View Full Version : Cut land lease under GLS programme to 60 years
Cut land lease under GLS programme to 60 years
JUL 28, 2017
The current en-bloc sale frenzy is a sign of pent-up demand for private housing, especially for 99-year leasehold properties.
The Government should consider reducing the lease of some selected Government Land Sales (GLS) plots to 60 years and release more land for sale for private housing projects.
This way, it will offer Singaporeans, especially young families and middle-aged couples with children, cheaper private housing without heavy mortgage payments.
The shorter lease will help reduce the cost of living which may translate into better quality of life .
Some retirees may also be keen to downgrade to 60-year leasehold private properties.
The release of more land with a 60-year lease will help meet the challenge of housing an ageing population looking for cheaper homes.
The 60-year lease private developments can be integrated with public and private housing estates which have 60 years left to their lease.
The Government can redevelop these estates when the homes reach the end of their lease.
This will create substantial economic activity and rejuvenate the estates.
Sum Kam Weng
99 leasehold soon become rarity. Maybe developers knew it's coming. That's why they are hoarding land now.
99 leasehold soon become rarity. Maybe developers knew it's coming. That's why they are hoarding land now.
A rarity soon ? :doh:
How many 60LH units out of a housing stock of 1.32 mil units today ? 60LH, the bank will also not finance the last 30-years lease, when its price will surely decline to zero.
Correction. Not zero value but needs full cash and CPF to settle.
If close to zero value let me know where to buy.
Anyway, there is the possibility of tweaking the minimum 30 years for loan guideline although I won't count on it. Just don't cry foul if it happens.
Sum Kum Weng seems to like to stir.
A rarity soon ? :doh:
How many 60LH units out of a housing stock of 1.32 mil units today ? 60LH, the bank will also not finance the last 30-years lease, when its price will surely decline to zero.
Correction. Not zero value but needs full cash and CPF to settle.
If close to zero value let me know where to buy.
Anyway, there is the possibility of tweaking the minimum 30 years for loan guideline although I won't count on it. Just don't cry foul if it happens.
Sum Kum Weng seems to like to stir.
The first sentence, please illustrate what do you mean ?
The first sentence, please illustrate what do you mean ?
Search any property portal for any property with any number of years left, you will find the prices are far from zero. Zero loan doesn't equate zero value.
Search any property portal for any property with any number of years left, you will find the prices are far from zero. Zero loan doesn't equate zero value.
It's possible that somewhere in the future that the gov allow old condo to "self en block". Top up the years, torn down and rebuild based on residents own initiative and capital. So, there is always value left.
Hong Kong's lease is 50 years. Reference point
http://www.landsd.gov.hk/en/service/landpolicy.htm
Search any property portal for any property with any number of years left, you will find the prices are far from zero. Zero loan doesn't equate zero value.
I see. But any of them condo, HDB has reached the end 99-years. Plenty of cases in Landed though.
Anyway, Lawrence Wong must be lying.
It's possible that somewhere in the future that the gov allow old condo to "self en block". Top up the years, torn down and rebuild based on residents own initiative and capital. So, there is always value left.
Which law is forbidding self enbloc ?
It's possible that somewhere in the future that the gov allow old condo to "self en block". Top up the years, torn down and rebuild based on residents own initiative and capital. So, there is always value left.
This case has been ruled out by SLA already.
See The Arcadia case
https://www.iproperty.com.sg/news/3447/Fighting-for-Arcadia
As usual, there will always be people trying to spread half-truth and fake news to convince others here to believe that there is "life" and continual value and capital appreciation after 99 years for "99-years leasehold" properties..........
Think they need to convince people to buy over their "babies" that they intend to flip at good price after staying for 10-20 years? :moody:
This case has been ruled out by SLA already.
See The Arcadia case
https://www.iproperty.com.sg/news/3447/Fighting-for-Arcadia
It's possible that somewhere in the future that the gov allow old condo to "self en block". Top up the years, torn down and rebuild based on residents own initiative and capital. So, there is always value left.
