Why are New Launches doing so well compare to Secondary Market? [Archive] - Condo Forum Singapore Property Review Mortgage Loan Buy Rent Sell Real Estate

Blue

17-03-10, 01:04

Simple reasons:

1) Marketing - Developers spent a lot on marketing / showflat / agent fees. Some even goes to overseas to market.

2) Mentality - Most (if not all) people's mentality is that they rather let the Developers make more loads of $$$ than to make an individual richer. Similarly, many would not want to end up in a unit that is 30% to 40% higher cost than their neighbours who bought direct from Developer.

3) Speculation - Some buy for investment and not stay. They rather buy something that gets built in 2 yrs' time (no need to service loan so soon) than to buy a completed vacant unit which they need to rent out immediately to recover monthly cost of servicing loan.

Because of the above, many are too blind to realise that new launches nowadays are actually priced higher than secondary market in many cases. :doh:

The smart investor is one who seeks out the best deal (i.e. lowest psf with the best location and view).

But the majority investors follow the "Hello Kitty" syndrome (i.e. they just rush all out for the hot / popular deals without knowing what exactly they are buying).

mcmlxxvi

17-03-10, 08:34

One word - kiasu. Oh thats actually two words.

august

17-03-10, 10:20

One word - kiasu. Oh thats actually two words.

or lazy ... because never do homework

urban

17-03-10, 10:35

The difference is 'new'.

And of course, you have a defects liability period.

Reporter

17-03-10, 10:44

Your perspective is from that of a casino's gambler. Your crystal ball sees only a gambler's mentality of "hoping" to buy a new launch from a developer at outright 15% plus minus price higher in today's market context for a "pass" (that's what you call an option) for 3 to 4 years "hoping" to offload at a profit along the way, while serving progressive payments blah blah blah...('cos no IAS now). But the gambler will soon realise that the gap between the new launch and resale are widening at very fast pace with current rate going......

Look at these:- Cairnhill's Urban Suites ($2800 psf ave. almost 100% sold, if subsales can be found in market now guess how much?); Laurels ($3000 psf ave. - 135 taken up out of 179 previewed on last weekend); L'VIV ($2050 psf ave. - 110 taken up out of 147 officially launched only last weekend too); Altez (from $2250 psf now selling the 2 bedrooms loft at #30 floor and above and guess what already as of yesterday 15 units out of 36 available have been snapped up and feo not releasing any more units as of now...); waterscape at cavenagh (from $2000 psf now with limited units left out of 190 over launch since jan'10...); centennia suites (around 30 out of 97 taken as of yesterday at ave. $2100psf)....Trilight also selling reasonably well with ave. psf 1800 to 1900 now....New Launch Bukit Sembawang's The Vermont at Cairnhill aka besides VIDA lah....ranging $2500 psf to $3000 psf.....(take-up rates to be seen lah...) you mean we have so many "high rollers" around........

c'mon, resale not moving because:-
(1) banks have problems since jan'10 to match sellers' asking prices valuations....also
(2) resale sellers now keep on shifting goal posts as prices of new launches keep going up.....
(3) agents not so keen to service resale market with the new launch market so hot and easy to move....sell 1 new launch 0.3% and 1 resale 1 to 1.5% is like selling 3 to 4 new equivalent to 1 resale....why not go for new launch that sell like roti prata....
(4) buyers have no time to react that the value of difference between the 2 is huge and in no time when this gap gets bigger it will push them to resale market...

all property market boom is like that : New Launch (first movers); then nearby subsale (better value); then resale (no fish prawn also good - let's not miss out the party).
Have some patience, gentlemen!

Everyone likes new cars from the showrooms too but I believe the 2nd-hand cars will have a chance in the coming weeks and months.

My previous subsales have benefitted from runaway new sale prices. A lot of patience was needed. I tell myself to exercise the same patience this time and watch the new sale prices rocket.

saab

17-03-10, 11:00

Have some patience, gentlemen!

Everyone likes new cars from the showrooms too but I believe the 2nd-hand cars will have a chance in the coming weeks and months.

My previous subsales have benefitted from runaway new sale prices. A lot of patience was needed. I tell myself to exercise the same patience this time and watch the new sale prices rocket.

