Quote:
Originally Posted by nav14
Okie bro.. you support me buy newton edge too... steady?
:)
Pet
Quote:
Originally Posted by nav14
Okie bro.. you support me buy newton edge too... steady?
:)
Pet
I would only say Alexsis is a good buy for rental investment. For home stay, how many of you have stayed in a <650 sqft house?
But for rental investment, it is based on at least rental $3,300 per month. This may not be a substainable figure in current climate.
Near MRT? How many of you have walked to the station? Look like a 2 bus-stop away distant if you really walk. So how do you define near?
One side is facing West sun and the the other side is facing the road (noisy). The worst is the stack nearest to the MRT track. Is this something that most will consider for home stay? Actually, I forsee the worst to be those units below th pool. Not only affected by road noise, if below the motor-room, it will be even more noisy. For long run, I wonder how good will their water proofing of the pool be...
The only attractive part is the price (Total purchase price - not psf) and freehold.
Many buyers rush to buy based on the low total price, therefore, very few really go into details of the west sun, road noise, walking distant to MRT, actual size, etc.
So for stay or investment? Your view?
i just went to view a 1000sq ft 1 bedrm penthouse at another project and found that unlivable.
A 300sqft alexis is ridiculous, abt as big as a hotel81 room. Those who bought this at 1000psf - even if for pure rental - good luck to you.
Well said gfoo, I simply cannot believe it. I guess most bought it to try to get good rental returns from it. Otherwise, for long term family stay, this project is a big NO NO.Quote:
Originally Posted by gfoo
You're being optimistic abt rentals. A 635sqft umfurnished loft at Central clarke quay is going for 2800. Alexis is in hdbland and much further out fr city center. At so cramped, rentals maybe say $1200 at best. That's 2% yield. This fr start is a negative yielding project.
Put another way say i get long term stay at panpac under corporate lease. Still more worth it than alexis after inputing taxes and utilities.
since i quite chor boh today, i'm going to start another 'think aloud' session.
let's look at rental yields. we know that the benchmark yield for Singapore is about 4-6%. let's take 5% yield which is more or less in-line with inflation.
Thus a $2000 rental equates to a $480,000 property. Let's do a list, with the corresponding property rentals at today's prices (Feb 09)
$2000 - $480k (ICON, studio, 550sqft)
$2500 - $600k (The Sail, studio, 657sqft)
$3000 - $720k (Central@SOHO, loft, 645sqft)
$3500 - $840k (Sanct Green, 3bdrm, 1711sqft)
$4000 - $960k (Caribbean, 3bdrm, 1647sqft, low floor)
$4500 - $1.08m (Carribbean, 3bdrm, 1340sqft, high flr, really great view)
All these properties were launched more or less during the last bottom, about 2003. Other than Sanctuary Green, all are near MRT.
If you look at the 5% yield formula, you will find that those are freakingly almost exactly the launch price of those properties in 2003/4. And they are fetching about 5% rental yield now.
Thus for the Alexis at $480k, you will need a monthly rental income of $2000 to get 5% yield. Do you think one can rent a 3xx sq ft apartment at $2000 in 3 years time when TOP?
$2000 p.m. to rent a unit facing either west sun or traffic, not really close to town, large enough only to fit 2 pax shoulder to shoulder, no dining area, no study, no kitchen, no real living room.
in 2007, $2000 pm maybe can pray. Today's prices, I give it maybe $1200. Max maybe $1500pm for that rich sucker out there.
But even if i take $1500pm, then the value of that Alexis unit is $360,000.
All of the above assumes that we have already hit the bottom, and that the economy will at least stay the same till Alexis TOP in 2012. Do you really think so?