This case has been ruled out by SLA already.
See The Arcadia case
https://www.iproperty.com.sg/news/3447/Fighting-for-Arcadia
I know to extend the life of a condo in itself is not possible. But to act as own developer is possible. Lets say u have a 60 years condo. The residents can decide to pool money every month for the next 30 years to torn down and rebuilt a new condo that intensify the use of land. maybe in the end one condo can yield 2 condo.
I see. But any of them condo, HDB has reached the end 99-years. Plenty of cases in Landed though.
Anyway, Lawrence Wong must be lying.
Even a landed with 30 years left is selling for a few hundred thousand minimum. How can be zero?
HDB rarely encounter over 50-60 years old, but still it's not going to be zero, especially if the location is good.
Lawrence is not kidding - the buyers or owners of very old properties are dealing with steep depreciation and / or huge maintenance fees.
They save on interest, but pay direct rent till the lease runs out.
Even a landed with 30 years left is selling for a few hundred thousand minimum. How can be zero?
HDB rarely encounter over 50-60 years old, but still it's not going to be zero, especially if the location is good.
Lawrence is not kidding - the buyers or owners of very old properties are dealing with steep depreciation and / or huge maintenance fees.
They save on interest, but pay direct rent till the lease runs out.
Did I say what you wrote?
I said "price declining to zero".
A rarity soon ? :doh:
How many 60LH units out of a housing stock of 1.32 mil units today ? 60LH, the bank will also not finance the last 30-years lease, when its price will surely decline to zero.
Anybody else misunderstood the last sentence written above ?
:doh: :doh:
Did I say what you wrote?
I said "price declining to zero".
Ok my bad. I read it as price declining to zero at the beginning of the 30 years lease left. Seems that you meant at the tail end of the lease.
Looking at the Geylang houses and Hillford, it does seem likely that 60 LH may be on the cards to cope with the Ageing population. Hillford is the experimental prototype to measure outcomes. Very unlikely to be once off.
May coincide with the allowance for short term rental?
So sad got a 99 years leasehold property.
Rental per month S$2,800 / S$ 33,600 per years / S$ 336,000 per 10 years / S$ 2,352,000 for 70 years.
Blk 27 Balam Rd S(370027)
Lease Start Date : 01 Jul 1997
Lease Duration : 99 years
Remaining Lease : 78 years (as at date of enquiry)
https://services2.hdb.gov.sg/web/fi10/emap.html
Will you pay S$700,000 to get S$2,352,000 for 70 years of rental income not adjusted for inflation.
Don't know is it good to kill the golden goose to get the eggs.
Please do not confuse yourself between self-stay and investment.
Is there any theory behind the assumption that there will always be rental income in a perpetual, uninterrupted manner till end of lease?
Is there any theory behind the assumption that there will always be rental income in a perpetual, uninterrupted manner till end of lease?
Yes...and he forgot rent increase too
Is there any theory behind the assumption that there will always be rental income in a perpetual, uninterrupted manner till end of lease?
If you are House proud, renovate your House more than 30K most likely you will not always have rental income in a perpetual.
But if you bought your HDB for investment than you have a different story to tell.
Start renting my HDB since I get post oversea from 2001 from S$ 1200 a month to present S$ 2800 a month always the same story are you house proud or did you buy it for rental income.
Everytime I need to remind myself which is more important, House proud or rental income.
Yes...and he forgot rent increase too
Only investor can see the value, House owner need to think out of the Box.
Have been trying to reprogram myself after my Southbank appreciate a Million dollar in 4 years.
So sad got a 99 years leasehold property.
Rental per month S$2,800 / S$ 33,600 per years / S$ 336,000 per 10 years / S$ 2,352,000 for 70 years.
Blk 27 Balam Rd S(370027)
Lease Start Date : 01 Jul 1997
Lease Duration : 99 years
Remaining Lease : 78 years (as at date of enquiry)
https://services2.hdb.gov.sg/web/fi10/emap.html
Will you pay S$700,000 to get S$2,352,000 for 70 years of rental income not adjusted for inflation.