Thanks REPORTER.....just don't wish that stingrad too narrow on his "high rollers" perspective and provided only "gamblers' mentality in property market" to this forum...i just "spouting" out the facts which i gather from the market and highlight them as it is here.....If there are really so many "highrollers" around like what stingray has said.....cannot be right.

proud owner

17-03-10, 11:00

Property_Owner

17-03-10, 11:29

reasons :

1 buy new at show flat ..good chance to be photograph ..maybe TV

2 every one know i got money

3 easy mah ..just follow the buttock in front ..they run, i run, they turn i turn ... HERD instinct

4 at show flat , got free packet drinks

5 if lucky , can go back with a nicer pair of shoes ...so many to choose from .. if rain ..maybe can grab a free umbrella

6 view old condo ? so hot, owner never turn on aircon

7 old unit ? got murder or suicide or not ?

8 old unit ? so hard to get bank loan to match valuation

9 at show flat ,, all loans will be approved .. so easy to get loan

10 old unit ? so big .. how to clean ? MM unit better ..

11 old unit ? no planter.. i like decking, i like bay windows .. can saw off 2 legs of my table and slide over bay window ..so innovative ..so clever

.
.
.
.
enuff reasons ?

12. Showroom agents babes and hulks. Smile @ u non stop.
Subsale agent old, fat and ugly, what are the chances of meeting a pretty agent? With photocopy floorplans meet you at macdonald drink ice tea.
Resale agent late, can't get viewing, some come in jeans and t shirt.

13. Resale units owners/tenants didn't tidy up before viewing. I once view a unit with rubbish all over. Tenant worse was in shorts and single with a weird odour, baby was sleeping in room, can't view tat room.
Showroom diff, everything was in order.....lots of ID.....

14. Old units likely to spend money for renovation. New launch they do up everything already. Dun have to think so much..

proud owner

17-03-10, 11:32

12. Showroom agents babes and hulks. Smile @ u non stop.
Subsale agent old, fat and ugly, what are the chances of meeting a pretty agent? With photocopy floorplans meet you at macdonald drink ice tea.
Resale agent late, can't get viewing, some come in jeans and t shirt.

13. Resale units owners/tenants didn't tidy up before viewing. I once view a unit with rubbish all over. Tenant worse was in shorts and single with a weird odour, baby was sleeping in room, can't view tat room.
Showroom diff, everything was in order.....lots of ID.....

14. Old units likely to spend money for renovation. New launch they do up everything already. Dun have to think so much..

15 i once viewed an old unit ..owner blast hi fi set so loud ...to mask the noise from the road level

Blue

17-03-10, 11:57

Secondary market unit not necessary are old units. Some have yet to TOP. We term these as subsale.

jitkiat

17-03-10, 12:31

Singaporeans are very trusting of agents/developers .... government sure protect our interest ... remind me of the Lehman Minibonds saga

stalingrad

17-03-10, 12:44

15 i once viewed an old unit ..owner blast hi fi set so loud ...to mask the noise from the road level
that is nothing compared with the tactics employed by developers. examples abound:

(1) coerce their employees and associates to buy to create false demand.
(2) label their above-ground car parks as plazas.
(3) bait and switch. show you marble floors but give you homogeneous tiles.
(4) sell you condos on breath taking views which are just views of rusty old cranes in harbours.
(5) sell you mickey mouse units that you are stuck with for the rest of your life.
...

saab

17-03-10, 14:09

that is nothing compared with the tactics employed by developers. examples abound:

(1) coerce their employees and associates to buy to create false demand.
If their employees or associates no money or not willing or to coerce?

(2) label their above-ground car parks as plazas.
It's true if there are shops there on 1st level, not wrong.

(3) bait and switch. show you marble floors but give you homogeneous tiles.
Which developers have done it in S'pore so far...you want to share? This is a very serious allegation....to developers....

(4) sell you condos on breath taking views which are just views of rusty old cranes in harbours.
Buyers own due diligence....don't take all on the surface....they are not wrong to say there are sea views but they are not wrong too that there are old cranes and harbours....they never say that is not part of seaview..

(5) sell you mickey mouse units that you are stuck with for the rest of your life.
This is your own assumption so far....may not be like what you say...think you are too extreme in your view

...Think you are too extreme in your perspective...have you been burnt very badly by property market......that you have to mislead in a negative direction...

Property_Owner

17-03-10, 14:20

Originally Posted by bullman

Yup I have checked with the agent and it will be demolished. I also heard that the show flat has been closed and the official launch will be on Sat without the 4% discount anymore! Should have just grabbed the two bedder last Friday.