I think singaporeans are still not yet in recession mindset. things are only going to get worse
like i said earlier its like a hotel development ~ :oQuote:
Originally Posted by gfoo
Quote:
Originally Posted by gfoo
Bro, honestly.. hotel 81 room got such a big space meh? suites type you mean... in that case you calculate how much it cost you a month then. say normal rooms: $49/nite x 30 nites = $1470/mth. then if same size of Alexis will be the Hotel81 Suites then $80/nite x 30 nites = $2400/mth!!! Alexis if $450k, 100% loan then monthly instalment: $1957/mth!!! you get to cook and eat in Alexis while hotel81 does not allows cooking at all. end of the day, do we get to own hotel81? :tsk-tsk:
Rental wise, if Alexis with facilities only $1200/mth then how much a hdb in Meiling, Stirling, Queenstown, Commonwealth without facilities should cost? may be $500/mth? :tsk-tsk:
Then maybe maintenance for Alexis also be charging more rather than $50/mth since with facilities and a hdb avg already charging $45/mth. :tsk-tsk:
:)
Pet
pwah you know hotel81 size and rates quite well ah .:D
eh.. i personally dun think anybody will ever knows when and where's the bottom unless we are god.. you are making comparison of the rental yield between TOP projects against projects under construction which is totally not fair to be honest, the projects that you have listed with rental indication are those that got hit by the credit crunch during the last 6mths. to be fair also, have you also considered those average rental that was secured during economic slow down period in may-septembe before lehmann bros case? Please refer to the following remarks in RED which is in line with the URA Records of at least 10 transactions in Qtr4/2008.Quote:
Originally Posted by gfoo
$4000/mth(10%) $2000 - $480k (ICON, studio, 550sqft)
$4500/mth(9%) $2500 - $600k (The Sail, studio, 657sqft)
$6500/mth(9%) $3500 - $840k (Sanct Green, 3bdrm, 1711sqft)
$8500/mth(10%) $4000 - $960k (Caribbean, 3bdrm, 1647sqft, low floor)
$8500/mth(9%) $4500 - $1.08m (Carribbean, 3bdrm, 1340sqft, high flr, really great view)
Cheers!
:)
Pet
Of course!!! I used to check in there with my group of friends to watch soccer during wcup or euro... somemore book the entire period when there's matches going on... then also my indian biz associate who came singapore when cannot get other better hotel I will get them to check into hotel81 mah..Quote:
Originally Posted by gfoo
:)
Pet
unfortunately i cannot benchmark to Q4 URA. back then GDP growth was -2% to +1%. now it's -5% to -2.5% growth. they are worlds apart.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petmail
the above rentals i gave are accurate - look in paper/propguru, call, lowball, and those are final offers (coz i'll probably be renting before i buy a replacement home). It's true it is hard to predict how much Alexis can fetch when it's TOP - it may be higher, it may be lower.
But last time when people were buying ICON etc etc, its pricing was based on 5% yield on rentals then, not 3 years later. and back then, i was renting a 3 room at opposite united square for $1500. a year back, i was renting a 2 room at signature park at $1200.
that is how much rentals has risen crazily today. and i suspect, that is how much rentals will plunge accordingly.
rental yields will dictate property prices in the quarters to come, and not the other way around. look into the market and newspapers - there is big trouble in the rental market right now
I'm terribly sorry to say all this and i don't mean to affect your business. but anyways, isn't Alexis already close to 90% sold? in any case this is a closed forum, the public can't see easily, and i am a nobody so whatever i say cannot move markets
Quote:
Originally Posted by gfoo
when comparison have to be fair and needs to take average and not to take lowest mah... later even you call down the rental market jialat for the owner in the listed projects also leh... you also need to see what is the rental market for hdb, and the cost of living, location, etc...
Anyway, doesn't affect Alexis at all... as ALEXIS is....
FULLY SOLD!!!!!
:)
Pet
One thing i really like about Huttons - you guys are great marketers and you know how to get developers to price better than the big boys. Well done!
These launches at caspian, alexis, etc - they all do well to soak up spare liquidity in the market.
Thus existing owners etc that continue to price at 2007/2008 levels - how in the world are you guys gonna compete?
no lah... I would say its still the market confidence in sg property market that results in the Complete Sold Out in Alexis during such a difficult situation like now. by the way, my news also delayed telecast... before 5pm Alexis was complete empty liao...Quote:
Originally Posted by gfoo
:)
Pet
Hi Pet,
May I know in this sold out case of Alexis, meaning that the development of the project will started asap and won't delay as the planned TOP date is year 2013?
Many Thanks.
most likely so..no point keeping showroom since 100% sold out already.
Quote:
Originally Posted by taisan
I believe the earliest start work may only be by next quarter only... Developer will wanna completes the project asap otherwise they will not get a single cent out from this project as well.
:)
Pet
Hi Thanks for the info.