Don't know is it good to kill the golden goose to get the eggs.
Please do not confuse yourself between self-stay and investment.
By using simplified calculation and 80/20 Theory:
Price 700k
Down Payment: 140k
80% renting income (20% vacant) = 0.80*2,352,000 = 1,881,600
Profit $ = 1,881,600 - 700,000 = 1,181,600
Profit % = 1,181,600/140,000 = 844%
Assuming inflation is 0%
Not many people understand the meaning of Mortgage is good loan. People only see the interest rate they do not calculate the inflation rate.
By using simplified calculation and 80/20 Theory:
Price 700k
Down Payment: 140k
80% renting income (20% vacant) = 0.80*2,352,000 = 1,881,600
Profit $ = 1,881,600 - 700,000 = 1,181,600
Profit % = 1,181,600/140,000 = 844%
Assuming inflation is 0%
Not many people understand the meaning of Mortgage is good loan. People only see the interest rate they do not calculate the inflation rate.
Wow, another investor level owner. Learn something new today.
If one will calculate 700k for 78 years.
You will be consuming (700,000/78)/12=747.86 a month with zero inflation rental so cheap where to find.
Every month save S$ 2000.
You save S$ 2000x12x78 = S$ 1,872,000.
This is what you call 99 leasehold HDB value will be zero when it reaches 99 years.
MND is doing a great job programming most of the people.
Facts and Figures don't lie, only flowery word do lie.
My first lesson in Statistic, my lecturer tell us this word. The statistic doesn't lie, the one who present the statistic does.
By using simplified calculation and 80/20 Theory:
Price 700k
Down Payment: 140k
80% renting income (20% vacant) = 0.80*2,352,000 = 1,881,600
Profit $ = 1,881,600 - 700,000 = 1,181,600
Profit % = 1,181,600/140,000 = 844%
Assuming inflation is 0%
Not many people understand the meaning of Mortgage is good loan. People only see the interest rate they do not calculate the inflation rate.
These calculations are flawed.
But never mind since you guys are so convinced, I will suggest that you should buy more LH and keep them forever.
These calculations are flawed.
But never mind since you guys are so convinced, I will suggest that you should buy more LH and keep them forever.
If only I can buy more, so sad.
Yes, you can assume so if your property is in a prime good location, well-maintained, and have attractive attributes (like near MRT station and shopping malls, full and sufficient facilities for all residents to have quiet and enjoyable time to enjoy the facilities, decent residents, more than enough car parks for residents that want to park 2 cars or even 3 cars!) etc.
When crunch time comes and landlords need to fight for tenants, your unit will always get the tenant while others will have no choice but seeing their units vacant for extended periods with no tenants (e.g. during 1998 recession and 2009 recession).............
I have been through these period and I know this very well!
Obviously, some green birds and young horns will deny what I said, blah blah blah..........., but it is Ok. I let you all know first.
Is there any theory behind the assumption that there will always be rental income in a perpetual, uninterrupted manner till end of lease?
really, that is small money.......... :scared-2:
Only investor can see the value, House owner need to think out of the Box.
Have been trying to reprogram myself after my Southbank appreciate a Million dollar in 4 years.
Why restrict to 78 years?
For freehold I can take 10,000 years! :dog:
If one will calculate 700k for 78 years.
You will be consuming (700,000/78)/12=747.86 a month with zero inflation rental so cheap where to find.
Every month save S$ 2000.
You save S$ 2000x12x78 = S$ 1,872,000.
This is what you call 99 leasehold HDB value will be zero when it reaches 99 years.
MND is doing a great job programming most of the people.
Facts and Figures don't lie, only flowery word do lie.
My first lesson in Statistic, my lecturer tell us this word. The statistic doesn't lie, the one who present the statistic does.
Yes, you can assume so if your property is in a prime good location, well-maintained, and have attractive attributes (like near MRT station and shopping malls, full and sufficient facilities for all residents to have quiet and enjoyable time to enjoy the facilities, decent residents, more than enough car parks for residents that want to park 2 cars or even 3 cars!) etc.