Anyway, congrats to all Coralis buyers who are now laughing their way to the bank.

Originally Posted by greenhorn
Bullman,

Go for it. Discount is still on till tmr. Stop procrastinating if you wanna grab a 2 bdrm unit, if not don't wail once its over... "should have..."

Yes boss,
I have just booked a high floor stack 2. Hope its a right move.

The bull is out

bullman

17-03-10, 14:38

The bull is out

haha. Yes bro. I am a bull sometimes. Just bought it so that can register my address for my son next year to register for Tao Nan. Hope that the psf dun drop to half price in the next down cycle then I am ok liao. :D

stalingrad

17-03-10, 15:13

Think you are too extreme in your perspective...have you been burnt very badly by property market......that you have to mislead in a negative direction...

who is extreme? I think you are, you are extremely naive. See below the post from the vision.

FYI the marble on the walls of all rooms will not be included in the actual unit The showroom decor n finishing somehow deceiving if you don't ask the detail .

Blue

17-03-10, 15:22

haha. Yes bro. I am a bull sometimes. Just bought it so that can register my address for my son next year to register for Tao Nan. Hope that the psf dun drop to half price in the next down cycle then I am ok liao. :D

Thot I saw somewhere in the internet that Tao Nan is shifting out of East Coast?

stalingrad

17-03-10, 15:27

Thot I saw somewhere in the internet that Tao Nan is shifting out of East Coast?
don't say that and break his heart. even today, so many singaporean parents think that it is very important that they put their kids in star schools.

let me tell you from my person experience, it is not the school that counts, it is how much time you put into educating your kids yourself. so many think "if I put my kids in this or that schools, he is going to be alright." not so, you need to put your own time and effort into your kids' education. if you did not, your kids will turn out badly even if you put him or her in nanyang.

jlrx

17-03-10, 17:44

(5) sell you mickey mouse units that you are stuck with for the rest of your life.
Think you are too extreme in your perspective...have you been burnt very badly by property market......that you have to mislead in a negative direction...

I know some members here are quite bored by my news clippings, which appeared again and again.

I'm so sorry about that but I have to bring them up again to defend our beloved Mickey Mouse.

The Observer

Sunday 16 March 2003

Imagine paying more than £100,000 for a 300 sq ft flat and having to throw out half your clothes to fit into it.

This was reality for 23-year-old sales negotiator Francesca Osborne when she bought her flat in London's Islington 18 months ago. She paid £108,000, and at last count the flat was worth £155,000, despite its diminutive dimensions.

She is not alone in paying prices that, to many, will seem silly for tiny homes. Agents say that there are more buyers chasing small flats than properties available. This is just as well because the Microflat - a trademarked blueprint of a super-svelte living space, which is big on design and small on expense - is being hailed as one solution to Britain's inner city housing crisis.

http://www.themicroflatcompany.com/IMAGES/micro_flat/top_plan.jpg

Since the early 1980s property merchants have been exploiting the premium on land, turning anything from large rooms and small glory holes into self-contained shoe boxes. These 'feature' beds suspended from the ceiling, kitchenettes on castors that disappear behind a wall, and shower trays that fold down over the lavatory.

One of the first of its kind was, literally, a converted broom cupboard :doh: in a mansion block opposite Harrods. Eyebrows rose when, in 1986, it sold for £35,000. Today, experts have no trouble keeping a straight face when they value it £110,000.

A quick survey of estate agents' shop windows reveals how serious such silly street valuations have become. Stern Studio is advertising a 10ft by 11ft apartment in Earls Court for £125,000.It also has a 15ft by 8ft apartment in Chelsea for £145,000. Director Tom Trudgeon says: 'Half of London seems to want to buy them.'

Equally upbeat is Gordon Blausten, senior partner at Bruten & Co. He has a 13.2ft by 9.9ft apartment in Kensington on his books for £150,000. Thompson Cur rie just sold a 200 sq ft apartment in Clerkenwell for £155,000. Sales manager Ben Burston says: 'I could have sold it 40 times over.'

