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skeptikos
28-07-09, 16:03
Does anyone know which bank has fixed rate packages for uncompleted projects?

Heard that local and foreign banks here are only offering floating rates for uncompleted projects.... is that true? :doh: If that's the case which bank has the most competitive package?

hkching
29-07-09, 00:50
Does anyone know which bank has fixed rate packages for uncompleted projects?

Heard that local and foreign banks here are only offering floating rates for uncompleted projects.... is that true? :doh: If that's the case which bank has the most competitive package?

Fixed rates are rather high right now. SIBOR linked rates are lower.
If u want fixed rates, I think DBS has some decent ones. For SIBOR linked rates, Citibank and HSBC are attractive. For SIBOR linked rates, advisable to look for a non-lockin package as no-one can predict how the interest rates may move.

Just my 2 cents worth. :)

WolleyDragon
29-07-09, 08:37
Does anyone know which bank has fixed rate packages for uncompleted projects?

Heard that local and foreign banks here are only offering floating rates for uncompleted projects.... is that true? :doh: If that's the case which bank has the most competitive package?

you can check with maybank.. they have 2 types;

for projects that TOP within 6 mths, there's a package of 1st Yr 1.6%, 2nd Yr 2.2%, 3rd Yr 2.9% & 4th onwards 3.75%

for uncompleted projects, similar package but variation only on 2nd yr, 1st Yr 1.6%, 2nd Yr 2.6%, 3rd Yr 2.9% & 4th onwards 3.75%..

you should go down to the branch and speak to them.. I was provided with a loans officer who fcuked up most of the time.. end I was forwarded to a branch mgr (after complaining abt the loans officer) who handled my loan professionally and effectively.

rattydrama
29-07-09, 10:51
you can check with maybank.. they have 2 types;

for projects that TOP within 6 mths, there's a package of 1st Yr 1.6%, 2nd Yr 2.2%, 3rd Yr 2.9% & 4th onwards 3.75%

for uncompleted projects, similar package but variation only on 2nd yr, 1st Yr 1.6%, 2nd Yr 2.6%, 3rd Yr 2.9% & 4th onwards 3.75%..

you should go down to the branch and speak to them.. I was provided with a loans officer who fcuked up most of the time.. end I was forwarded to a branch mgr (after complaining abt the loans officer) who handled my loan professionally and effectively.


I know Citi if offering SIBOR + 1.25%. You can select 1/3/6/912 month SIBOR. SC and others have it as well except 1 month SIBOR which is a 0.2 difference from 3 month SIBOR.

Plus if you have lots of cash, you can open another account link to your mortgage loan and this will earn you interest of 70% of what you have paid for. For example SIBOR + 1.25% is 1.67%. So interest rate that bank will offer you is 1.169 (70% of the interest rate paid) for your deposit. However, you cannot take out the interest earn but to use this interest earn to pay up your housing loan. This will mean that you will get to pay off your loan faster than usual as it usually reduce your principle - as to how much will need to be calculated.

There is no log in period and no penality except you will need to pay 1% back to the bank in the event that you wish to redeem the loan for amount not yet disbursed. This is usually apply to project under construction. For completed projects, the 1% does not apply.

Take note there is a clawback of legal subsidy + survey fees should you break the contract within 3 years.

I have spent about 3 weeks to understand all the different rates offered by various bank and evaluate their pros and cons and the risk I will be taking if I accept a certain package.

Fixed rate may give you a peace of your mind but the interest rate that you will be paying is more as the initial quantum of your loan is high. This is because the bank is bearing some of your risk by giving your fix rate. However, I view that the buffer is pretty high.

End of the day, in the event of an adverse economic suitation, the bank have the rights under their fine print to adjust the rates be it fix rate or SIBOR link. I remember that has happened before.

skeptikos
29-07-09, 11:09
I read on SC's website that they have a similar interest off-set product called MortgageOne except that it seems to offer more interest on deposit than Citi - 2/3 on your loan interest + 1/3 on 0.5%, i.e. if we use your example of 1.67% interest will be 1.28% which is more than Citi's. Can't seem to find info on Citi's calculation on their website though so correct me if I'm wrong with the comparison.



