View Full Version : First investment need advice!!
Hi great masters & experts!
I would like to invest in a private property & would be grateful for any sound advice on which development I should consider. The property including stamp duty should be within $1.1mi & this will be my first property purchase.
My plan is to cash out within 5-8ys & then buy a hdb resale flat to retire in as I am already 42 yrs old. Meantime I am living with my parents.
Location doesn't matter as it's for investment so capital appreciation & rentability is most important.
I Am considering Trilinq 2 bedder costing about $1.05million but psf is about $1500 which seems to be steep. If I look at CCR, I can only get a 1 bedder with my Budget. Which would have better potential?
Appreciate any advice on where's the best potential bet to place. Thanks!!
Not an expert nor a Master but a Retired Master Sergeant.
Not enough info from you to give advice.
Need to know the following.
1. Cash on hand.
2. Yearly income excludes Bonus, etc.
3. CPF OA.
4. Any Loan from FI.
http://www.newlaunchesreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/LTV.jpg
http://www.estate.sg/uploads/2/3/7/3/23733606/8306355_orig.gif
http://www.sgecondo.com/images/ABSD.jpg
http://www.sgecondo.com/images/SSD.png
http://www.sgecondo.com/images/SSD.png
Is the above referring to Seller Stamp Duty (SSD)? SSD is based on selling price of the property and not the original purchase price.
Not an expert nor a Master but a Retired Master Sergeant.
Not enough info from you to give advice.
Need to know the following.
1. Cash on hand.
2. Yearly income excludes Bonus, etc.
3. CPF OA.
4. Any Loan from FI.
Hi Master Sergeant!
Limited fund.. S$300k in cash (I would like to keep $100k for emergency so will only use $200k for the purchase), $360k in OA, yearly income is just S$70k, no loan/debt currently and no property :-( Max housing loan I qualify with is about $600k.
Appreciate your kind advice!
Age 42.
Cash 300K
Used up to 200K
Emergency fund 100K
CPF OA 360K
Yearly income 70K
The plan is to cash out within 5-8ys & then buy a hdb resale flat.
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/listing/18293478/for-sale-the-trilinq
The Trilinq @ Clementi MRT
NEW PRICING & NEW RELEASES with effective from Jan 2016!
1037000 for 710 sqft S$ 1,460.56 psf.
The question needs to ask yourself.
1. Why would anyone want to buy from you?
2. How much can the property appreciate in 5-8ys?
3. Why buy private, 5-8ys sell than buy HDB?
4. Why buy stay when you have already a place to stay?
My answer.
1. Don't think anyone would want to buy unless those staying near the area. No en-Bloc, not freehold, not near MRT.
2. Not much.
3. Should buy HDB resale than 5-8ys buy private.
4. Buy to stay and parents move in together and rent out HDB.
http://www.hdb.gov.sg/cs/infoweb/residential/buying-a-flat/resale/single-singapore-citizen-scheme-or-joint-singles-scheme
1. Don't think parents would want to move out of their comfort zone so staying with them is out.
2. Have not eaten any cherry must find a way to eat.
3. BTO for Single is out, 2 room HDB cherry too small, take too long to eat about 7 years.
4. Single can buy 2 to 5-room under the Single Singapore Citizen Scheme, 5 room cherry look good.
5. Look for the biggest cherry and rent out the other room for rental income.
6. After MOP than look for a private condo.
Die Die must buy Private.
This is what I will do.
1. Look for resale freehold, new private condo you are paying for the future price so not much appreciation.
2. Look for HUDC and wait for en bloc.
3. Look for freehold walk-up apartment and wait for en bloc.
Is the above referring to Seller Stamp Duty (SSD)? SSD is based on selling price of the property and not the original purchase price.
Nope, SSD is on the original purchase price or the market value whichever is higher.
e.g. buy 1,000,000 than sell 800,000 within first year. SSD is 16% of 1,000,000 about 160,000 only.
https://www.iras.gov.sg/irashome/Other-Taxes/Stamp-Duty-for-Property/Working-out-your-Stamp-Duty/Selling-or-Disposing-Property/Seller-s-Stamp-Duty--SSD--for-Residential-Property/
What is the difference bet resale FH and new private condo?
Isnt future pricing also factored in for resale FH also?
For old resale FH, would upside also be limited since the runup of prices the last few years also pushed their prices high high
if a new higher priced LH condo has higher yield than old resale FH, would not both even out in 5-8 years?
Die Die must buy Private.
This is what I will do.