Here’s an apartment to beat all of the other little boxes out there. Welcome to London, home of possibly the smallest apartment in the world. This 62 square foot flat :scared-4: has all the necessities that $247 a week can buy: a platform bed, bath, wardrobe, and kitchenette (if you can call it that).

http://www.biggerpockets.com/images/blog/smallapt.jpg

bullman

17-03-10, 17:53

Thot I saw somewhere in the internet that Tao Nan is shifting out of East Coast?

Only shifting out for 1 to 2 years then shift back. They expanding the current premises. Cheers

mcmlxxvi

17-03-10, 17:56

that is nothing compared with the tactics employed by developers. examples abound:

(1) coerce their employees and associates to buy to create false demand.
(2) label their above-ground car parks as plazas.
(3) bait and switch. show you marble floors but give you homogeneous tiles.
(4) sell you condos on breath taking views which are just views of rusty old cranes in harbours.
(5) sell you mickey mouse units that you are stuck with for the rest of your life.
...

Some even deploy the timeshare sales tactic of striking gong or stand up applause when close a unit. ... smells fishy?

ksh

17-03-10, 18:13

" I'm buying because everybody is buying " , never fall into this
stupid assumption...:tsk-tsk:

mantrix

17-03-10, 18:17

Most of time people would be lured by new flats as resale ones beg the questions of reno, aircon replacement, old paint etc etc - imagination far outweighs visual impression hence the flocking to new condos.

No right no wrong lah, just typical singaporean mentality :tongue3:

EBD

17-03-10, 18:18

Enough reasons for me..... except all upside down :)

reasons :

1 buy new at show flat ..good chance to be photograph ..maybe TV

2 every one know i got money

3 easy mah ..just follow the buttock in front ..they run, i run, they turn i turn ... HERD instinct

4 at show flat , got free packet drinks

5 if lucky , can go back with a nicer pair of shoes ...so many to choose from .. if rain ..maybe can grab a free umbrella

6 view old condo ? so hot, owner never turn on aircon

7 old unit ? got murder or suicide or not ?

8 old unit ? so hard to get bank loan to match valuation

9 at show flat ,, all loans will be approved .. so easy to get loan

10 old unit ? so big .. how to clean ? MM unit better ..

11 old unit ? no planter.. i like decking, i like bay windows .. can saw off 2 legs of my table and slide over bay window ..so innovative ..so clever

.
.
.
.
enuff reasons ?

EBD

17-03-10, 18:34

xebay11

17-03-10, 19:37

don't say that and break his heart. even today, so many singaporean parents think that it is very important that they put their kids in star schools.

let me tell you from my person experience, it is not the school that counts, it is how much time you put into educating your kids yourself. so many think "if I put my kids in this or that schools, he is going to be alright." not so, you need to put your own time and effort into your kids' education. if you did not, your kids will turn out badly even if you put him or her in nanyang.

The school does matter, ever heard of the old boy's club? Where I come from many are in high positions due to the network. I guess you never came from one.

bargain hunter

17-03-10, 19:52

but Tao Nan so hot, even within 1km still need to ballot?

haha. Yes bro. I am a bull sometimes. Just bought it so that can register my address for my son next year to register for Tao Nan. Hope that the psf dun drop to half price in the next down cycle then I am ok liao. :D

bullman

17-03-10, 20:08

but Tao Nan so hot, even within 1km still need to ballot?

Hi bro. Yes thats tight. I was an old boy there also so I hope to stand a higher better chance as I qualify for an earlier phase.

xebay11

17-03-10, 20:14

Hi bro. Yes thats tight. I was an old boy there also so I hope to stand a higher better chance as I qualify for an earlier phase.

Don't you get phase 1A?

bargain hunter

17-03-10, 21:55

LOL...then already sure win, no need to be 1km right? but better make sure you register for alumni or something (i heard that's necessary?)

Hi bro. Yes thats tight. I was an old boy there also so I hope to stand a higher better chance as I qualify for an earlier phase.

proud owner

17-03-10, 22:34

I know some members here are quite bored by my news clippings, which appeared again and again.

I'm so sorry about that but I have to bring them up again to defend our beloved Mickey Mouse.

The Observer

Sunday 16 March 2003

Imagine paying more than £100,000 for a 300 sq ft flat and having to throw out half your clothes to fit into it.

This was reality for 23-year-old sales negotiator Francesca Osborne when she bought her flat in London's Islington 18 months ago. She paid £108,000, and at last count the flat was worth £155,000, despite its diminutive dimensions.

