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Thread: Significant Property News & Discussions

  1. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    Why property prices in $PSF appear so high?
    - This is an illusion, brought about by MMs! Many MMs have super high $PSF and appear "Affordable" (e.g. J Gateway)!

    Why property transactions so hot?
    - Simple, because of MMs which are "affordable"!
    Really "affordable"? - Yes, but VERY EXPENSIVE! There goes the IRONY!

    Does MMs serve a purpose?
    - Yes, but only for retirees!
    Therefore, it is time govt stipulates that retirement resorts with MMs (e.g. hillford) can only sell to old people!
    MMs not retirement homes should just be banned!

    Why young couple don't let them buy MMs?
    - Simple, because MM discourage procreation (making babies and having children)!

    Why single don't let them buy MMs?
    - Simple, to encourage them to stay with their parents and look after their parents! Also, MM discourage procreation (making babies and having children) and singles having MMs discourage them from getting marriage!

    What should be the definition of MM?
    - Any unit less than 2 Bedrooms and less than 900 sqft are MMs!
    Too small units are not fit for humans to live in (strongly agreed with Liew Mun Leong), let alone that it discourages pro-creation!

    If the govt seriously want to tackle these problems:
    (1) People don't want to get marriage
    (2) Couples don't want to give birth and rise children
    (3) Aging parents deserted by children because children can easily buy their afforable MMs to live separate from parents,
    Govt really have to deal with the social problems caused by the easy availability of "affordable" MMs! MMs are just so anti-social!
    Totally Agree...

  2. #272
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    For people buying properties just for yields, I worried for them!
    We buy properties for long-term capital value to hedge against inflation, hence 60 years lease is probably not long-term enough! These people who buy properties with 60 years lease (or remaining) better worried about it!



    PUBLISHED JANUARY 18, 2014
    Rental yields of non-landed private homes down at 3.9%
    BYMINDY TAN

    RENTAL yields for non-landed private homes fell below the 4 per cent psychological mark at 3.9 per cent in 2013, from 4.2 per cent the previous year, according to the Singapore Real Estate Exchange (SRX).
    "For many investors seeking income from residential properties, 4 per cent is a psychological barrier when it comes to rental yields," Jeremy Lee, SRX co-founder and chief technology officer said.
    He noted that investors generally seek yields above 4 per cent to justify the risks inherent in property as an asset. "Below 4.0 per cent, investors worry that inflation will wipe out their gains," he said.
    Of the 34 planning areas in Singapore, 31 experienced a weakening in median gross rental yields.


  3. #273
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    Interesting developments in the property market. I have been waiting on the sidelines for more than a year now and can't be more confident that prices will go down.

    - Market bottomed in 2008, and then have been raising rapidly since with increasing units under construction while the government added more and more property curbs as prices keep going up. Most of the time, there are only positive news even when prices began to rise above '07 historical high: influx of rich foreigners, low-interest rates, property is way to get rich, government population growth plan, the rise of Asia.

    However, since latter part of 2013 I have been only hearing about negative property news: sales going down but prices still holding (when have stagnant prices been considered positive in recent years?). Then CCR prices going down, and certain property that were not completely sold or even launched. Recently we hear about property being sold but really mostly vacant. Now, people are talking about withdrawing property curbs.

    It's not a sign of good news to come. So this is what I expect: prices will go down, property curbs will be removed but it doesn't help the market. Instead, it signals to people that the market has turned and more people waits at the sidelines while interest rates goes up reducing affordability. The region's government continues to clamp down of illegal money flow, especially China is another source of less wealth being transferred into property overseas.

    The current property bubble has yet to burst but the same underlying factors seemed to be affecting Singapore, Hong Kong, and Vancouver.

  4. #274
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    Prices have to drop at least 15% before it's worthwhile to sell and rent to wait for prices to drop...

    3% Buyer stamp duty
    5% rental for one year
    1 to 2% of agent commission
    3-5% reno cost
    Moving cost
    Time and effort...

    During Lehman crisis, prices drop

    what are the chances that this correction will drop more than 15%?

