecting their mail and a trip hazard, especially for the handicapped.
"About two weeks ago, another piece of glass shattered and fell from the glass canopy at the lobby. More than 10 such pieces have shattered in the past two years. This is seriously dangerous for people walking under it."
CDL said that the cause of the burst pipe had not been determined by the MCST.
Yesterday's motions to fit the condo's lifts with new internal finishes which are easier and cheaper to replace, as well as upgrade its security access system to encrypted card keys, were not voted through.
The Sunday Times understands that about 75 per cent of the vote share present on Saturday was represented by proxy.
Yesterday's EGM also saw the failure of a motion to remove three council members accused of misusing their powers.
"They are property agents and have been subletting the units as serviced apartments," claimed Mr Tan. "This is a residential property but now we have people going in and out. It's like Geylang. I bought the units as residential units and now it's like a hotel. The Sail is located at a strategic area, but its security is a joke. Anybody can walk in.
"At the last Annual General Meeting in June, these three council members held more than 60 per cent of the proxy votes. It's a mockery for the subsidiary proprietors."
An online search showed several websites advertising short- term stays at The Sail. Under Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) guidelines on leasing and subletting of residential properties, such properties are meant for stays of six months or more.
The URA confirmed that it has received feedback that some units in The Sail are being leased for less than six months and is investigating. If investigations establish that a residential unit is being misused, the person responsible may be fined up to $200,000, imprisoned for a term of up to 12 months, or both.
[email protected]
[email protected]
If it is really due to fireworks, why we don't see The Sail's neighbouring building has so many of their glasses shattering and falling down but only The Sail?
As to why Manhattan no such problem, it could be more due to better quality of glasses used and better skilled worksmanship?
bro
I don't think being all glass is an issue... where I live in Manhattan ...so many full glassed buildings ... no such problem
I suspect its the weekly fireworks.... constant pounding by sound waves ...
Very unlikely they will lose - i m sure they must have hired an expert to check n verify that defects exist otherwise they wouldn't take the case to court
In fact the court hearing will be an eye opener as then many people will be aware of the "cut corners attitude" that contractors and developers take....
If need to set aside $250k for lawyer fees and yet can't fix all those problems, means it costs MUCH MUCH more than $250k to fix all those problem? Mmm...., looks like BIG PROBLEM indeed!
Let's say The Sail's MCST lose the law suit, have to come out with another $Million or more to fix the problems and lose another $250k on lawyer fees + may have to pay CDL costs for their legal fees? :scared-1:
There is no guarantee. The Sail's MCST may lose if:
1) Their expert is not as expert as those engaged by CDL.
2) Their lawyer is not as good as CDL.
3) Defects/flaws/etc many are grey areas, and many you cannot concretely pinpoint to the real cause of the problem, e.g. use thinner pipes cause burst or something sabotage? How to define using poorer quality pipes vs using good quality expensive pipes? There is no contract saying you must use better quality materials right? What about poor workmanship and warranty period already over?
4) What else???
Very unlikely they will lose - i m sure they must have hired an expert to check n verify that defects exist otherwise they wouldn't take the case to court
In fact the court hearing will be an eye opener as then many people will be aware of the "cut corners attitude" that contractors and developers take....
There is no guarantee. The Sail's MCST may lose if:
1) Their expert is not as expert as those engaged by CDL.
2) Their lawyer is not as good as CDL.
3) Defects/flaws/etc many are grey areas, and many you cannot concretely pinpoint to the real cause of the problem, e.g. use thinner pipes cause burst or something sabotage? How to define using poorer quality pipes vs using good quality expensive pipes? There is no contract saying you must use better quality materials right? What about poor workmanship and warranty period already over?
4) What else???
If owner sure win, will cdl go court??? Or will they settle this out of court???
URA. "Beyond the one-year defects liability period, purchasers can still take civil action against the developer for latent defects due to negligence or breach of contract, within six years from the date that the damage arose, or three years from the date that the damage was discovered, whichever is later."
There is no guarantee. The Sail's MCST may lose if:
1) Their expert is not as expert as those engaged by CDL.
2) Their lawyer is not as good as CDL.
3) Defects/flaws/etc many are grey areas, and many you cannot concretely pinpoint to the real cause of the problem, e.g. use thinner pipes cause burst or something sabotage? How to define using poorer quality pipes vs using good quality expensive pipes? There is no contract saying you must use better quality materials right? What about poor workmanship and warranty period already over?