1. Look for resale freehold, new private condo you are paying for the future price so not much appreciation.
2. Look for HUDC and wait for en bloc.
3. Look for freehold walk-up apartment and wait for en bloc.
proud owner
25-09-16, 23:43
What is the difference bet resale FH and new private condo?
Isnt future pricing also factored in for resale FH also?
For old resale FH, would upside also be limited since the runup of prices the last few years also pushed their prices high high
if a new higher priced LH condo has higher yield than old resale FH, would not both even out in 5-8 years?
Take for example
Farrer Road
1 side FH
Sommerville park
Spanish villa
the other side LH
new D Leedon
both same psf ... if not higher psf for D Leedon
which is a better bet in the long run ?
Hi great masters & experts!
I would like to invest in a private property & would be grateful for any sound advice on which development I should consider. The property including stamp duty should be within $1.1mi & this will be my first property purchase.
My plan is to cash out within 5-8ys & then buy a hdb resale flat to retire in as I am already 42 yrs old. Meantime I am living with my parents.
Location doesn't matter as it's for investment so capital appreciation & rentability is most important.
I Am considering Trilinq 2 bedder costing about $1.05million but psf is about $1500 which seems to be steep. If I look at CCR, I can only get a 1 bedder with my Budget. Which would have better potential?
Appreciate any advice on where's the best potential bet to place. Thanks!!
I am no expert. So do not blame me if price did not go the way u want. But i find woodlands condo great value for money. Future regional centre, alot of B1 offices to be built and future thomson line. However their price and rentals r rather low now. $900k can get u a large 3 bedder in rosewood or casablanca.
Jurong and serangoon regional centres price already hype up alot now left woodlands. Not much condo near woodlands central as of now.
Went to see new launch forest woods at serangoon. 1 bedroom + 1 study room already start from $680k. Face pool units likely $700k above. I find it expensive...
I am no expert. So do not blame me if price did not go the way u want. But i find woodlands condo great value for money. Future regional centre, alot of B1 offices to be built and future thomson line. However their price and rentals r rather low now. $900k can get u a large 3 bedder in rosewood or casablanca.
Jurong and serangoon regional centres price already hype up alot now left woodlands. Not much condo near woodlands central as of now.
Went to see new launch forest woods at serangoon. 1 bedroom + 1 study room already start from $680k. Face pool units likely $700k above. I find it expensive...
Woodlands condo price Low for a reason, far from from city....Forest wood price for a reason... I am no agent, but I have tried both areas...conclusion nver buy Woodlands, I got better yield and rental nearer town
What is the difference bet resale FH and new private condo?
Isnt future pricing also factored in for resale FH also?
For old resale FH, would upside also be limited since the runup of prices the last few years also pushed their prices high high
if a new higher priced LH condo has higher yield than old resale FH, would not both even out in 5-8 years?
Depend on Market, location and timing you will than decide which is the best option. Current market better go for FH because it going to be a long time before another bull run. Being through two bull run don't know can see another before I leave this world. One in 1996 another 2006
Depend on Market, location and timing you will than decide which is the best option. Current market better go for FH because it going to be a long time before another bull run. Being through two bull run don't know can see another before I leave this world. One in 1996 another 2006
Actually my reading is a bit different. TDSR will continue to shackle the amounts that people can set aside for properties.
In the case that all properties are limited in price growth, the leasehold property may experience a reduction in interest payments unless priced identically to the Freehold property.
My take is for smaller units where plot ratio is not optimised and quantum is friendly, set aside solely for investment, FH is better. For larger units with the intention to be housed (probably forever), leasehold may be more appropriate to minimise risk of not being able to finance loan at some juncture.
Location is still more important in the current market. And because TDSR limits the bullets one has, it pays to consider carefully.
Being relatively new is still helpful for own stay and rental as well for modern generation. Unless one treats it as buying land that is not very meaningful for living purposes.
Woodlands condo price Low for a reason, far from from city....Forest wood price for a reason... I am no agent, but I have tried both areas...conclusion nver buy Woodlands, I got better yield and rental nearer town
Yes indeed. No one will know the future. Last time people say punggol no good, jurong no good but what happen? Both r extremely far from city too. I remember someone bought sky habitat at $1700psf and reflection at keppel bay during launch and those freehold ccr few years ago say very good sure make money.
Yes indeed. No one will know the future. Last time people say punggol no good, jurong no good but what happen? Both r extremely far from city too. I remember someone bought sky habitat at $1700psf and reflection at keppel bay during launch and those freehold ccr few years ago say very good sure make money.