I know Citi if offering SIBOR + 1.25%. You can select 1/3/6/912 month SIBOR. SC and others have it as well except 1 month SIBOR which is a 0.2 difference from 3 month SIBOR.

Plus if you have lots of cash, you can open another account link to your mortgage loan and this will earn you interest of 70% of what you have paid for. For example SIBOR + 1.25% is 1.67%. So interest rate that bank will offer you is 1.169 (70% of the interest rate paid) for your deposit. However, you cannot take out the interest earn but to use this interest earn to pay up your housing loan. This will mean that you will get to pay off your loan faster than usual as it usually reduce your principle - as to how much will need to be calculated.

There is no log in period and no penality except you will need to pay 1% back to the bank in the event that you wish to redeem the loan for amount not yet disbursed. This is usually apply to project under construction. For completed projects, the 1% does not apply.

Take note there is a clawback of legal subsidy + survey fees should you break the contract within 3 years.

I have spent about 3 weeks to understand all the different rates offered by various bank and evaluate their pros and cons and the risk I will be taking if I accept a certain package.

Fixed rate may give you a peace of your mind but the interest rate that you will be paying is more as the initial quantum of your loan is high. This is because the bank is bearing some of your risk by giving your fix rate. However, I view that the buffer is pretty high.

End of the day, in the event of an adverse economic suitation, the bank have the rights under their fine print to adjust the rates be it fix rate or SIBOR link. I remember that has happened before.

rattydrama
29-07-09, 11:37
I read on SC's website that they have a similar interest off-set product called MortgageOne except that it seems to offer more interest on deposit than Citi - 2/3 on your loan interest + 1/3 on 0.5%, i.e. if we use your example of 1.67% interest will be 1.28% which is more than Citi's. Can't seem to find info on Citi's calculation on their website though so correct me if I'm wrong with the comparison.

I asked SC before, but it seems that the loan officer is not interested in presenting me on the mortgage one concept. If my memories dont fail, I will need to set aside a min sum of 50K as deposit for a start.

However, Citi approached me with a very clear understanding as they have been doing this tie up for almost a decade. The loan officer knows the concept very well.

Something I forgot to add earlier, if you have 200K in bank as cash, the rate will be SIBOR + 1.2%. (and not 1.25%) This will also upgrade you to some gold member which I am not keen but with the 0.02% discount - I calculated it is just a few hundred bucks for a 1m loan.

Ya fire insurance is not free for citi package and you have to purchase it separately. For project under construction, no need to buy fire insurance. Upon TOP then you need to buy so dont get too excited if banks offer you fire insurance for project under construction.

I prefer to do package which is not a new concept but a tested and stable package with lots of room for me to negotiate with banks due to different situation that may arise in the near future.

When buying a property most of us will want for stay but due to unforeseen circumstances, you may want to sell off, buy another property if strike a lottery, rent out, so the loan package that you are taking must be able to support a decision that you want to make at a later time. Otherwise, you may end up paying my estimate of 8K to 15K-20K additional sum for a 1m loan if you decided to break the loan. This is on top of paying agent fee of 1 to 2% as commission.

There are some bank who charge higher rates if they know that the property you buy is for investment so ask the loan officer before you sign the dotted line. Best take some time to read and understand the fine print.

I am not an expert or an absolute investor. I want to be careful with my hard earn money. I use common sense in my evaluation. So the sum could be a lot for a wrong move.

:-)

teddybear
29-07-09, 12:25
End of the day, in the event of an adverse economic suitation, the bank have the rights under their fine print to adjust the rates be it fix rate or SIBOR link.

Are you sure bank have the rights to adjust fixed rate interest rate? (I have never heard of before). Which bank you experienced this or heard people experienced this?


I know Citi if offering SIBOR + 1.25%. You can select 1/3/6/912 month SIBOR. SC and others have it as well except 1 month SIBOR which is a 0.2 difference from 3 month SIBOR.

Plus if you have lots of cash, you can open another account link to your mortgage loan and this will earn you interest of 70% of what you have paid for. For example SIBOR + 1.25% is 1.67%. So interest rate that bank will offer you is 1.169 (70% of the interest rate paid) for your deposit. However, you cannot take out the interest earn but to use this interest earn to pay up your housing loan. This will mean that you will get to pay off your loan faster than usual as it usually reduce your principle - as to how much will need to be calculated.