Just a share my opinion. I am not a singaporean but Malaysian. Just to share that even there is a lot of land in KL, the property price are going higher and higher. So i am thinking that singapore has limited land like HK and TW (i have been staying these 2 places for short period), the price of SG condo not even catch up with them yet!!! So there is still room to grow.
Of course globally affected by economy recession and sg wont be the exceptional one. But property is always the long run investment either for home stay or investment. :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by taisan
you are right about the property prices in sg... the prices here in comparison to most other countries are relatively peanuts to the people there.. those who have stayed some years in some of the major cities with high density and population will get used to the size and price while most of us who have not do so will never be able to get used to it...
:)
Pet
What happens if the flippers cannot find suckers to offload to? :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geylang OKT
I dont believe that anyone is buying just to flip in today's property market. If you do, then you are either suicidal or plain stupid.
I believe that people who buy are either investors or specu-vestors. or else they are buying for own stay. Remember they must be able to obtain financing first before they can commit. No more DPS lah in case you dont know.
There will be flippers on the market soon.. watch for them coming.Quote:
Originally Posted by jsh
100% sold... Let's see...
It think it will be the same old story for a project in west. 100% within few days. But later on more then 15% units returned.
Something fishy is going on. So the deferred payment is like DPS?
That means they haven't loan 80% from the bank?
If the sales are meant for reselling, there will be more shows to watch.
I have started to see the effect of this recession.
At the current prices of the property prices, it is very difficult for families to support. Amazing they can buy a condo at times like this. LOL
I am amazed if the local banks supported this kind of deals.
It also means they have not learnt their lessons from sub-prime.
We are going to a big sub-prime problem sooner or later.
If the prices don't get adjusted, things will get very serious one day.
Both places are lousy buys. Not a bargain.
No more DPS, this is interest absorption. Meaning a loan must have been approved. So nothing fishy. The only thing is that I do know know if there are any penalty in early loan redemption. Meaning during the purchase till top, if you sell, will there be any additional cost for not taking up the loan?Quote:
Originally Posted by zeq
Well, I do hope properties will do well. I do own some :D
I think do ned to to pay the penalty as it might consider you clear out the loan earlier. For thi sproject i think you wil get penalty if you settle it within 2 or 3 yrs.. also, the bank start paying the $$$ to developer based on the progress and til TOP, remaining 15% of your total loan still with bank til completion.
I was there yesterday afternoon when the were 3 units left, ranging from 1000 sq ft - 1200 sq ft. average still about $1000 psf...
Comparing with Anchorage, although is already 10 years older, Anchorage is also FH and has a much larger plot of land, resale price hover around $900 psf.
I am considering to get one for investment and do you think it make sense for me to wait for a fire sales unit in Anchorage? I feel Anchorage has a better chance for capital appreciation and rental.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucas
this is my personal opinion ....
to pay 1000 psf for a 3xx sqft ? how much loan you need to take ? i believe alot of us here have at least 200k in cpf .. of course its easy to manage the loan
thats why pple buy ?
i will NEVER pay 1000 psf for that location ... look around .. River valley ..walk to GWC, Zion mkt, orchard, BTK and 5* chicken rice ... so much convenience .. can find around 850-950 psf ... Dist 9 ... i see more value there than Alexis
yes if got $ and die die must buy D3 ..i rather you buy Anchorage
and i also agree with gfoo ... 2000 pm for a 300 ish sqft room ...?? no way
i m now pay 3000 for a 1260 sqft, 5 yr old project in RV ... so convenient .. 3 bedrooms ... anyone wants to rent my master bed room with shower attached for $2500 ? i dont mind sublet a room (after all it is abt 300 sqft )
when will sporean learn ? the true importance of PSF and location ?
by the way for those who think you can rent out Alexis at 2000 or higher ..have you check out the maintenace ? as landlord , you have to pay that every mth ... if its 200 ...then you return is only $ 1800 dont forget ...
good luck to those who owns it ..
i will be leaving spore soon to new york for the next 3 yrs ... hopefully when i return ... property mkt has recovered ..
look out for my info from NYK ...if mkt there recovers .. i will be more than happy to update you guys in this forum ...
by the way ... so what we have east coast with sea view ?
my apt in manhattan has got central park view and hudson river view ..thats what i call "view" ... and i can walk to central park, go jogging on weekend and run along Mel Gibson ... thats true value of location ...
take care now ...