4) What else???
So, The Sail's MCST has to prove that the defects is "latent defects due to negligence or breach of contract" of CDL. Is it that easy to prove?
URA. "Beyond the one-year defects liability period, purchasers can still take civil action against the developer for latent defects due to negligence or breach of contract, within six years from the date that the damage arose, or three years from the date that the damage was discovered, whichever is later."
There is no guarantee. The Sail's MCST may lose if:
1) Their expert is not as expert as those engaged by CDL.
2) Their lawyer is not as good as CDL.
3) Defects/flaws/etc many are grey areas, and many you cannot concretely pinpoint to the real cause of the problem, e.g. use thinner pipes cause burst or something sabotage? How to define using poorer quality pipes vs using good quality expensive pipes? There is no contract saying you must use better quality materials right? What about poor workmanship and warranty period already over?
4) What else???
The judge don't think like layman;They don't know what is hardship. They always stay within four walls, and need not walk at the compound of Sail!
proud owner
10-09-13, 21:55
If it is really due to fireworks, why we don't see The Sail's neighbouring building has so many of their glasses shattering and falling down but only The Sail?
As to why Manhattan no such problem, it could be more due to better quality of glasses used and better skilled worksmanship?
I have given this some thoughts..
in US ..all new apt windows open inward.. and probably 10 deg wide only ..
at the widest part, an infant head cant go through..thats for safety reasons.
I live on 31st flr... unblock view from 8th ave to Hudson river.. the wind is super strong.. sometimes.. it takes 2 adults to push the window before we could lock it...
I think in spore.. windows open outward.. and can open Beyond 90 deg..
Sail being high rise ... theres a chance windows are left open max .. and on a day with strong wind .... it could open beyond 90 deg... and damaging the window frame and joints..
as to the surrounding office buildings..no such problems ... they don't have windows and even there are ..they don't open them .. hence less chance of damages
I have given this some thoughts..
in US ..all new apt windows open inward.. and probably 10 deg wide only ..
at the widest part, an infant head cant go through..thats for safety reasons.
I live on 31st flr... unblock view from 8th ave to Hudson river.. the wind is super strong.. sometimes.. it takes 2 adults to push the window before we could lock it...
I think in spore.. windows open outward.. and can open Beyond 90 deg..
Sail being high rise ... theres a chance windows are left open max .. and on a day with strong wind .... it could open beyond 90 deg... and damaging the window frame and joints..
as to the surrounding office buildings..no such problems ... they don't have windows and even there are ..they don't open them .. hence less chance of damages
Can't commend for the majority of condos here, however my 2 condos are both above 30flr, one is using sliding windows and another, just like you have mentioned, can only open 10deg outwards. My take is safety aspects should have taken into consideration in signapore condo design for approval.
proud owner
10-09-13, 22:34
Can't commend for the majority of condos here, however my 2 condos are both above 30flr, one is using sliding windows and another, just like you have mentioned, can only open 10deg outwards. My take is safety aspects should have taken into consideration in signapore condo design for approval.
when I first moved to Manhattan ..I was like "WTF" ...why the window opens inward and only this wide...
after winter came... I really appreciate the design..
for one thing... you really don't want to stick your arms out at -15 deg Celsius to pull the windows back in ...
thomastansb
10-09-13, 23:38
You believe me (a resident) or someone (reporter) who doesn't stay there?
Oh is it? Strange, the straits times article below says it is glass shattering and falling down.
those agents too cowboy, try to maximise yield and didn't even realise there's this short stay clause.
when I first moved to Manhattan ..I was like "WTF" ...why the window opens inward and only this wide...
after winter came... I really appreciate the design..
for one thing... you really don't want to stick your arms out at -15 deg Celsius to pull the windows back in ...
do u have to close the windows when it rains? since it will drip inside?
Have a high floor condo apt in singapore which has similar feature that prevents window from opening beyond certain angle. It is quite common in new condos here too.
I have given this some thoughts..
in US ..all new apt windows open inward.. and probably 10 deg wide only ..
at the widest part, an infant head cant go through..thats for safety reasons.
I live on 31st flr... unblock view from 8th ave to Hudson river.. the wind is super strong.. sometimes.. it takes 2 adults to push the window before we could lock it...
I think in spore.. windows open outward.. and can open Beyond 90 deg..