  5. #275
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    Lehman sub prime crisis had made people become rich as well.

    Wonder whether will such opportunities to be arised from US again or China.

  6. #276
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    Default Don’t confuse million-dollar assets and yearly income

    Great article!
    Now now, is it fair to tax assets or tax income?
    Obviously it is fair to tax income but NOT FAIR to tax assets every year!

    Now, you Singapore assets is derived from Income.
    From income you are already tax once, why should a person be taxed again when they change their cash into assets in Singapore?

    Does this mean people should shift their cash out of Singapore and avoid owning assets in Singapore so that they can avoid being taxed on their assets in Singapore?

    Who are the people who are able to shift their cash overseas into foreign assets overseas to avoid taxes on Singapore assets?
    The answer is obvious
    - Very rich people and very high income people!
    Who are they? You answer yourself!

    Who are the ones who can't shift their cash overseas into foreign assets overseas?
    Your average middle-income people!
    Who are the ones who are asset rich and cash poor and will suffer badly from increased taxes on assets?
    Are you one of this group? If so, you will be seriously disadvantaged if tax regime has been changed to tax assets every year instead of increasing income and corporate taxes!

    ================================
    Don’t confuse million-dollar assets and yearly income

    In the commentary, “Taxing times for millionaires” (Jan 23), the authors compared two statistics: The report last year that Singapore had 101,000 millionaires (based on taxable assets) in 2012 and that 4,220 resident taxpayers had declared a taxable income of at least S$1 million in the 2012 tax year.
    FROM CHRISTOPHE INGLIN - 14 HOURS 40 MIN AGO
    In the commentary, “Taxing times for millionaires” (Jan 23), the authors compared two statistics: The report last year that Singapore had 101,000 millionaires (based on taxable assets) in 2012 and that 4,220 resident taxpayers had declared a taxable income of at least S$1 million in the 2012 tax year.

    Pointing out that 4,220 was only 4.2 per cent of 101,000, they questioned what happened to the remaining 95.8 per cent.

    There is a huge difference between someone who has accumulated a million dollars of assets over several years and someone who earns a taxable income of S$1 million a year.

    We should not confuse balance sheets with income statements.

    ================================
    McPeekay Tomcat
    It's rich if you earn million dollars but if you have taxable assets worth millions, you may be asset rich, cash poor.

    Many are asset rich, cash poor.

  7. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    Why property prices in $PSF appear so high?
    - This is an illusion, brought about by MMs! Many MMs have super high $PSF and appear "Affordable" (e.g. J Gateway)!

    Why property transactions so hot?
    - Simple, because of MMs which are "affordable"!
    Really "affordable"? - Yes, but VERY EXPENSIVE! There goes the IRONY!

    Does MMs serve a purpose?
    - Yes, but only for retirees!
    Therefore, it is time govt stipulates that retirement resorts with MMs (e.g. hillford) can only sell to old people!
    MMs not retirement homes should just be banned!

    Why young couple don't let them buy MMs?
    - Simple, because MM discourage procreation (making babies and having children)!

    Why single don't let them buy MMs?
    - Simple, to encourage them to stay with their parents and look after their parents! Also, MM discourage procreation (making babies and having children) and singles having MMs discourage them from getting marriage!

    What should be the definition of MM?
    - Any unit less than 2 Bedrooms and less than 900 sqft are MMs!
    Too small units are not fit for humans to live in (strongly agreed with Liew Mun Leong), let alone that it discourages pro-creation!

    If the govt seriously want to tackle these problems:
    (1) People don't want to get marriage
    (2) Couples don't want to give birth and rise children
    (3) Aging parents deserted by children because children can easily buy their afforable MMs to live separate from parents,
    Govt really have to deal with the social problems caused by the easy availability of "affordable" MMs! MMs are just so anti-social!


    Hello, with reference to the above write out, may I know the size of HDB unit from the so called " HDB scheme that is offering to SINGLE?" which I remembered launched not long ago.......

  8. #278
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    Default Singtel 3G data download sucks!

