Junior
if say US recover 3 yrs later, do u think there will be another round of recession before next GE?Originally Posted by devilplate
Told u not to worry liao....b4 next ge, vy high chance kena recession oredi
He shd tink of how to revive the ppty market later on
Exalted
Hard to say, if usa recover but sg suffer smthing like asia financial crisis....ultimate crash bcoz interest rates rise n rental drop at the same time
Senior
No desire for devil... I prefer humans....Anything tat suits ur inner desire
Newbie
Left to itself a market will not determine equilibrium, but instead swing on both sides of it. Usually any market will be regulated to prevent wild swings, and instead have gradual growth.
Why you always hear of this country changed interest rates, that country changed interest rates? It is to prevent sudden changes in prices. When price goes high fast, increase interest rate. When it come down too fast, reduce interest rate. Not just for housing, also for stock market and general inflation too. SG govt. do the same with monetary policy and exchange rate.
Both say the same thing - bubble mean that too much optomism, not enough reality. If unit is empty or unsold, then why everyone so bull about property? Why property rising so fast when no-one is there to live in it? FT will not live in million dollar condo.
Think like food - if we all go buy food because price increasing, we want to buy today, sell tomorrow to hungry people. But in reality, 80% is not hungry in SG, and the few people that are hungry cannot afford your expensive price food tomorrow. So today you buy buy, tomorrow who will you sell to? No one want to eat expensive food.
Bubble.
Junior
worst, its artificially pushed up through those hot monies and massive speculation from all walks of life..
low income(few parties combine buying), middle income, or high income.
but i loving it
Senior
I think blackjack is straight so he doesn't do bj
Blackjack gd at bj too
Exalted
Blackjack is a chiobu lahI think blackjack is straight so he doesn't do bj
Senior
How you know? Devils have third eyes too???Blackjack is a chiobu lah
Senior
So the only logical conclusion is those who are buying today are not for investment but for own stay lor... then again how come so many people buying for homestay today???
Senior
I must say that PAP kanna big time wake up call from the recent GE. LTK achieved his objective of keeping the incumbent in check by winning that one GRC. Heard many ministers now saying they will begin their new portfolio by going to the ground first before deciding what new measures to implement or policies to introduce... hope it is the beginning of a new era of listening govt... another 5 years to see how long they can sustain this passion to listen and act accordingly.
Newbie
It's very hard for them listen and be nice for 5 years continuous. It'll be very tiring for them.. Now everybody say govt never listened, so govt has to listen for 1st year to appease people's anger. After that, 2 years of hardship, followed by 2 years of growth/carrots should be just nice.. A relationship must have ups and downs so that the people can truly appreciate. If 5 years all happy happy, it will mean prices will not move up or down significantly.. Like that devilplate will cry..
Exalted
Yes sister...i saw u using pink cover ipad2 jus nowHow you know? Devils have third eyes too???
Hahaha
Exalted
Ya lor....cry n repent for next 5yrs liao
Senior
It appears that you are doubtful of their sincerity... hmm.... I think to a certain degree, they are sincere lah.. but it sure is hard work for them man... Ministers better work for their pay...
Senior
Sometimes change to purple cover lah...
Senior
Pity all the Minister of State and Senior Parliamentary Secretary working in Ministries where both DPMs are in. They will have to work real hard.It appears that you are doubtful of their sincerity... hmm.... I think to a certain degree, they are sincere lah.. but it sure is hard work for them man... Ministers better work for their pay...
Newbie
Haha.. Below them there are still perm sec, deputy sec, etc etc etc.. So many scholars everywhere, so those top ones have to work hard to make decision and chair meetings only.. Alright lah..
Newbie
I never doubt or what.. The problem is now singapore is a matured economy already, not much progress can be made liao, so how to expect them to make 5 good years.. They will also find it hard.. Govt's economic strategy now is to make singapore a global hub, thats why all those F1, this and that convention, YOG, 2 x IRs all come.. This kind of strategy is to attract the rich to come, so bobian rich-poor gap will widen one.. So how to expect govt to give people 5 good years.. 1st year good and last 2 years good is already an excellent performance..It appears that you are doubtful of their sincerity... hmm.... I think to a certain degree, they are sincere lah.. but it sure is hard work for them man... Ministers better work for their pay...
Go for Smallest Unit
1st year, property prices maintain,
Last 2 years, property recover and maintain.
So... In 2nd and 3rd year, the bubble burst!
Senior
Singaporeans getting smarter liao.. if bubble burst because of govt's poor policies and oversight, they'll sure complain like crazy like the recent GE where MBT kanna big time and winning margin not impressive at all and that was against NSP. If it was WP, they may even lose le...