There is no log in period and no penality except you will need to pay 1% back to the bank in the event that you wish to redeem the loan for amount not yet disbursed. This is usually apply to project under construction. For completed projects, the 1% does not apply.

Take note there is a clawback of legal subsidy + survey fees should you break the contract within 3 years.

I have spent about 3 weeks to understand all the different rates offered by various bank and evaluate their pros and cons and the risk I will be taking if I accept a certain package.

Fixed rate may give you a peace of your mind but the interest rate that you will be paying is more as the initial quantum of your loan is high. This is because the bank is bearing some of your risk by giving your fix rate. However, I view that the buffer is pretty high.

End of the day, in the event of an adverse economic suitation, the bank have the rights under their fine print to adjust the rates be it fix rate or SIBOR link. I remember that has happened before.

rattydrama
29-07-09, 14:50
Are you sure bank have the rights to adjust fixed rate interest rate? (I have never heard of before). Which bank you experienced this or heard people experienced this?


It is clearly stated in the letter of offer saying they have the rights to change. I read from the straits time forum some few years ago but I could not remember typically when cos that time was not too interested in mortgage loan. The owner say the interest rates where high and complaint in the forum. Of course, bank will not "anyhow" up the interest rates and ruin their reputation. However, if there is a need for them to do it, they have the rights under the contract.

august
29-07-09, 15:52
I know Citi if offering SIBOR + 1.25%. You can select 1/3/6/912 month SIBOR. SC and others have it as well except 1 month SIBOR which is a 0.2 difference from 3 month SIBOR.

Plus if you have lots of cash, you can open another account link to your mortgage loan and this will earn you interest of 70% of what you have paid for. For example SIBOR + 1.25% is 1.67%. So interest rate that bank will offer you is 1.169 (70% of the interest rate paid) for your deposit. However, you cannot take out the interest earn but to use this interest earn to pay up your housing loan. This will mean that you will get to pay off your loan faster than usual as it usually reduce your principle - as to how much will need to be calculated.

There is no log in period and no penality except you will need to pay 1% back to the bank in the event that you wish to redeem the loan for amount not yet disbursed. This is usually apply to project under construction. For completed projects, the 1% does not apply.

Take note there is a clawback of legal subsidy + survey fees should you break the contract within 3 years.

I have spent about 3 weeks to understand all the different rates offered by various bank and evaluate their pros and cons and the risk I will be taking if I accept a certain package.

Fixed rate may give you a peace of your mind but the interest rate that you will be paying is more as the initial quantum of your loan is high. This is because the bank is bearing some of your risk by giving your fix rate. However, I view that the buffer is pretty high.

End of the day, in the event of an adverse economic suitation, the bank have the rights under their fine print to adjust the rates be it fix rate or SIBOR link. I remember that has happened before.

iirc this 1% only applies within the 1st 3 yr period rite? :confused:

teddybear
29-07-09, 21:20
There are usually 4 type of housing loans based their the type of interest rates charged:
- fixed rate : fixed means "fixed", bank can't change.
- SIBOR-linked rate : typically can be 3-mth, 6-mth, or 12-mth re-pegged at new rate.
- SOR-linked rate : Similar to SIBOR but not sure how they calculate.
- Bank prime rate - x%: used to be this type. Bank can change as they like, no transparency at all.

Never heard that "fixed rate" can be changed. If you have seen news publication on this, let us know.


It is clearly stated in the letter of offer saying they have the rights to change. I read from the straits time forum some few years ago but I could not remember typically when cos that time was not too interested in mortgage loan. The owner say the interest rates where high and complaint in the forum. Of course, bank will not "anyhow" up the interest rates and ruin their reputation. However, if there is a need for them to do it, they have the rights under the contract.

rattydrama
29-07-09, 23:12
iirc this 1% only applies within the 1st 3 yr period rite? :confused:

refer to Building under construction. eg. When TOP the bank disburse around 85% of the loan amount so the balance of 15% undisbursed loan will subject to 1% bank charge if you redeem the loan. Another example is upon obtaining CSC, the bank will disburse the full loan amount and you shall NOT be subjected to 1% bank charge.