She is not alone in paying prices that, to many, will seem silly for tiny homes. Agents say that there are more buyers chasing small flats than properties available. This is just as well because the Microflat - a trademarked blueprint of a super-svelte living space, which is big on design and small on expense - is being hailed as one solution to Britain's inner city housing crisis.

lets do some maths ..

forget the size first

at 108k GBP for 300 sqft ... thats 360 GBP/sqft = 773 SGD / sqft

so 773 psf (SGD) equivalent in LONDON ...

what about in Singapore ?
900-1000 psf outside Orchard ..

so she got a good deal .. it was cheap ..

at 155k GBP for 300 sqft = 517 /sqft (GBP) = 1109 psf SGD ..

again ..we are talking about London ..a world cosmopolitan ..where bankers are still paid millions (5-10 USD) in bonus ..

what about singapore ?

far north , far west all already above or close to 1000 psf ..

are we comparing those places with London ?

sleek

17-03-10, 23:03

Think need to compare 2003 prices right?

:D

lets do some maths ..

forget the size first

at 108k GBP for 300 sqft ... thats 360 GBP/sqft = 773 SGD / sqft

so 773 psf (SGD) equivalent in LONDON ...

what about in Singapore ?
900-1000 psf outside Orchard ..

so she got a good deal .. it was cheap ..

at 155k GBP for 300 sqft = 517 /sqft (GBP) = 1109 psf SGD ..

again ..we are talking about London ..a world cosmopolitan ..where bankers are still paid millions (5-10 USD) in bonus ..

what about singapore ?

far north , far west all already above or close to 1000 psf ..

are we comparing those places with London ?

proud owner

17-03-10, 23:08

Think need to compare 2003 prices right?

:D

well yes

i also used 155k GBP / 300 sqft which was the most current according to the report

still it worked out 1100 psf (SGD) ..

so LONDON = SINGAPORE suburb ?

thats quite absurb dont u think ?

sleek

17-03-10, 23:11

well yes

i also used 155k GBP / 300 sqft which was the most current according to the report

still it worked out 1100 psf (SGD) ..

so LONDON = SINGAPORE suburb ?

thats quite absurb dont u think ?

Like the famous phrase goes "Are we there yet?". :D

jlrx

17-03-10, 23:21

lets do some maths ..

forget the size first

at 108k GBP for 300 sqft ... thats 360 GBP/sqft = 773 SGD / sqft

so 773 psf (SGD) equivalent in LONDON ...

what about in Singapore ?
900-1000 psf outside Orchard ..

so she got a good deal .. it was cheap ..

at 155k GBP for 300 sqft = 517 /sqft (GBP) = 1109 psf SGD ..

again ..we are talking about London ..a world cosmopolitan ..where bankers are still paid millions (5-10 USD) in bonus ..

what about singapore ?

far north , far west all already above or close to 1000 psf ..

are we comparing those places with London ?

Singapore's land should be more valuable than London's. Hence Singapore is grossly undervalued.

Singapore (682.7 sq km) is the capital of Singapore (682.7 sq km) whereas London (1,706 sq km) is the capital of UK (244,820 sq km).

They have much more land to expand beyond London, but we are surrounded by the sea.

Ng Teng Fong: ‘You open the map. If you can’t see the place (because it’s too small) but only the name, that’s the place to invest in…Singapore and Hong Kong are the best examples.’

teddybear

17-03-10, 23:29

I think not a fair comparison. London is so big! London Islington is like in Belestier already. Looks like still more expensive than most Belestier properties? + we have to note that in any central regions also have those more cheap-skate cousins (e.g. in Cairnhill most properties sold at >$2000 psf but Casa Cairnhill sold at about $12xx+ psf only - This example probably similar as Casa Cairnhill?)

well yes

i also used 155k GBP / 300 sqft which was the most current according to the report

still it worked out 1100 psf (SGD) ..

so LONDON = SINGAPORE suburb ?

thats quite absurb dont u think ?

Reporter

17-03-10, 23:45

I think not a fair comparison. London is so big! London Islington is like in Belestier already. Looks like still more expensive than most Belestier properties? + we have to note that in any central regions also have those more cheap-skate cousins (e.g. in Cairnhill most properties sold at >$2000 psf but Casa Cairnhill sold at about $12xx+ psf only - This example probably similar as Casa Cairnhill?)
Agree with you.