Senior
What then is good in terms of property? Good for one may not be so for another... good for owners when property prices climb but no good for potential owners. Good for sellers when property prices are high but no good for buyers and vice versa. Big headache for KBW...
Go for Smallest Unit
All want price to drop. No worry, just make sure it recover by 5th yr.
Senior
To those in jurong who voted for PAP
SINGAPORE - With electricity prices and maintenance costs going up, at least two town councils, Aljunied and Jurong, will raise their Service and Conservancy Charges (S&CC) next month.
The hike will impact flats, shops, offices and market and hawker stalls.
For Singaporean households in Housing Board flats, the hike per month will range between 50 cents for a one-room flat and $4.50 for a five-room flat.
While the other 12 People's Action Party (PAP) and two Opposition town councils have not indicated on their websites that they will raise S&CC, could the announcements by Aljunied and Jurong herald an inevitable trend as costs rise and economic conditions pick up?
The 14 PAP town councils had raised S&CC across the board in 2004 - seven years after the last revision.
Coming up to the six-year mark now, town councils like Jurong have seen power tariffs shoot up by 38.4 per cent since October 2004.
This impacts the town council "greatly", Jurong Town Council said, as utility bills account for 30 per cent of overall operating cost. "Electricity consumption is also forecast to increase with the installation of more lifts, linkways and amenities within the town," it added.
On the frequently-asked-questions section of its website, the town council dismissed any suggestion that the S&CC hike was linked to any investments in failed Lehman-linked structured products.
In the first place, it did not invest in any of the troubled financial products; and its "investments have been generating returns of 2.57 per cent per annum over the last five years", Jurong Town Council said.
Meanwhile, with the growing number of lifts, and lifts making more stops in a block, maintenance costs have also rocketed. In Aljunied, for example, the monthly servicing costs have doubled from $300 to $624 where a lift makes nine more stops. And where there were just 884 lifts to maintain in 2005, there will be 1,109 by this month's end, and a projected 1,270 by 2014.
Also expected to rise: The cost of keeping estates clean. "The demands on the cleaning and refuse removal contractors have changed, and so too their service costs," Aljunied Town Council general manager Jeffrey Chua said.
"Because they have to meet specific performance targets, they have to pay higher wages for better trained workers." The cleaning contract rate of about $5.98 per equivalent dwelling unit each month has gone up to about $6.25.
For households facing problems with S&CC payments, both town councils assured them financial help was available and urged them to approach their Members of Parliament.
Residents MediaCorp spoke to want more clarity. "Neighbours complain the estate is still dirty. With the increase, I hope for more transparency on the targets achieved," Aljunied resident Reynold Seah said.
Jurong resident JF Yeo said: "Any fee increase so soon after a recession cannot be good news. The town council should at least show us that our money will be put to good use."
Meanwhile, Jalan Besar Town Council chairperson Denise Phua and Bishan-Toa Payoh Town Council chairman Zainudin Nordin both said they had no plans for now to increase conservancy charges.
Ms Phua noted that estates varied in terms of age and programmes, which could account for differences in upkeep costs.
Newbie
Not everyone is hoping for price to drop. Depends whether you are long or short. I am sad that MBT is stepping down.
Junior
The imbalance and wild swings are caused by too much govt intervention. Govt intervention by itself (restrictions on ownership and funding) is not so much an issue but when the govt is the major land supplier itself, that is when it causes big problems as it is driven by the following motives :
A. They try to fill the coffers by trying to sell as much land as possible when mkt is hot
B. Knee jerk reactions by the govt of releasing huge supply of land when it wants to 'adjust prices' downwards to appease the public
C. Contracting supply quickly and not awarding land citing 'reserve' prices' during 'recessionary'times.
(A) to (C) severly disrupts the supply balance and causes the swings to be more extreme. Let me cite an example.
1. When market is hot :
a. Govt release huge amounts of land to try to strike when iron is hot and fill coffers
b. Developer bids high and is successful
c. Developer quickly tries to cram alll its launches within the same year to catch the fever.
d. Say an average of 3 yrs construction time - huge glut of supply come onstream all at the same time
e. Buyers have difficulty finding tenants or servicing loans, mkt goes into arrest. Property prices plummets
2. When mkt is down.
a. Developers who have sold out and exhausted their land banks (but is now flush with cash from TOP of these units) try to get land at cheap prices in down mkt.
b. They activate land tenders but bid low because mkt is down. Govt refuses to award tenders citing reserve price reasons.
c. Govt sensing that recession is at hand also slow downs land releases.
d. When mkt picks up in 2 to 3 yrs tme, there is just not enough supply to meet demand, this causes prices to spiral upwards quickly causing feeding frenzy. Go back to point 1
Last edited by proper-t; 20-05-11 at 00:52.