    See below kind of news, don't know what to say!

    Fastest internet speed? Why don't they try testing 3G data download especially during peak hours, when we are told we can get 7.2 Mbps and I only clock like 20 kbps! That is on Singtel network!


    Asian countries boast world's fastest Internet speeds

    4) Singapore: The place chosen by Facebook co-founder Eduardo Saverin to call home delivers an average peak speed of 50.1Mbps. This is almost thrice the global average.

  9. #279
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    Default Looks like new OCR property now at a reasonable price of about $1000 psf now

    Looks like new OCR property now at a reasonable price of about $1000 psf now.

    Really wonder what those who pay like $1500 psf or more (e.g. J Gateway) will think?



    PUBLISHED FEBRUARY 13, 2014

    Rivertrees pricing set to top Riverbank's

    Premium of $50-100 psf likely; project open for booking from Feb 22

    BYLYNETTE KHOO [email protected]

    Water, water, everywhere: The bulk of the 495 units will have views of the reservoir and/or the 50m swimming pool
    RIVERTREES Residences, a waterfront condominium project in Sengkang jointly developed by Frasers Centrepoint, Far East Orchard and Sekisui House, is expected to be launched at a premium of $50-100 per square foot (psf) over its next-door competing project.

    Prices for the units will start from $950 psf when the project is open for booking on Feb 22, Frasers Centrepoint said yesterday. The average price for the initial phase could be in the range of $950-$1,150 psf.

    Chief executive Cheang Kok Kheong noted that a slight premium to UOL Development's Riverbank @ Fernvale project would be "considered as fair" for the waterfront view that the project offers.

    Competing development Riverbank @ Fernvale, which has also opened its showflats, has an average price indication of slightly more than $1,000 psf.

  10. #280
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    Below is a good article to read...

    "GST targets consumption and because it is applied equally regardless of income level, it is highly regressive."

    And minority need to go eat SHIT for supporting GST!


    ---------------------------------
    Is trickle-down economics working for Singapore?

    The annual Budget is an expression of the Government’s commitment to its policies — put simply, the Budget is when the bucks are put into the bangs.
    BY DEVADAS KRISHNADAS - 13 FEBRUARY
    The annual Budget is an expression of the Government’s commitment to its policies — put simply, the Budget is when the bucks are put into the bangs.

    However, those dollars are sourced from finite revenues, whereas demands for policy attention are often infinite. Even among critical policies, there is a need to prioritise. It is thus appropriate that we ask fundamental questions about the assumptions, motives and directions of our taxation system, which makes public expenditure — and which usually occupies everyone’s attention in the Budget — possible.

    For the past 20 years, we have been shifting our tax system into one that reflects the philosophy of trickle-down economics. This reflects the belief that the wealthy create value and jobs in the economy and, thus, should be incentivised and rewarded with a low effective-tax ceiling. To be fair, the entire tax schedule has been influenced by this thinking, to the extent that all levels of income earners today pay much less income tax than ever before. Further, Singaporeans earning less than S$40,000 annually do not pay any income tax at all and are still eligible for — and by policy design, receive disproportionately more of — the share of public benefits each year through subsidies, grants and supplements.



    GST AND THE POOR



    However, everyone — whether they are income earners or not — pays indirect taxation in the form of Goods and Services Tax. GST, because it is taxed at the point of consumption, is a very efficient tax compared with direct taxation. It is also more stable as a tax flow, given that consumption must occur even during economic downturns.

    Nonetheless, GST targets consumption and because it is applied equally regardless of income level, it is highly regressive. For low-income earners, whose major expenditure is on basic goods, the tax affects them disproportionately compared with higher-income earners who have much more disposable income to expend on discretionary items.

    As GST has increased, the direct income tax has been reduced at all levels. A further move towards efficiency and a reflection of a bias towards wealth preservation has been the removal of inefficient taxes that targeted capital owners, such as the estate duty and capital gains tax.