When crunch time comes and landlords need to fight for tenants, your unit will always get the tenant while others will have no choice but seeing their units vacant for extended periods with no tenants (e.g. during 1998 recession and 2009 recession).............
I have been through these period and I know this very well!
Obviously, some green birds and young horns will deny what I said, blah blah blah..........., but it is Ok. I let you all know first.
My father use to tell me never get myself into debt, must pay finish my HDB, must buy only what I need.
He even scolded me for buying 5 room HDB when I only got one son, so when I buy condo I don't even dare to tell him in case he cannot sleep.
Not easy to reprogram yourself with all the good intend, hearsay, flowery words, statistic.
Facts and figures, the rest you decide buy, sell or rent.
I happen to be around since the 80's, miss all the cowboy action and fun.
Amber Woods
05-08-17, 17:41
Only investor can see the value, House owner need to think out of the Box.
Have been trying to reprogram myself after my Southbank appreciate a Million dollar in 4 years.
So you agreed that timing is important when buying into Southbank? What if you bought your Southbank in 2013 instead? Will you still be singing the same song?
So you agreed that timing is important when buying into Southbank? What if you bought your Southbank in 2013 instead? Will you still be singing the same song?
I will sing the same song later. Still got 3 more ten years to go if I can still sing when I am 83.
Amber Woods
05-08-17, 18:10
I will sing the same song later. Still got 3 more ten years to go if I can still sing when I am 83.
Singing the same song and doing the opposite so as to pass on the risk to others like what all developers do.
Wow, another investor level owner. Learn something new today.
Investor level ? :doh: :doh:
You had to calculate the total mortgage paid over the 25-, 30-years loan tenure. Money coming out of your pocket no need to count siboh ?
$140 k cash deployed at 2% opportunity cost per year, compounded becomes $650 k 78 years later. If CPF deployed instead of cash, the amount is even higher.
I will not hesitate to use all CPF money to buy properties (because 4% interest/return is just too low, not to mention 2.5% in CPF-OA)........... :dog:
Investor level ? :doh: :doh:
You had to calculate the total mortgage paid over the 25-, 30-years loan tenure. Money coming out of your pocket no need to count siboh ?
$140 k cash deployed at 2% opportunity cost per year, compounded becomes $650 k 78 years later. If CPF deployed instead of cash, the amount is even higher.
I agree. Switch here switch there, minimum can support 2 properties.
I will not hesitate to use all CPF money to buy properties (because 4% interest/return is just too low, not to mention 2.5% in CPF-OA)........... :dog:
Investor level ? :doh: :doh:
You had to calculate the total mortgage paid over the 25-, 30-years loan tenure. Money coming out of your pocket no need to count siboh ?
$140 k cash deployed at 2% opportunity cost per year, compounded becomes $650 k 78 years later. If CPF deployed instead of cash, the amount is even higher.
Another investor level.
There are a lot of variables depend on what you want people to know.
News reporter always reports what they want people to know, writer, write what they want people to read.
I agree. Switch here switch there, minimum can support 2 properties.
LOL, you agree but also talk about switching.
How many understand about switching anyway ?
LOL, you agree but also talk about switching.
How many understand about switching anyway ?
I don't care to share.
I don't care to share.
Kelonguni is Arcachon ?
Don't bother la.
Similar strategies similar number of properties.
But got age difference.
I use stocks to level up in double quick time but he doesn't.
He asks all who need to buy, I challenge all who need to wait.
Don't anyhow smear.
Kelonguni is Arcachon ?
Don't bother la.
Similar strategies similar number of properties.
But got age difference.
I use stocks to level up in double quick time but he doesn't.
He asks all who need to buy, I challenge all who need to wait.
Don't anyhow smear.
Please forgive him, when he reached 3000 posts he will know who is who.
Similar strategies similar number of properties.
But got age difference.
I use stocks to level up in double quick time but he doesn't.