London is a metro city with many cities (aka suburbs). We can't just say "London". We need to pinpoint the city (aka suburb), e.g. City of London, etc..

Singapore, although being much smaller, is like a metro city too. We can't just say "Singapore". We need to pinpoint the suburb too, e.g. Ang Mo Kio, etc..

proud owner

17-03-10, 23:46

Singapore's land should be more valuable than London's. Hence Singapore is grossly undervalued.

Singapore (682.7 sq km) is the capital of Singapore (682.7 sq km) whereas London (1,706 sq km) is the capital of UK (244,820 sq km).

They have much more land to expand beyond London, but we are surrounded by the sea.

Ng Teng Fong: ‘You open the map. If you can’t see the place (because it’s too small) but only the name, that’s the place to invest in…Singapore and Hong Kong are the best examples.’

size is one thing but we cannot ignore the history , the infrastructure , the culture, the arts, the vibrance, the freedom of expression without the need to apply for permit ..etc ..which spore still lacking ..

teddybear

18-03-10, 00:00

proud owner

18-03-10, 01:58

Sorry, don't think "freedom of expression without the need to apply for permit" has much effect on property prices. :D
Talk of history, culture and arts, Singapore is much more deeper than UK (Chinese culture of 6000 years vs the British culture of 2000 years?)
Talk of transport and road infrastructure, Singapore much much better than UK.
Talk of vibrancy, Singapore's Orchard Road probably already surpasses UK's Oxford Road.

Looking at all these factors, actually Singapore's Orchard Road properties should be many times more than London city core central properties! :cheers1:

guess we all have different standards ..

with arts = i refers to exhibitions, plays , musical, concerts ..
singapore have also .. but seriously .. can compare ?

museums , gardens, parks .. singapore also have .. can compare ?

transports .. do we have bus drivers who would come down to help old folks ?

do we have bus that can lower to curb level and allow a wheel chair on board ?

do we allow cyclists to wheel into the subway ? or even a foldable bicycles ?

at any one time .. there are more visitors at Bonds Street, Oxford , than in Orchard road ...

i am not booing singapore cos we are still in the making ..

just that we are getting too fast ahead of things .. prices running way ahead of whats value

anyway everyone have different standards ..

so lets drop this ... dont want people to think i "SPG"

amk

18-03-10, 10:31

we cannot ignore the history , the infrastructure , the culture, the arts, the vibrance ..
for one, I agree with you on this, that SG lacks the above.

however, pty prices in SG (and HK) *should* be higher, simply because of the very specific Asian context:

1) Asia is a very densely populated place. For any one place for sale, there are always at least 100 potential buyers. In western europe/USA, there is no such thing.
2) Cosmopolitan Asian cities are in a very unique situation: only rich/stable spot among a vast land of poorer countries. As a result all the riches at the surrounding area flock to the same spot. HK benefits from China, SG benefits from Indo/India/M'sia/etc. Such scenario doesn't exist in western Europe/US, not to that extent.
3) Asian's (particularly Chinese) value system is very different from the west. Property is believed to be much more valuable than other assets. It's not just another asset. Asians dun believe in funds. Rich families always buy land, buy houses. Ang Mo's idea of "property" is quite different. They never really understand the Asian's obsession with pty. None of the top riches in the west is from property. Most of the top riches in Asia are from property. Asians are always willing to pay more for a pty. Ang Mos never.
4) Market difference: in most parts of western europe, pty transaction is heavily regulated. capital gain tax or in kind is a matter of norm. cost of a property transaction is very high. And in NY you can't just anyhow buy a place for those co-ops, you need to get approval even if you have the money. Socialist systems discourage any speculation on pty. There is no volume/liquidity. Asian markets are far from tightly regulated. Ppl play it at will.

These above factors are the fundamental reasons why Asian property market has always been, and always will be, above western countries. Until the day comes when whole of Asia are as rich as the rest.

HP65

18-03-10, 11:22

Exactly, invest in ppty where there is a presence of Asians. And Asians are found in many places, not just in Singapore. I also like to invest in countries And the suburb where Asians sent their children for further studies. It has worked for me time and again without fail.