    If we take it as a tax and benefits system, it could be argued that we have a generous tax system. However, our demands on public expenditure are set to increase over the longer term due to an ageing population, added infrastructure due to population growth and the need to renew existing infrastructure. This will create pressure to raise additional revenues. Thinking rationally, it is an obvious choice that this should be met by an increase in the most efficient tax channel, which is the GST.


    WEALTH SKEWS THE PICTURE

    The question to ask is, what — beyond the practical and vital purpose of raising revenue — is the object of taxation? I would argue that a tax system also signals social values. It is a practical, hit-in-the-pocket expression of what we believe our responsibilities as citizens are to each other and in relation to the concept of the State.

    We need to revisit the philosophy of trickle-down economics. Its influence extends beyond our tax system to inform our policy on immigration — which, in part, targets wealthy foreigners — and on urban planning — which is creating more “wealth zones” such as Sentosa Cove and Marina Bay. This is important because there are social, political and economic externalities.

    We are facing high and growing income inequality, which can prove socially divisive. Immigration policies are creating political tensions. The influx of wealthy foreigners and the ability of our own wealthy to keep more of their income create economic activity — such as high-end food and beverage outlets, which compete with other sectors for labour and land share — to suit their consumption patterns.

    It may also be promoting rent-seeking behaviour as they invest in property and other passive investments. The upward price pressure raises the general cost of housing consumption.

    Wealth also gives those with capital a chance to boost each successive generation’s starting position in life — in the process creating an “arms race’’ in everything from childcare and education to health. When this happens, it can take the principle of meritocracy to absurd levels — does one need to speak three languages, enjoy a cosmopolitan lifestyle and have a perfect International Baccalaureate score to win a scholarship or become a doctor? No, but education competition may mean that, eventually, only the few who can — through a combination of not only ability and effort but also wealth — will “win” at such races.

    Furthermore, the ability of the wealthy to pay a premium skews the market to supply them a disproportionate share of scarce services, such as in healthcare.



    EFFECTIVENESS OVER EFFICIENCY

    Where is the data that shows that trickle-down economics is working? If it is, we should be able to both prove that the wealthy are creating growth and jobs, and that our policies to promote a low-tax environment and pro-wealthy lifestyle are working in our favour.

    While we can show that the wealthy boost consumption, which is the largest economic multiplier, it is much more difficult to prove that they promote economic growth, and that such growth benefits the general population to a degree that cancels out the negative externalities. The costs of these externalities are so high that we cannot take it on faith alone.

    If we set a social-political agenda for our tax system, then we have to look beyond efficiency to its effectiveness.

    If direct taxation were higher and regressive indirect taxation were lowered, would we be worse or better off as a society? Alternatively, what if GST were rescinded and if all income earners had to pay direct tax, on a highly progressive schedule, so that everyone understood that we all have to chip in to finance our collective needs?

    Under such a model, low-income earners — who do not now pay income tax but pay the GST — would pay a low direct tax but no tax on their consumption. Would marginally higher direct taxes really make us less attractive as a destination for the talented and ambitious? Would removing policies that overwhelmingly favour the wealthy really put us into an economic tailspin?



    OPTIMISE USE OF THE RESERVES

    As can be seen from the 2013 Budget statement, yield from personal income tax is falling while that from GST is rising. Tax yield from GST is estimated to exceed that from personal income tax by S$1.75 billion, or about 23 per cent, in FY2013.

    Increases in the effective tax rates would not yield much revenue. However, they would not be insignificant either and, more importantly, they would be symbolic of a changed socio-political model of burden sharing.

    The shortfall in revenue from a reduction in GST could be made up from increasing the share of Net Investment Returns Contribution. The NIRC is the share of income (50 per cent) from the reserves which can be deployed for current expenditure. The remainder of the income (50 per cent) is returned into the reserves to continue to grow them.

    The sharing formula is governed by the Constitution and an amendment, such as that made in 2008, would have to be made to increase the share that can be deployed to current expenditure. This would not be “raiding the reserves”, as the underlying capital is untouched.

    It would, however, mean that the reserves would grow at a slower rate. But it is arguable that we should be optimising the use of the reserves for national purposes rather than focusing on their relentless expansion.



    QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS

    These are important questions we should ask and seek answers to before we continue down a road that has already created considerable externalities. But in this important inquiry, the starting point matters — we must first choose whether to begin by deciding on what kind of society we want, or by deciding on what kind of economy we want. Our answers will vary significantly depending on the focal question.

    This is a process that involves all Singaporeans and should be taken up from the community level up to parliamentary politics. This commentary is not advocating which is the right choice — it is advocating that a deliberate choice be made.

    For that to happen, questions should be asked and answers need to be sought on not only how we raise revenue, but also why we raise revenue, as well as about the assumptions and economic beliefs underpinning our fiscal system.


    ABOUT THE AUTHOR:
    Devadas Krishnadas is Managing Director of Future-Moves, a strategic risk consultancy. His new book Sensing Singapore: Reflections in a Time of Change was released last month.
    Last edited by teddybear; 14-02-14 at 12:25. Reason: GST is highly regressive!!!

  11. #281
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    I heard that because of ABSD, many foreigners (especially PRCs) and PRs still buying Singapore private properties/condos, but they are trying to save on ABSD by buying those cheaper units in the OCR, like Sengkang, Punggol, and West Coast and Jurong, super popular with foreigners especially PRCs!
    Because of ABSD, OCR private condos have been further heated up and that is why prices spiral up out of control! Otherwise how do you expect J Gateway can sell $1500-17xx psf?

    But now, ABSD coupled with TDSR, means singapore citizens upgraders hit with TDSR while still having to compete to buy OCR heartlander private condos properties with foreigners (including PRs) at INFLATED PRICES!!!

  12. #282
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    It is indeed true that foreigners are continually to buy despite ABSD!!!

    And foreigners (including PRs) have been swamping to buy OCR private condos to save on ABSD!
    It hurts the citizen upgraders tremendously because this causes OCR private condos prices to spiral upwards and these citizen upgraders are forced to pay super inflated OCR private condo prices!!! (like buy J Gateway at $15xx to $17xx psf!!!)

    -------------------------------------------------
    Healthier for economy in long run to retain ABSD


    The report “Right time to tweak property cooling measures: CDL Chief” (Feb 8) stated that Mr Kwek Leng Beng had called for a removal of the Additional Buyer’s Stamp Duty (ABSD) for locals and foreigners. This would be a mistake.
    FROM ALEX LEE SAO WEI - 14 FEBRUARY
    The report “Right time to tweak property cooling measures: CDL Chief” (Feb 8) stated that Mr Kwek Leng Beng had called for a removal of the Additional Buyer’s Stamp Duty (ABSD) for locals and foreigners. This would be a mistake.

    Both foreigners and locals continue to buy properties despite the ABSD. In 2012, more than 8,200 transactions generated S$760 million in total ABSD. Several projects launched in recent months have found buyers for over 80 per cent of their units, proving that properties priced appropriately can still be sold.

    Understandably, developers may be unwilling to reduce prices for fear of reducing their profit margins. The former may be painful in the short run, but is healthier for the economy and the real estate industry in the long run.

    Since 2009, skyrocketing property prices have led to widespread perception that property investing and development in Singapore is a quick way to get rich. Many new players, local and foreign, have entered the industry.

    Local entrants have come from a range of businesses as diverse as electronics, stockbroking, media, jewellery, stationery, food and beverage, entertainment and wellness. Foreign developers who have entered the market are among the most aggressive land bidders here.

    While several companies have abandoned their core businesses to become developers, many individuals have switched careers to become property agents.

    There are unseen economic costs when a portion of our limited resources is diverted from other productive industries to real estate.

    As property prices have risen beyond the reach of many Singaporeans, a correction would be received warmly, in particular, by younger Singaporeans hoping to buy their first property.

    As prices fall, developers’ profit margins would normalise to more sustainable levels. Fewer firms, local and foreign, would join the industry. Some developers, disenchanted by slower growth and thinner margins, may call it quits. All this would restore market sanity.