Punggol really no good, but Jurong v good....also made good money on Tis...and rental is easier...but pls don't buy $1700 psf Jurong gateway la........
What is the difference bet resale FH and new private condo?
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ePwCmg71B3o/SNsQZxeEJ3I/AAAAAAAAAQw/00f-7UYqyJM/s1600/99-LH-depreciation-SLA.gif
Isnt future pricing also factored in for resale FH also? Nope, if you buy those not factored in.
For old resale FH, would upside also be limited since the runup of prices the last few years also pushed their prices high high
if a new higher priced LH condo has higher yield than old resale FH, would not both even out in 5-8 years?
Isnt future pricing also factored in for resale FH also? Nope, if you buy those not factored in.
For old resale FH, would upside also be limited since the runup of prices the last few years also pushed their prices high high
It take time and effort to look for the gem.
http://www.todayonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/photo_gallery_image_lightbox/public/16965155.JPG?itok=OQ_HAU_H
There are gems for every category.
Main thing is to consider carefully the intention, the risks involved and how much risk one is willing to take.
For example, if no children and retirement funds all set, LH is no issue as funds are freed up for other investment needs or second property funds.
Isnt future pricing also factored in for resale FH also? Nope, if you buy those not factored in.
For old resale FH, would upside also be limited since the runup of prices the last few years also pushed their prices high high
It take time and effort to look for the gem.
http://www.todayonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/photo_gallery_image_lightbox/public/16965155.JPG?itok=OQ_HAU_H
Timing.
Bought in 1988 sold HDB in 1995.
https://propertysoul.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/ppigovtmeasures.jpg
Bought in 2006. the peak is 2013 guess when will the next peak be.
With all the control measure and TDSR being the structure of property loan, next peak maybe 20 years from now.
http://propertyinvestment88.sg/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/private-condominium-price-index-cooling-measures.jpg
http://propertyinvestment88.sg/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Singapore-Property-Price-Index.jpg
There are gems for every category.
Main thing is to consider carefully the intention, the risks involved and how much risk one is willing to take.
For example, if no children and retirement funds all set, LH is no issue as funds are freed up for other investment needs or second property funds.
:encouragement:
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/blob/3014628/1470315075000/ura-price-index-data.jpg
According to the Urban Redevelopment Authority’s private home prices index, prices have only fallen 9 per cent over three years since peaking in the third quarter of 2013. The magnitude of this decline is small, compared to the 62 per cent ramp-up of prices over a four-year period between 2009 and 2013.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/business/private-homes-puzzle-why/3014552.html
If no children and retirement funds all set, don't even need to buy property, sell the property and use those to earn better return else where and can also spend the money to rent luxury condo (those with full condo facilities, concierge service, air-con lift lobby etc) to live like a King/Queen! :surprise:
There are gems for every category.
Main thing is to consider carefully the intention, the risks involved and how much risk one is willing to take.
For example, if no children and retirement funds all set, LH is no issue as funds are freed up for other investment needs or second property funds.
But the URA PPI does not tell the whole story.........
i.e., CCR drop >20 (some even >30%) already over past 7 years...........
OCR barely drop 1% (may be?).......... :surprise:
Also, 20 years old LH private properties probably >15% cheaper than same 20 years old FH private properties (and the gap will increase as both ages further, and LH property value will go to ZERO at end of 99 years lease!)..........
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/blob/3014628/1470315075000/ura-price-index-data.jpg
According to the Urban Redevelopment Authority’s private home prices index, prices have only fallen 9 per cent over three years since peaking in the third quarter of 2013. The magnitude of this decline is small, compared to the 62 per cent ramp-up of prices over a four-year period between 2009 and 2013.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/blob/3014590/1470313886000/ura-homes-pipeline-data.jpg
The right time should be 5 to 8 years from now.
Best is to buy a 5 room HDB and rent out 4 bedrooms for rental income.
Collect for 5 years then buys private.
If property crash buy big one otherwise buy small one.
5rm HDB where got 4 bedroom? 3 in total only.
And befor MOP cannot rent out.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/blob/3014590/1470313886000/ura-homes-pipeline-data.jpg
The right time should be 5 to 8 years from now.
Best is to buy a 5 room HDB and rent out 4 bedrooms for rental income.
Collect for 5 years then buys private.
If property crash buy big one otherwise buy small one.
I wouldn't advise that.
Firstly, you have no idea exactly how long you and your spouse would live and need to rent.