Senior
Agreed to most of the points mentioned but for B, the release of huge amounts of land is not to adjust price downwards. Adjusting price downwards is a natural (expected) outcome but the primary objective was the great complaints that there was insufficient supply to meet the huge demands whether from high influx of foreigners or locals.
Also your model simply assumed a cycle in the property market but the market need not neccessarily be down after the initial 3 years of hot. There are many other factors that might affect whether up or down. These external factors may well bring the market down in less than 3 years or may drag on for up to 7 years as observed from 1997 to 2001 and then to 2008.
Senior
Well I would have to agree on what you've mentioned. In the 1950s when Singapore was still a 3rd world country, in terms of national progresses, there are plenty of space to improve so the ministers when they are good and capable, could have very impressive results. Now, the direction is totally different. As a 1st world country, progresses come in other forms such as luxuries and attractiveness to foreign investments, etc. Slightly more challenging to have an equally impressive resume as those of our predeccessors.
Senior
Not sure if this is after the election. It says 2 opp town councils haven't increase price referring to PP and Hougang. Aljunied is still under Mrs Phua so I think this was referring to last year's report...To those in jurong who voted for PAP
SINGAPORE - With electricity prices and maintenance costs going up, at least two town councils, Aljunied and Jurong, will raise their Service and Conservancy Charges (S&CC) next month.
The hike will impact flats, shops, offices and market and hawker stalls.
For Singaporean households in Housing Board flats, the hike per month will range between 50 cents for a one-room flat and $4.50 for a five-room flat.
While the other 12 People's Action Party (PAP) and two Opposition town councils have not indicated on their websites that they will raise S&CC, could the announcements by Aljunied and Jurong herald an inevitable trend as costs rise and economic conditions pick up?
The 14 PAP town councils had raised S&CC across the board in 2004 - seven years after the last revision.
Coming up to the six-year mark now, town councils like Jurong have seen power tariffs shoot up by 38.4 per cent since October 2004.
This impacts the town council "greatly", Jurong Town Council said, as utility bills account for 30 per cent of overall operating cost. "Electricity consumption is also forecast to increase with the installation of more lifts, linkways and amenities within the town," it added.
On the frequently-asked-questions section of its website, the town council dismissed any suggestion that the S&CC hike was linked to any investments in failed Lehman-linked structured products.
In the first place, it did not invest in any of the troubled financial products; and its "investments have been generating returns of 2.57 per cent per annum over the last five years", Jurong Town Council said.
Meanwhile, with the growing number of lifts, and lifts making more stops in a block, maintenance costs have also rocketed. In Aljunied, for example, the monthly servicing costs have doubled from $300 to $624 where a lift makes nine more stops. And where there were just 884 lifts to maintain in 2005, there will be 1,109 by this month's end, and a projected 1,270 by 2014.
Also expected to rise: The cost of keeping estates clean. "The demands on the cleaning and refuse removal contractors have changed, and so too their service costs," Aljunied Town Council general manager Jeffrey Chua said.
"Because they have to meet specific performance targets, they have to pay higher wages for better trained workers." The cleaning contract rate of about $5.98 per equivalent dwelling unit each month has gone up to about $6.25.
For households facing problems with S&CC payments, both town councils assured them financial help was available and urged them to approach their Members of Parliament.
Residents MediaCorp spoke to want more clarity. "Neighbours complain the estate is still dirty. With the increase, I hope for more transparency on the targets achieved," Aljunied resident Reynold Seah said.
Jurong resident JF Yeo said: "Any fee increase so soon after a recession cannot be good news. The town council should at least show us that our money will be put to good use."
Meanwhile, Jalan Besar Town Council chairperson Denise Phua and Bishan-Toa Payoh Town Council chairman Zainudin Nordin both said they had no plans for now to increase conservancy charges.
Ms Phua noted that estates varied in terms of age and programmes, which could account for differences in upkeep costs.
Senior
MBT admitted responsibility for the high housing cost yesterday...
Bricks & Mortar
I think he it all along, can't be after GE, suddenly wake up since he also say he expressed his wish to step down earlier...but was asked to stay. His last Cooling Measure was his swan song , "hiok, jialat jilat" 4 yr SSD, 40%LTV, so that we all remember him! Really good, he make sure he justify his pay to his bosses!MBT admitted responsibility for the high housing cost yesterday...
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