    In recent years, I have heard various myths about property investing in Singapore. One of them is that buying property here is “pao chiak” (“a sure win” in Hokkien) because the Government has a vested interest to ensure that prices never fall.

    Removing the property curbs prematurely would be a signal to the market that this myth is actually true. Prices would resume climbing rapidly, and the market could by then be resistant to further cooling measures.


    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    I heard that because of ABSD, many foreigners (especially PRCs) and PRs still buying Singapore private properties/condos, but they are trying to save on ABSD by buying those cheaper units in the OCR, like Sengkang, Punggol, and West Coast and Jurong, super popular with foreigners especially PRCs!
    Because of ABSD, OCR private condos have been further heated up and that is why prices spiral up out of control! Otherwise how do you expect J Gateway can sell $1500-17xx psf?

    But now, ABSD coupled with TDSR, means singapore citizens upgraders hit with TDSR while still having to compete to buy OCR heartlander private condos properties with foreigners (including PRs) at INFLATED PRICES!!!

  13. #283
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    Default Wider mortgage rule exemptions expected to ensure soft landing

    Without the widening mortgage rule exemptions, private property prices probably would have crash within 1 year!

    So fast have to tinker the NEW rules to become NEWER rules, is it because MAS never think through thoroughly the policy consequences before implementing?

    Serious cause of WORRY for me, for all singaporean citizens, and all property owners and investors (be it citizen and PRs and foreigners)!


    ===================================
    Wider mortgage rule exemptions expected to ensure soft landing

    THE broadening of exemptions from tough mortgage rules will help property prices ease down gradually rather than go into a tailspin, analysts said yesterday.


    The Straits Times - February 12, 2014

    Wider mortgage rule exemptions expected to ensure soft landing
    THE broadening of exemptions from tough mortgage rules will help property prices ease down gradually rather than go into a tailspin, analysts said yesterday.

    If not for Monday's rule change by the central bank, some home owners may have been forced to sell units if they could not secure refinancing. This would have put further strain on an already faltering market, the analysts added.

    However, they said the wider exemption was unlikely to lift buyer demand or stem the bleeding in home sales volumes, adding that they thought the property market was headed for a soft landing.

    "This measure helps to prevent a sharp price correction," said OrangeTee research head Christine Li.

    The Monetary Authority of Singapore (MAS) is exempting more borrowers from total debt servicing ratio (TDSR) restrictions that took effect in June last year, subject to certain conditions.

    The TDSR caps a borrower's total debt repayments at 60 per cent of gross monthly income.

    Before the wider exemption, some borrowers who were near their refinancing deadlines may have been unable to refinance their home loan if their debt-to-income ratio was already over that limit, Ms Li said.

    These overstretched borrowers could have been "held hostage" by their banks and forced to "accept whatever repricing interest rates they offer", she added.

    Refinancing is when borrowers switch to another bank to get a cheaper home loan, whereas repricing means they stay with their current bank.

    "We are now not penalising consumers retrospectively," said PropNex chief executive Mohamed Ismail.

    MAS said last year that 5 per cent to 10 per cent of households were over the 60 per cent debt-to-income threshold. The proportion of "at-risk" households could grow to 10 per cent to 15 per cent if mortgage rates rise by 3 percentage points, it warned.

    Analysts said MAS likely widened the TDSR exemption to avoid a spate of forced selling by overstretched households, and was not signalling a reversal of its TDSR policy.

    "It is clear that refinancing of homes for such households will be problematic if the TDSR framework is applied," said HSBC senior property analyst Pratik Ray.

    "An increase in interest rates or loan margins would increase their repayment burden, resulting in possible forced sales."

    However, analysts said that avoiding forced sales would not lift buyer demand as curbs still apply to new buyers.

    OSK DMG analysts said in a note yesterday that they still expect property loans to "continue to moderate" in coming months.

    Barclays analyst Tricia Song said the Government may roll back some property market cooling measures, but only if prices fall by 10 per cent to 15 per cent.

    Private home prices slid 0.9 per cent in the fourth quarter last year.