Secondly, if rents go up one day, you might be chased out without a place to stay if the retirement funds set aside are not sufficient. Still good to have 1 paid property to stay.
If no children and retirement funds all set, don't even need to buy property, sell the property and use those to earn better return else where and can also spend the money to rent luxury condo (those with full condo facilities, concierge service, air-con lift lobby etc) to live like a King/Queen! :surprise:
5rm HDB where got 4 bedroom? 3 in total only.
And befor MOP cannot rent out.
Go for the 133 sqm 5 room HDB or Jumbo unit 163 sqm (http://www.stproperty.sg/property-for-sale/hdb-for-sale/jumbo-flat-for-sale), add another room and rent out 4 room before MOP.
4-room and bigger, Maximum Number of Subtenants Allowed in Each Flat^ 9 Maximum Number of Bedroom(s) Allowed 2 Maximum Number of Occupants* Allowed in Each Flat^ 9. http://www.hdb.gov.sg/cs/infoweb/residential/renting-a-flat/renting-from-the-open-market/subletting-regulations
Yah got a cousin doing that. Great strategy if can arrange this way.
Go for the 133 sqm 5 room HDB or Jumbo unit 163 sqm (http://www.stproperty.sg/property-for-sale/hdb-for-sale/jumbo-flat-for-sale), add another room and rent out 4 room before MOP.
4-room and bigger, Maximum Number of Subtenants Allowed in Each Flat^ 9 Maximum Number of Bedroom(s) Allowed 2 Maximum Number of Occupants* Allowed in Each Flat^ 9. http://www.hdb.gov.sg/cs/infoweb/residential/renting-a-flat/renting-from-the-open-market/subletting-regulations
Think you should be able to do a calculation..... I am sure the couple can live like a king & queen by renting luxury condo apartment rather than being stuck in a LH property for own stay even if fully paid up (which will keep decreasing in value as it ages).........
E.g. they living in a 3BR LH property all their life (which they fully paid up), the property say now worth >$1.5M, but will keep decreasing in value as it ages, and no rental income (because own stay), so why keep? And they still have to pay for maintenance fees to MCST, pay property tax, pay to maintain and repair the property, etc, and all these are extra costs!
Instead, sell the property, invest in bonds with return of 4% p.a. (which is reasonable even at current low yield evironment) (consult cbsh if want to earn more), which means they will get a coupon of $60k p.a., and they can use these to pay for max $5k pm for a rental property without even touching their capital of $1.5M (vs their 99LH property depreciating in value if they hold too long)........
Now, a studio/1BR luxury rental condo apartment fully furnished even in CCR is only about $4k pm! And what's more, they don't even need to pay property tax, maintenance fund, and major repair and maintenance of the rental property (because these are due to wear and tear)! (All these additional costs will probably results in another $12k p.a. in costs! And furthermore they still can save another $12k p.a. as buffer for future rent increase! Hei, they can tolerate $2k pm rental increase (which they unlikely to max out in their life time!))
See, well worth it rather than keeping the LH property that will keep decreasing in value and still sink in more money for property tax, maintenance fund, repairs and maintenance etc!
I wouldn't advise that.
Firstly, you have no idea exactly how long you and your spouse would live and need to rent.
Secondly, if rents go up one day, you might be chased out without a place to stay if the retirement funds set aside are not sufficient. Still good to have 1 paid property to stay.
The summary in todayonline link shows little difference bet FH and LH condo, the big diff is bet FH and LH landed terrace
In a 5-10 year time frame, investment in either FH or LH condo may well make little difference
If newer LH gives better yield than older FH, wont buying LH more sensible esp if cheaper?
Isnt future pricing also factored in for resale FH also? Nope, if you buy those not factored in.
For old resale FH, would upside also be limited since the runup of prices the last few years also pushed their prices high high
It take time and effort to look for the gem.
http://www.todayonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/photo_gallery_image_lightbox/public/16965155.JPG?itok=OQ_HAU_H
Are you doing that?
I would not choose being a tenant if I had a choice. Would you?
In other words, if you can settle a loan and own a home after 25-30 years paying 4K a month and thereafter paying say 1K per month for all expenses included, would you opt to pay 4 a month for perpetuity increasing to max 6K, maybe 50 to 60 years, depending on your lifespan?
Think you should be able to do a calculation..... I am sure the couple can live like a king & queen by renting luxury condo apartment rather than being stuck in a LH property for own stay even if fully paid up (which will keep decreasing in value as it ages).........