Hope this is clear.

rattydrama
30-07-09, 00:29
There are usually 4 type of housing loans based their the type of interest rates charged:
- fixed rate : fixed means "fixed", bank can't change.
- SIBOR-linked rate : typically can be 3-mth, 6-mth, or 12-mth re-pegged at new rate.
- SOR-linked rate : Similar to SIBOR but not sure how they calculate.
- Bank prime rate - x%: used to be this type. Bank can change as they like, no transparency at all.

Never heard that "fixed rate" can be changed. If you have seen news publication on this, let us know.


My earlier post did not consider the fixed for 3 years type of loan at absolute.

Its between

Bank prime rate - x% where Bank prime rate could be changed and x% could be changed after the log in period and (I class as fixed rate in my earlier post)

SIBOR + 1.25%, the +1.25 - can be changed at bank descretion as well.

Thanks for enlightening. :-)

duckweed
30-07-09, 16:05
My earlier post did not consider the fixed for 3 years type of loan at absolute.

Its between

Bank prime rate - x% where Bank prime rate could be changed and x% could be changed after the log in period and (I class as fixed rate in my earlier post)

SIBOR + 1.25%, the +1.25 - can be changed at bank descretion as well.

Thanks for enlightening. :-)

regarding your statement highlighted in blue.... it depends on your loan package. if the SIBOR + x% is valid for z years, then, yes, x% will vary once z years are up. x% should not vary within that z year period.

i happen to have a package that says SIBOR+0.65% for as long as the loan is in place. have clarified and confirmed with bank earlier, 0.65% will not change. only change is the SIBOR rate.

teddybear
30-07-09, 16:56
Wah you have a good deal hah! Which bank is that? Now it seems the x% is much higher than previously (something like 1.25% to 1.75%!).


regarding your statement highlighted in blue.... it depends on your loan package. if the SIBOR + x% is valid for z years, then, yes, x% will vary once z years are up. x% should not vary within that z year period.

i happen to have a package that says SIBOR+0.65% for as long as the loan is in place. have clarified and confirmed with bank earlier, 0.65% will not change. only change is the SIBOR rate.

wilander
30-07-09, 17:10
regarding your statement highlighted in blue.... it depends on your loan package. if the SIBOR + x% is valid for z years, then, yes, x% will vary once z years are up. x% should not vary within that z year period.

i happen to have a package that says SIBOR+0.65% for as long as the loan is in place. have clarified and confirmed with bank earlier, 0.65% will not change. only change is the SIBOR rate.

Can let me know which bank is it?

Thanks

skeptikos
30-07-09, 17:22
On a separate note, a few banks also off to pay for legal fees with cap at $2,500 - does it usually cost more than $2,500 to find a lawyer to do the legal stuff? :beats-me-man:

teddybear
30-07-09, 17:59
Yes. Make sure you have agreement on price with the lawyer before appointing them. A typical price is legal fee $2500, mortgage fee $500. You may squeeze them a bit to reduce to total $2500.


On a separate note, a few banks also off to pay for legal fees with cap at $2,500 - does it usually cost more than $2,500 to find a lawyer to do the legal stuff? :beats-me-man:

duckweed
30-07-09, 20:14
Can let me know which bank is it?

Thanks
teddybear and wilander,
sorry to get have gotten you guys a tad excited, but don't think this package is available any more. it was taken up last year in apr/may. btw, it's from the one that inculcates loyalty.

teddybear
30-07-09, 20:32
Oh sad to hear that. Good deal don't last long. :(


teddybear and wilander,
sorry to get have gotten you guys a tad excited, but don't think this package is available any more. it was taken up last year in apr/may. btw, it's from the one that inculcates loyalty.

rattydrama
30-07-09, 23:41
regarding your statement highlighted in blue.... it depends on your loan package. if the SIBOR + x% is valid for z years, then, yes, x% will vary once z years are up. x% should not vary within that z year period.

i happen to have a package that says SIBOR+0.65% for as long as the loan is in place. have clarified and confirmed with bank earlier, 0.65% will not change. only change is the SIBOR rate.