    Ms Song maintained her prediction that home prices will fall 5 per cent this year and another 5 per cent to 15 per cent next year due to a rise in interest rates and oversupply of homes.

    MAS said on Monday that borrowers who bought homes before TDSR kicked in are now exempt from it if they are refinancing the home they live in, even if they own multiple properties or have other property loans.

    Prior to the change, owner-occupiers were exempt from TDSR only if they did not own any other property or did not have any other outstanding mortgages.

    MAS also said that borrowers who bought investment homes before TDSR are exempt from it when refinancing those homes until June 30, 2017, but they must commit to reducing their debt.

    MELISSA TAN
    Last edited by teddybear; 16-02-14 at 10:05.

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    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    I heard that because of ABSD, many foreigners (especially PRCs) and PRs still buying Singapore private properties/condos, but they are trying to save on ABSD by buying those cheaper units in the OCR, like Sengkang, Punggol, and West Coast and Jurong, super popular with foreigners especially PRCs!
    Because of ABSD, OCR private condos have been further heated up and that is why prices spiral up out of control! Otherwise how do you expect J Gateway can sell $1500-17xx psf?

    But now, ABSD coupled with TDSR, means singapore citizens upgraders hit with TDSR while still having to compete to buy OCR heartlander private condos properties with foreigners (including PRs) at INFLATED PRICES!!!
    Totally talk cock. Locals for own stay are not subjected to ABSD. Any foreign are turning to better deals in london or US. due to the Added stamp duty and anti speculation pricing.

    Singapore upgrades do not need to pay ABSD don't talk cock here.

    OCR price going out of control? recently launches are doing lower prices. wat cock u smoking?


    As usual trying to sprew XENOPHOBIC BS.
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    OUT WITH THE SHIT TRASH

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  15. #285
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    I believe more taxes on wealth and assets is not logical. Firstly, people already paid their taxes, and use these after-tax money to convert to assets (and store as wealth), so why tax again?

    And it is stupid and illogical to say that just because tax rate goes up means people won't come/stay in Singapore to create jobs!
    If increase tax on wealth and assets, won't rich and influential businessmen choose to live overseas and we lose businesses and jobs as well because they shift their head-quarters, businesses, and residential homes overseas? And won't more people shift their assets and park their wealth overseas then keep them in Singapore, and ultimately live in other countries rather than Singapore? There will be big repercussions on local domestic services and consumption! All this means we lose domestic service sector jobs, jobs which are supposedly cannot be transferred overseas (unless people start migrating overseas!) and hence will provide stable jobs for citizens but we just LOSE them just like that (because many rich businessmen start migrating overseas!)!!

    We should be encouraging more consumption, and encouraging more rich and influential businessmen to live in Singapore! When they live in Singapore, they bring their head-quarters, businesses into Singapore! All these will create more jobs and taxes revenue for Govt than just taxing on wealth and assets!

    On the other hand, if we misintrepret the more tax on wealth and assets and instead, this additional taxes are implemented to spread all over to lower income groups, it is even more unfair! This will increase the social inequality in Singapore! By doing so, won't it show that they are just paying lip service to reducing social inequality?

    Thus, we can keep corporate taxes, but increase personal income tax at the higher income brackets! Personal income are earned by salary people, and it doesn't matter so much if it has been raised because if they get a high-pay jobs here created by these rich businessmen, they just can't go elsewhere and still get that high-pay jobs! (If elsewhere got better jobs, they won't stay in Singapore!). These high-salary people don't really create jobs since they are not the businessmen! If they are the businessmen themselves, they know how to structure the deal to pay less taxes on their salaries, no problem with that.

    Again, I find many times, whatever has been touted in the media is loop-sided, as though it is an agenda to get you atune to it to "brain-wash" you into believing that all they said is true and common sense?



    Experts expect more taxes on wealth, assets

    Monday, Feb 17, 2014
    Alvin Foo
    The Straits Times

    SINGAPORE - Experts are expecting more taxes on wealth in the upcoming Budget to pay for a likely increase in social spending and to reduce the income gap.