Regulators

18-03-10, 11:43

You know why our prices are such? The entire Singapore is much smaller than London.

lets do some maths ..

forget the size first

at 108k GBP for 300 sqft ... thats 360 GBP/sqft = 773 SGD / sqft

so 773 psf (SGD) equivalent in LONDON ...

what about in Singapore ?
900-1000 psf outside Orchard ..

so she got a good deal .. it was cheap ..

at 155k GBP for 300 sqft = 517 /sqft (GBP) = 1109 psf SGD ..

again ..we are talking about London ..a world cosmopolitan ..where bankers are still paid millions (5-10 USD) in bonus ..

what about singapore ?

far north , far west all already above or close to 1000 psf ..

are we comparing those places with London ?

Regulators

18-03-10, 11:46

Singapore's history may be short, but our history and nation building process is far more interesting than England. It took just 30 odd years to go from 1 pound=SGD9 to 1 pound=SGD2.

size is one thing but we cannot ignore the history , the infrastructure , the culture, the arts, the vibrance, the freedom of expression without the need to apply for permit ..etc ..which spore still lacking ..

proud owner

18-03-10, 12:04

Singapore's history may be short, but our history and nation building process is far more interesting than England. It took just 30 odd years to go from 1 pound=SGD9 to 1 pound=SGD2.

ahahha

ok ok

i think i kana from everyone big time

we are lucky ...

we singaporeans are very obedient people ...thats why govt has a easy job to get things done their way

however in a big country .. dont think our govt can have much to boast about ..

if our govt cannot even get Soo Zhou project done after spending so much time and money ..... what does it say ?

we are good only becos we are small ...
so i disagree that 30 yrs of wonder can compare to others ..

yes its impressive ... but to manage a country of this size is alot easier than to manage one where a city is already bigger than our country

put them to run those HUGE countries .. i think it would take a few hundred years to get thing right too ..

so nothing to boast about

yes 1 gbp = 2 sgd now ...impressive ....

so ...we should be buying london properties ...cheaper now ...
after all so many singaporeans are still sending their children to study UK, US, Aust right ???

so everything else singpaore still better ....

education ? if we are really good .. why so many still go overseas to study ? including ministers' children .. ? tell me ?

cheerful

18-03-10, 12:13

aiyooooo ... no need to keep repeating Suzhou lah, we all know abt it. The pt here is, as what amk has said, Asian properties cld be seen as a different breed (or maybe people seen as diff breed). No need to always compare with the angmo, can choose to be a little different (or maybe unique) anot har :p

teddybear

18-03-10, 12:26

Not that UK no good, at least their people are more civilised, courteous, their politics much more open, their legal and original infrastructure so much more complete that Singapore has started off using all their things (legacy of their colonial state), their system much more humane and considerate for the old and disabled and incapable... :D

guess we all have different standards ..

with arts = i refers to exhibitions, plays , musical, concerts ..
singapore have also .. but seriously .. can compare ?

museums , gardens, parks .. singapore also have .. can compare ?

transports .. do we have bus drivers who would come down to help old folks ?

do we have bus that can lower to curb level and allow a wheel chair on board ?

do we allow cyclists to wheel into the subway ? or even a foldable bicycles ?

at any one time .. there are more visitors at Bonds Street, Oxford , than in Orchard road ...

i am not booing singapore cos we are still in the making ..

just that we are getting too fast ahead of things .. prices running way ahead of whats value

anyway everyone have different standards ..

so lets drop this ... dont want people to think i "SPG"

Allthepies

18-03-10, 12:36

guess we all have different standards ..

with arts = i refers to exhibitions, plays , musical, concerts ..
singapore have also .. but seriously .. can compare ?

museums , gardens, parks .. singapore also have .. can compare ?

transports .. do we have bus drivers who would come down to help old folks ?

do we have bus that can lower to curb level and allow a wheel chair on board ?

do we allow cyclists to wheel into the subway ? or even a foldable bicycles ?

at any one time .. there are more visitors at Bonds Street, Oxford , than in Orchard road ...

i am not booing singapore cos we are still in the making ..

just that we are getting too fast ahead of things .. prices running way ahead of whats value

anyway everyone have different standards ..

so lets drop this ... dont want people to think i "SPG"

Do we have shops that close at 5pm everyday? :)

teddybear

18-03-10, 13:34

You still living in 60s in London? No lah, they open until very late already in major cities like London.