He asks all who need to buy, I challenge all who need to wait.
Don't anyhow smear.
Sorry, it should be "Arcachon is Kelonguni ?"
Either way, was just asking why he is answering on your behalf.
Yes, you spoke about stock investment.
Please forgive him, when he reached 3000 posts he will know who is who.
You know the meaning of smearing ?
You know the meaning of smearing ?
To suggest that a forummer is posting in two voices under two identities to amplify his or her views to mislead, that is smearing to me.
He knows my strategy so he can answer on my behalf. In fact, he has a good number of years ahead of me and can point out the pitfalls and tricks ahead. He has had the sweeter juice because of earlier entry but I have had quite good deals which are gaining ground as the days pass.
If you hold a SG job securely and has CPF backing, nothing is sweeter. But there is a lot of work involved.
To suggest that a forummer is posting in two voices under two identities to amplify his or her views to mislead, that is smearing to me.
He knows my strategy so he can answer on my behalf. In fact, he has a good number of years ahead of me and can point out the pitfalls and tricks ahead. He has had the sweeter juice because of earlier entry but I have had quite good deals which are gaining ground as the days pass.
If you hold a SG job securely and has CPF backing, nothing is sweeter. But there is a lot of work involved.
Sure, if you said so.
To suggest that a forummer is posting in two voices under two identities to amplify his or her views to mislead, that is smearing to me.
He knows my strategy so he can answer on my behalf. In fact, he has a good number of years ahead of me and can point out the pitfalls and tricks ahead. He has had the sweeter juice because of earlier entry but I have had quite good deals which are gaining ground as the days pass.
If you hold a SG job securely and has CPF backing, nothing is sweeter. But there is a lot of work involved.
You should know a worm once cut split into two. even though its the same worm
You should know a worm once cut split into two. even though its the same worm
Bro, not nice leh.
And not all worms survive after splitting.
You should know a worm once cut split into two. even though its the same worm
Wah, so many worms congregating !
You meant worms that speak for each other are from the same.
He said it was smearing, I arm chio lo. In the first place, I never implied that they are the same and therefore the question why one was answering for the other. He clarified Arcachon can speak for him now mah.
Ownself smears ownself :doh:
There is no need to resort to derogatory language to make our point. :)
Wah, so many worms congregating !
You meant worms that speak for each other are from the same.
He said it was smearing, I arm chio lo. In the first place, I never implied that they are the same and therefore the question why one was answering for the other. He clarified Arcachon can speak for him now mah.
Ownself smears ownself :doh:
You know the meaning of smearing ?
Newbie, when you reach 3000 post than talk.
Maybe you are the one that get boot out of this forum, for your info a few of them got boot out. Hope you are not one of them. Be polite and educated when posting people appreciate value add not rubbish.
I like this quote.
Lastly, remember Lee Kuan Yew definition of a educated man.
An educated man is a man never stop learning and want to learn more.
interesting exchange.
this part has me baffled.
H was asking K "How many understand about switching anyway ?"
A answered "I don't care to share."
K added "He knows my strategy so he can answer on my behalf"
i am baffled how H asking K about numbers of people understanding switching becomes K knew that A knew K's strategy.
or perhaps this is another case of misreading "60LH, the bank will also not finance the last 30-years lease, when its price will surely decline to zero."
and A's response is interesting. why the need to mentioned about possibility of H being booted out. and why is 3000 a magic number.
(don't worry Ted and Min has called each other lying scumbags for ages, and they are still fine.)
as usual, lots of obfuscation and smoke when caught.
I know to extend the life of a condo in itself is not possible. But to act as own developer is possible. Lets say u have a 60 years condo. The residents can decide to pool money every month for the next 30 years to torn down and rebuilt a new condo that intensify the use of land. maybe in the end one condo can yield 2 condo.
has anybody worked out the sums involved?
Discourse analysis: it's not stated exactly when the price becomes zero. If it means at the end of 30 years, it's so common sense that the statement becomes an Oxleymoron. My interpretation was more at the point of refinance at the beginning of the last 30 years when banks so called would not provide finance if someone wants to buy.