E.g. they living in a 3BR LH property all their life (which they fully paid up), the property say now worth >$1.5M, but will keep decreasing in value as it ages, and no rental income (because own stay), so why keep? And they still have to pay for maintenance fees to MCST, pay property tax, pay to maintain and repair the property, etc, and all these are extra costs!
Instead, sell the property, invest in bonds with return of 4% p.a. (which is reasonable even at current low yield evironment) (consult cbsh if want to earn more), which means they will get a coupon of $60k p.a., and they can use these to pay for max $5k pm for a rental property without even touching their capital of $1.5M (vs their 99LH property depreciating in value if they hold too long)........
Now, a studio/1BR luxury rental condo apartment fully furnished even in CCR is only about $4k pm! And what's more, they don't even need to pay property tax, maintenance fund, and major repair and maintenance of the rental property (because these are due to wear and tear)! (All these additional costs will probably results in another $12k p.a. in costs! And furthermore they still can save another $12k p.a. as buffer for future rent increase! Hei, they can tolerate $2k pm rental increase (which they unlikely to max out in their life time!))
See, well worth it rather than keeping the LH property that will keep decreasing in value and still sink in more money for property tax, maintenance fund, repairs and maintenance etc!
I have no issue being a tenant, if the choice affords me to live in a luxury apartment like a king/queen and still have a lot more spare cash to spend on more luxuries on top of preserving my capital PERPETUALLY (say $1.5M) and allowing them to earn more money (and I have option to spend part of them too assuming I have no one to pass down to),
rather than the alternative of owning and living in a LH mass-market property that is dropping in value (as lease runs down), it can't give us luxurious living like a king/queen (since it is a mass-market property) when we have retired and should be enjoying our remaining retirement like a king/queen, and you can't get any spare cash out of it for spending and enjoy life more luxuriously and meaningfully and enjoyingly without worry of running out of cash and become asset rich and cash poor (rather, you actually need to spend more cash on property taxes, maintenance fund to MCST, maintenance and repairs to your aging properties etc!)............
Hei, isn't the asset buy-back scheme Government is encouraging old people to take up is similar to what I am advocating?! However, the main difference is that the asset buy-back scheme is half-baked (half selling), I advocate full selling! Why would anybody want to lose ownership of his/her property just for getting a smaller % of usually lower valuation price in the case of asset buy-back scheme (instead of selling for full market price?!)
Are you doing that?
I would not choose being a tenant if I had a choice. Would you?
In other words, if you can settle a loan and own a home after 25-30 years paying 4K a month and thereafter paying say 1K per month for all expenses included, would you opt to pay 4 a month for perpetuity increasing to max 6K, maybe 50 to 60 years, depending on your lifespan?
Happy renting bro. Great choice.
I have no issue being a tenant, if the choice affords me to live in a luxury apartment like a king/queen and still have a lot more spare cash to spend on more luxuries on top of preserving my capital PERPETUALLY (say $1.5M) and allowing them to earn more money (and I have option to spend part of them too assuming I have no one to pass down to),
rather than the alternative of owning and living in a LH mass-market property that is dropping in value (as lease runs down), it can't give us luxurious living like a king/queen (since it is a mass-market property) when we have retired and should be enjoying our remaining retirement like a king/queen, and you can't get any spare cash out of it for spending and enjoy life more luxuriously and meaningfully and enjoyingly without worry of running out of cash and become asset rich and cash poor (rather, you actually need to spend more cash on property taxes, maintenance fund to MCST, maintenance and repairs to your aging properties etc!)............
Hei, isn't the asset buy-back scheme Government is encouraging old people to take up is similar to what I am advocating?! However, the main difference is that the asset buy-back scheme is half-baked (half selling), I advocate full selling! Why would anybody want to lose ownership of his/her property just for getting a smaller % of usually lower valuation price in the case of asset buy-back scheme (instead of selling for full market price?!)
The summary in todayonline link shows little difference bet FH and LH condo, the big diff is bet FH and LH landed terrace
In a 5-10 year time frame, investment in either FH or LH condo may well make little difference
If newer LH gives better yield than older FH, wont buying LH more sensible esp if cheaper? Some people only look capital Gain. Nothing else. So They will not understand this idea.
If over a 10 year horizon, probably little difference between new LH and older FH or even newer FH condos
especially if both are in good location
Some people only look capital Gain. Nothing else. So They will not understand this idea.
Depend on Market, location and timing you will than decide which is the best option. Current market better go for FH because it going to be a long time before another bull run. Being through two bull run don't know can see another before I leave this world. One in 1996 another 2006
5 July 2018.
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