Sail being high rise ... theres a chance windows are left open max .. and on a day with strong wind .... it could open beyond 90 deg... and damaging the window frame and joints..
as to the surrounding office buildings..no such problems ... they don't have windows and even there are ..they don't open them .. hence less chance of damages
Since you are a residence of The Sail, can you confirm if all The Sail's windows open inward.. and probably 10-20 deg wide only ..
at the widest part, an infant head cant go through..thats for safety reason
I thought condo nowaday all has this design? no?
You believe me (a resident) or someone (reporter) who doesn't stay there?
thomastansb
11-09-13, 10:05
The windows open outwards. Not inwards. You have to push it outwards and it will lock into position.
At opened position, the gap is about 15 to 20cm. Maybe the infant can still drop down since 20cm is quite a gap. But I don't think it is an issue. I mean look at HDB windows. They can open very wide and an infant will die by dropping from 2nd floor. You don't need an infant to drop from 15 floors to die. Not all condo have this design. It depends. Newer condos that are 20 floors high have 90 degrees opening or even more.
Since you are a residence of The Sail, can you confirm if all The Sail's windows open inward.. and probably 10-20 deg wide only ..
at the widest part, an infant head cant go through..thats for safety reason
I thought condo nowaday all has this design? no?
apparently, CDL do not think is their fault either :D
www.straitstimes.com/premium/forum-letters/story/problems-marina-bay-condo-developer-replies-20130911 (http://forums.condosingapore.com/www.straitstimes.com/premium/forum-letters/story/problems-marina-bay-condo-developer-replies-20130911)
Problems at Marina Bay condo: Developer replies
SUNDAY'S article ("Condo sails into troubled waters") did not capture some pertinent information. As a result, readers may not have been presented with an accurate picture, placing the developer in a disadvantaged position.
Glengary, a subsidiary of City Developments, has had no involvement in running The Sail@Marina Bay since handing over the property to the management corporation strata title (MCST) in June 2010.
The MCST is responsible for regular maintenance, management and general upkeep of the property, pursuant to the Building Maintenance and Strata Management Act.
The article highlighted ongoing disputes within the council and how the standards of repair and estate management are not in keeping with residents' expectations. We understand that the council has had at least three different managing agents. Another will start work next month.
The "unsightly" temporary pipe was not installed by Glengary but by the MCST itself. The cause of the burst pipe has yet to be determined, as acknowledged by the MCST.
Many factors could have contributed to it, and it is unwarranted to blame the developer before the cause is established.
Notwithstanding that this property had already been handed over three years ago, out of goodwill, Glengary arranged for The Sail's internationally established main contractor to assist in the investigation of the underground burst pipe. A proposed work schedule and method statement for the investigation were presented to the MCST.
The aesthetically designed glass skylight complies with all building and safety codes.
When Glengary was managing the property, there were incidents of damage to the tempered glass due to "killer litter" thrown from the upper floors. The damaged panels were promptly replaced.
Killer litter prevention requires constant education and enforcement for residents who live in high-rise buildings. We understand that in November 2010, a circular was issued to all residents to warn them of the seriousness of killer litter.
As a responsible and reputable developer, we have gone the extra mile to attend to the MCST post-handover of the property. We urge the MCST to act in the best interest of its residents.
Belinda Lee (Ms)
Head, Corporate Communications
On behalf of Glengary (A subsidiary of City Developments)
Developer of The Sail@Marina Bay
apparently, CDL do not think is their fault either :D
www.straitstimes.com/premium/forum-letters/story/problems-marina-bay-condo-developer-replies-20130911 (http://forums.condosingapore.com/www.straitstimes.com/premium/forum-letters/story/problems-marina-bay-condo-developer-replies-20130911)
Problems at Marina Bay condo: Developer replies
SUNDAY'S article ("Condo sails into troubled waters") did not capture some pertinent information. As a result, readers may not have been presented with an accurate picture, placing the developer in a disadvantaged position.
Glengary, a subsidiary of City Developments, has had no involvement in running The Sail@Marina Bay since handing over the property to the management corporation strata title (MCST) in June 2010.
The MCST is responsible for regular maintenance, management and general upkeep of the property, pursuant to the Building Maintenance and Strata Management Act.
The article highlighted ongoing disputes within the council and how the standards of repair and estate management are not in keeping with residents' expectations. We understand that the council has had at least three different managing agents. Another will start work next month.
The "unsightly" temporary pipe was not installed by Glengary but by the MCST itself. The cause of the burst pipe has yet to be determined, as acknowledged by the MCST.