Even TB understands how to use CPF optimally. Trust us when we say that 2.5% is Super underutilising the full potential of CPF. Safe but silly in current climate.
interesting exchange.
this part has me baffled.
H was asking K "How many understand about switching anyway ?"
A answered "I don't care to share."
K added "He knows my strategy so he can answer on my behalf"
i am baffled how H asking K about numbers of people understanding switching becomes K knew that A knew K's strategy.
or perhaps this is another case of misreading "60LH, the bank will also not finance the last 30-years lease, when its price will surely decline to zero."
and A's response is interesting. why the need to mentioned about possibility of H being booted out. and why is 3000 a magic number.
(don't worry Ted and Min has called each other lying scumbags for ages, and they are still fine.)
as usual, lots of obfuscation and smoke when caught.
interesting exchange.
this part has me baffled.
H was asking K "How many understand about switching anyway ?"
A answered "I don't care to share."
K added "He knows my strategy so he can answer on my behalf"
i am baffled how H asking K about numbers of people understanding switching becomes K knew that A knew K's strategy.
or perhaps this is another case of misreading "60LH, the bank will also not finance the last 30-years lease, when its price will surely decline to zero."
and A's response is interesting. why the need to mentioned about possibility of H being booted out. and why is 3000 a magic number.
(don't worry Ted and Min has called each other lying scumbags for ages, and they are still fine.)
as usual, lots of obfuscation and smoke when caught.
I am not getting involved with the blockheads but will still post against fake news.
Earlier, I looked into his thread postings when you first mentioned YT. His equity vs debt ratio when purchasing the Landed was actually healthier than one of the blockheads’ today; debt sustainability not much different. And yet the blockhead's is sung today, his a grand strategy.
If YT had made his move 3 years earlier, probably he made $2 mi for that area. It was the timing of his purchase, and also ignoring downside risks. C’est la vie, he should move on and we wish him the best in recovery.
Property investment, can make money also can make one a bankrupt. Knowing the pitfalls is the foundation of sound property investment.
tonymontana
09-08-17, 09:50
YT had 2m equity in his landed and debt of 1.8m, in the event of foreclosure he should still have at least 1m+ back in cash. so not really sure if I believe that story or not.
YT had 2m equity in his landed and debt of 1.8m, in the event of foreclosure he should still have at least 1m+ back in cash. so not really sure if I believe that story or not.
Most can talk until the cow come home and you still don't know what they have.
There is only one and only One call Arcachon.
For those who don't know the name called Arcachon can check out the link.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcachon
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/424439_4575096648379_557673909_n.jpg?oh=9c7309d1a59d3c91a78fd6c6f8f1a7a8&oe=5A25A331
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/553435_4575099888460_583969690_n.jpg?oh=3667a13d6c85969a4dbc4f626389bfe9&oe=59EC6C7F
I miss the place.
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/12239739_10206250464113446_1631187946186504319_n.jpg?oh=e5490e8fc29252eb6a6dc1435d793ee2&oe=59EF1A3D
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/12235134_10206250466393503_7015816433803624783_n.jpg?oh=1216b736b8592a4bda6cbb79434115ae&oe=5A2FD73B
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/546479_3871775025778_722160458_n.jpg?oh=9eba6a81d7349fc41c648b7f5e2cfab5&oe=59EC42CB
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/10482_3871774585767_1623796591_n.jpg?oh=25a687190689037cb927ec7835ae99c5&oe=59EF0C33
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/400373_3871773785747_962695722_n.jpg?oh=94ba2b7cc68c220d3e1256d5a8d8e43d&oe=59F5F1CC
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/427365_3871773385737_1381582932_n.jpg?oh=7eeea34157f26e0d1336317686580878&oe=59F89902
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/1917162_1213295445450_5788523_n.jpg?oh=49cce8af667e1f64dd509f0f5a94490d&oe=5A3352A3
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