Unfortunately there isn't offer of this kind as far as I know now. What I see is that it is SIBOR + x% where x% is subject to change - and clearly spelt out in the offer letter. However, the banker assured me that so far there is no precedent yet.

You can read more from http://www.homeloan.com.sg/newsletter

cheers

skeptikos
31-07-09, 10:52
What's the difference between legal fee and mortgage fee? Aren't they all related to legal stuff such that the $2500 includes mortgage fee as well? Sounds to me a marketing trick to separate out a "mortgage fee" to charge extra... :tongue3:



Yes. Make sure you have agreement on price with the lawyer before appointing them. A typical price is legal fee $2500, mortgage fee $500. You may squeeze them a bit to reduce to total $2500.

d12pxgoskyhigh
01-08-09, 01:14
[quote=rattydrama]Unfortunately there isn't offer of this kind as far as I know now. What I see is that it is SIBOR + x% where x% is subject to change - and clearly spelt out in the offer letter. However, the banker assured me that so far there is no precedent yet.

You can read more from http://www.homeloan.com.sg/newsletter

cheers

SIBOR is a variable, x% also a variable...
SIBOR at least has a basis, it is based on lending rates...
What will cause x% to change? Any basis?
Surely it cannot be based on the bank's discretion....

duckweed
01-08-09, 23:52
What's the difference between legal fee and mortgage fee? Aren't they all related to legal stuff such that the $2500 includes mortgage fee as well? Sounds to me a marketing trick to separate out a "mortgage fee" to charge extra... :tongue3:

mortgage fee is actually the stamp duty on mortgage. this has a cap of $500. lawyer fees quoted typically do not include this amt as they don't pocket this. you will also be charged a registration fee of $68.30 for the mortgage. there are other registration and stamp fees to pay, so you should ask the lawyer what the TOTAL figure will eventually be like, after you factor in all the additional costs.

not sure if others have similar experience, but i have noticed that the legal charges for purchase of uncompleted/subsale tend to be higher.

skeptikos
02-08-09, 11:00
and then there is GST to pay as well - I wonder if lawyer can absorb this as well so that nett amount comes up to $2500 to be fully subsidised by the bank's legal subsidy.

come to think of it I'm sure lawyers should be able to charge $2500 nett... it's just paperwork at the end of the day and there is no true cost for them except for their time! and there are so many lawyers doing this kind of work around!



mortgage fee is actually the stamp duty on mortgage. this has a cap of $500. lawyer fees quoted typically do not include this amt as they don't pocket this. you will also be charged a registration fee of $68.30 for the mortgage. there are other registration and stamp fees to pay, so you should ask the lawyer what the TOTAL figure will eventually be like, after you factor in all the additional costs.

not sure if others have similar experience, but i have noticed that the legal charges for purchase of uncompleted/subsale tend to be higher.

august
02-08-09, 12:16
and then there is GST to pay as well - I wonder if lawyer can absorb this as well so that nett amount comes up to $2500 to be fully subsidised by the bank's legal subsidy.

come to think of it I'm sure lawyers should be able to charge $2500 nett... it's just paperwork at the end of the day and there is no true cost for them except for their time! and there are so many lawyers doing this kind of work around!

2.5k is professional fees, does not include disbursements and other fees and out of pocket expenses.. so usually come up to 3 to 4k..

i think value of purchase matters also

duckweed
02-08-09, 15:04
and then there is GST to pay as well - I wonder if lawyer can absorb this as well so that nett amount comes up to $2500 to be fully subsidised by the bank's legal subsidy.

come to think of it I'm sure lawyers should be able to charge $2500 nett... it's just paperwork at the end of the day and there is no true cost for them except for their time! and there are so many lawyers doing this kind of work around!

i guess it all boils down to how well you manage to negotiate the deal with the laywer. maybe they can charge you less for their photostating and transportation costs.

do note that it's not just a matter of paying for their time and paperwork. i understand that there is also an insurance cost involved. hence, the bigger your loan quantum, the costlier the conveyancing fees.

anyways, this amt is peanuts compared to your property purchase price.