Many factors could have contributed to it, and it is unwarranted to blame the developer before the cause is established.
Notwithstanding that this property had already been handed over three years ago, out of goodwill, Glengary arranged for The Sail's internationally established main contractor to assist in the investigation of the underground burst pipe. A proposed work schedule and method statement for the investigation were presented to the MCST.
The aesthetically designed glass skylight complies with all building and safety codes.
When Glengary was managing the property, there were incidents of damage to the tempered glass due to "killer litter" thrown from the upper floors. The damaged panels were promptly replaced.
Killer litter prevention requires constant education and enforcement for residents who live in high-rise buildings. We understand that in November 2010, a circular was issued to all residents to warn them of the seriousness of killer litter.
As a responsible and reputable developer, we have gone the extra mile to attend to the MCST post-handover of the property. We urge the MCST to act in the best interest of its residents.
Belinda Lee (Ms)
Head, Corporate Communications
On behalf of Glengary (A subsidiary of City Developments)
Developer of The Sail@Marina Bay
Obviously they denied responsibilties for this instant becos by their admission mean their reputation is at stake;that they are building lousy unsafe structures and who still dare to buy from them? at a side note,they had raked in fortune enough to survive thro the bitter times.
In fact, the real landmark case will be The Seaview.
Bring Wheelock, Tiong Aik, RSP to court.
In fact, the real landmark case will be The Seaview.
Bring Wheelock, Tiong Aik, RSP to court.Since 2011, any updates? wonder how much spent on legal liao.
Ultimate winners are the lawyers.
CDL also involved in another case, Emery point.
from the article:
http://www.ocbcresearch.com/Article.aspx?type=research&id=20110209090321_79834
CDL settles lawsuit. It was reported yesterday that City Developments Limited (CDL) was one of eight defendants named in a lawsuit filed by Emory Point residents. Emory Point is a freehold development by CDL consisting of 18 stories of 51 units in the Tanjong Katong area and was completed in 2003. The residents alleged that CDL was aware of defects in 17 areas during the period from 2003 to 2007 and only attempted cosmetic patch repairs as a delay tactic while waiting for relevant warranties to expire. The alleged defects include a leaking basement carpark, cracks in walls and lift lobbies with ceilings damaged by rainwater. The residents seek approximately $0.6m in compensation. This morning, the media reported that the CDL and other defendants have settled the lawsuit with Emory Point residents.
beware of delay tactics so that warranties expire.
thomastansb
11-09-13, 15:24
One shenton also. Just wait and see. Up and coming lawsuit.
A couple has discontinued rental at one shenton and rented my place were complaining about so many things falling apart within 2 years. They are not cheap to replace/repair too.
One shenton also. Just wait and see. Up and coming lawsuit.
The Sails residents can't win CDL developer. CDL can afford to drag the case but don't think the residents can. Best now for residents is sell before it got worse. $250k of legal war chest is far too little, u r against big player. Legal cost will amount to millions. See who can tahan.
Interesting. But it is common for all older buildings to have windows that can open out 90 degrees. We know that The Sail's window cannot open out totally 90 degrees, only some degrees, so it is not as bad as those other older buildings of 30-36 storeys and yet with windows that can open out 90 degrees. Still, we don't hear that any building has more than 10 windows shattered like The Sail has within 5 years since TOP. So there is more than that....
I have given this some thoughts..
in US ..all new apt windows open inward.. and probably 10 deg wide only ..
at the widest part, an infant head cant go through..thats for safety reasons.
I live on 31st flr... unblock view from 8th ave to Hudson river.. the wind is super strong.. sometimes.. it takes 2 adults to push the window before we could lock it...
I think in spore.. windows open outward.. and can open Beyond 90 deg..
Sail being high rise ... theres a chance windows are left open max .. and on a day with strong wind .... it could open beyond 90 deg... and damaging the window frame and joints..
as to the surrounding office buildings..no such problems ... they don't have windows and even there are ..they don't open them .. hence less chance of damages
proud owner
11-09-13, 19:03
do u have to close the windows when it rains? since it will drip inside?
yes of course but then again rain is not common and usually not heavy ...but drizzle
No offence to owners but CDL finishing is quite poor in recent yrs. It is a shame this project is no exception when its location and façade is distinctly top notch. CDL will likely settle out of court, it is cheaper and there is little point in subjecting its own souring reputation to further unnecessary 'limelight'.