Do we have shops that close at 5pm everyday? :)

urban

18-03-10, 14:42

Regulators

18-03-10, 14:49

For one very simple reason, becoz we dont have that many places for our local uni and the courses offered are limited and may not be what the students here are interested to do (e.g. Degree in Art history, Sports Science etc). Also for certain courses in great demand here, it is easier to get into unis like University College London and University of Melbourne than NUS.

education ? if we are really good .. why so many still go overseas to study ? including ministers' children .. ? tell me ?

Wild Falcon

18-03-10, 17:56

For the SAME job, London salary is about 3x that of Singapore. Cost of living also 3x. Cannot use London as reference point for Singapore. A fresh grad lawyer earn 5k pound. A fresh grad lawyer in SG only earns $5k SGD.

I think not a fair comparison. London is so big! London Islington is like in Belestier already. Looks like still more expensive than most Belestier properties? + we have to note that in any central regions also have those more cheap-skate cousins (e.g. in Cairnhill most properties sold at >$2000 psf but Casa Cairnhill sold at about $12xx+ psf only - This example probably similar as Casa Cairnhill?)

Wild Falcon

18-03-10, 18:04

Singaporean buyers are mostly showflat lemmings - I jump you jump - make them feel better. Either they (i) buy from showflats (ii) old condos beside showflats because "suddenly" they realise the neighbour is cheaper. That's why only certain areas with a lot of new launches garner a lot of interest. Economics say high supply = > prices will come down. Singapore is the exact opposite. When an area has a glut of new supply e.g. east coast, the prices of the surrounding ares actually goes up because those who cannot snap a unit at the showflat will go next door. It's the most irrational property market in the world driven by herd instinct and mindless greed - no one cares about value investing - just follow and invest in crowded areas. The worst part is the PR machine of the property agents and "consultants" are in full force - always promoting that Singapore property prices can ONLY go up because we should be the same price as Hong Kong and because IR will make foreigners snap up our property - all sentiments without looking at fundamentals.

kali-yuga

19-03-10, 14:53

Bro:

What can you expect from people here whom like to look at things from one angle at close distance?

Believe that you are a "market person", so how do you expect to explore the reality with people whom read TODAY, Straits Times, Biz Times and ZaoBao.

They are wonderful read a few years ago for me until I began to read some other sites and blogs that I realised I am on the Blue pill all this while.

The counter arguement why we should have a higher pty here is we are in Asia....Asia this Asia that.....
Sound so much like those mutual account/fund managers.......isn't it?

ahahha

ok ok

i think i kana from everyone big time

we are lucky ...

we singaporeans are very obedient people ...thats why govt has a easy job to get things done their way

however in a big country .. dont think our govt can have much to boast about ..

if our govt cannot even get Soo Zhou project done after spending so much time and money ..... what does it say ?

we are good only becos we are small ...
so i disagree that 30 yrs of wonder can compare to others ..

yes its impressive ... but to manage a country of this size is alot easier than to manage one where a city is already bigger than our country

put them to run those HUGE countries .. i think it would take a few hundred years to get thing right too ..

so nothing to boast about

yes 1 gbp = 2 sgd now ...impressive ....

so ...we should be buying london properties ...cheaper now ...
after all so many singaporeans are still sending their children to study UK, US, Aust right ???

so everything else singpaore still better ....

education ? if we are really good .. why so many still go overseas to study ? including ministers' children .. ? tell me ?

jlrx

19-03-10, 21:48

I find it strange that property buyers are labelled as "mindless", "showflat lemmings" and described as being only able "to look at things from one angle at close distance".

"Showflat lemmings" are people with cash to play the property market, so are they at the bottom of the economic ladder struggling with mortgage payments, or right at the other end?

If they were really "mindless" and only able "to look at things from one angle at close distance", how could they have come this far in life?

Look at the bald guy at the right of the photo below (who could be Property_Owner since he said he had started to bald).

"Hairless" maybe, but definitely not "mindless".

http://www.straitstimes.com/STI/STIMEDIA/image/20100313/c35-1.jpg

I was there for the preview of Ghost, but a bit too tao kay for me...Also wifey find e name scare e shit out of her...
Maybe will get a Maserati GTS after CNY....no intention to sell e S5...
http://www.asiaone.com/static/motoring/gallery/100107_rolls_royce_ghost/images/pic4.jpg

Wonder whether the one sitting in the car above is Property_Owner? :pNo la, already told u I had started to bald...That can't be me...:D :D :D