The Sails residents can't win CDL developer. CDL can afford to drag the case but don't think the residents can. Best now for residents is sell before it got worse. $250k of legal war chest is far too little, u r against big player. Legal cost will amount to millions. See who can tahan.
The longer the case drags on, the worse the impact is for CDL. CDL will surely try their best to settle out of court....
For a company that built their reputation on quality, this is indeed a shame....
I hope something good comes out of this...
The Sails residents can't win CDL developer. CDL can afford to drag the case but don't think the residents can. Best now for residents is sell before it got worse. $250k of legal war chest is far too little, u r against big player. Legal cost will amount to millions. See who can tahan.
DKSG is looking for a unit there. please PM him
thomastansb
11-09-13, 23:33
The problem is with the glass roof. If someone accidentally drop something down from 30th floor, it will shattered the glass.
Interesting. But it is common for all older buildings to have windows that can open out 90 degrees. We know that The Sail's window cannot open out totally 90 degrees, only some degrees, so it is not as bad as those other older buildings of 30-36 storeys and yet with windows that can open out 90 degrees. Still, we don't hear that any building has more than 10 windows shattered like The Sail has within 5 years since TOP. So there is more than that....
You should see the comments on Sail on propertyguru.com. Not even one good comment. All comments are vitriolic and scathing.
This place is falling apart and the owners are going to lose a bundle. Basically the CBD is full of such white elephants, nice to look at from the outside but inside shit is literally under your feet and over your head.
I won't pay even $800 psf for this shitty place.
Of course u wont...u already missed it....but others will...
Eh, I offer $900psf for a unit here. Any takers?
With Jurong hitting $1700psf, i would take this place even if it's $1000psf
Originally Posted by stalingrad http://forums.condosingapore.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?p=429057#post429057)
You should see the comments on Sail on propertyguru.com. Not even one good comment. All comments are vitriolic and scathing.
This place is falling apart and the owners are going to lose a bundle. Basically the CBD is full of such white elephants, nice to look at from the outside but inside shit is literally under your feet and over your head.
I won't pay even $800 psf for this shitty place
thomastansb
12-09-13, 10:27
3k psf, I sell to you :D
Eh, I offer $900psf for a unit here. Any takers?
With Jurong hitting $1700psf, i would take this place even if it's $1000psf
Originally Posted by stalingrad http://forums.condosingapore.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?p=429057#post429057)
You should see the comments on Sail on propertyguru.com. Not even one good comment. All comments are vitriolic and scathing.
This place is falling apart and the owners are going to lose a bundle. Basically the CBD is full of such white elephants, nice to look at from the outside but inside shit is literally under your feet and over your head.
I won't pay even $800 psf for this shitty place
3k psf, I sell to you :D
mai lah, let's compromise. $1200psf - i'm offering 50% more than stalingrad leh :D
thomastansb
12-09-13, 11:57
Hahaha... He has been mocking at properties since the bull market since 2009. But this kind of people, $600 psf also he won't buy one. He hoping for $400 psf.
mai lah, let's compromise. $1200psf - i'm offering 50% more than stalingrad leh :D
Hahaha... He has been mocking at properties since the bull market since 2009. But this kind of people, $600 psf also he won't buy one. He hoping for $400 psf.
I thought his identity was already exposed? hehe.
stalingrad
12-09-13, 20:02
I thought his identity was already exposed? hehe.
I have been exposed to be a genius. I said many years ago that CCR has not place to go but down, and OCR will boom like a rocket. I was proven right in every sense of the word.
Give you another 10 years & you can then come back to tell me whether it is still true or not....... As we know, property just move in cycles, OCR phenomenon is just temporary, smart people would be selling OCR & change to CCR at that kind of price!
You have PHD so you can't be smart. PHD stands for Permanent Head Damage right?
I have been exposed to be a genius. I said many years ago that CCR has not place to go but down, and OCR will boom like a rocket. I was proven right in every sense of the word.
stalingrad
12-09-13, 21:33
Give you another 10 years & you can then come back to tell me whether it is still true or not....... As we know, property just move in cycles, OCR phenomenon is just temporary, smart people would be selling OCR & change to CCR at that kind of price!
You have PHD so you can't be smart. PHD stands for Permanent Head Damage right?
How can it be temporary? The JLD will not be temporary. Every area of Singapore will boom except CCR. Why would it be reversed? Please explain to me. I am brain damaged.
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