    Higher taxes on assets such as property and cars could be on the cards for the Budget, to be delivered next Friday, they say.

    Such a move would be in line with the aim of a more progressive tax regime - a key theme of last year's Budget.

    A progressive tax takes a larger percentage from high-income earners than low-income ones.

    But increases to income and corporate tax rates look less likely, as they could dampen Singapore's regional economic edge, the experts added.

    A goods and services tax (GST) hike is also not widely expected this year.

    The wheels of a more progressive system were set in motion last year, with a shift towards taxing assets rather than income.

    Higher property taxes on investment and higher-end owner- occupied homes were introduced, while the tax rate for luxury cars was also raised.

    "Further hikes in asset-related taxes to raise the overall effective tax rate of the higher income earners should not be discounted in this Budget," said DBS economist Irvin Seah.

    The various goodies expected in this year's Budget - such as the recently announced Pioneer Generation Package - will result in higher government social spending, casting a spotlight on where the extra funds could come from.

    "We don't expect any knee-jerk reaction or shake-up of the tax system," said PwC Singapore's financial services tax leader Anuj Kagalwala.

    He said the introduction of capital gains or investment income taxes is not likely.

    Ernst & Young human capital partner Wu Soo Mee said there is room for higher tax rates for properties with an annual value above $60,000.

    Annual value refers to the potential yearly rental.

    "Individuals with properties of that value can well afford to pay higher property tax," she added.

    Citi economist Kit Wei Zheng said changes to vehicle taxes are more likely this time, given the already cooling property market.

    One possibility is to introduce steeper Additional Registration Fee rates of 200 per cent for a higher open-market value tier, he noted.

    Mr Kagalwala said tweaks may be made to car-related taxes other than the certificate of entitlement system, which is likely to remain untouched.

    A rise in income tax rates seems unlikely.

    Ernst & Young partners Lim Gek Khim and Grahame Wright said the little upside it offers - a small increase in total tax revenue - comes at the expense of a greater downside of a diminishing competitive edge vis-à-vis Hong Kong.

    "This risk may not be worthwhile," they added.

    One possible approach, said UOB economist Francis Tan, is to lower the income for the highest tax bracket of 20 per cent from the current $320,000 to say $300,000 or $280,000.

    A similar approach could be considered for the second and third highest brackets, and so on.

    This would raise the tax base without affecting Singapore's tax competitiveness, he added.

    Raising the GST is not that ideal, as such a tax is regressive - lower-income households will be more affected, as everyone pays the same tax rate.

    One way of making it more progressive is to impose a higher GST tax rate of "double or more" for luxury goods such as branded handbags and expensive watches, said Ernst & Young's Ms Wu.

    [email protected]


    Last edited by teddybear; 17-02-14 at 08:03.

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    Don't talk cock lah, if foreigners need to live in Singapore, and they need to buy a private property, and if they want to save on ABSD, obviously they will buy the cheapest price property possible! So, where? Obviously buy OCR private condos to save on ABSD they need to pay! This is just no-brainer! Why you and those people never thought of that? You are one of them is it?

    Recent launches at lower prices? Please go and see what they provide! All corners and costs are cut! Give you laminates in bedrooms and cheapest porcelain tiles and appliances and materials!
    This is the first time that I heard people ever use laminates and porcelain tiles in private condos!!! I remember only very poor people use these stuffs in the past!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by minority View Post
    Totally talk cock. Locals for own stay are not subjected to ABSD. Any foreign are turning to better deals in london or US. due to the Added stamp duty and anti speculation pricing.

    Singapore upgrades do not need to pay ABSD don't talk cock here.

    OCR price going out of control? recently launches are doing lower prices. wat cock u smoking?


    As usual trying to sprew XENOPHOBIC BS.

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    gentle reminder: please remember to be very careful when u use the words "only very poor people............."

    becoz many in hdb uses laminates? are u saying that people who stay in hdb are poor?

    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    Don't talk cock lah, if foreigners need to live in Singapore, and they need to buy a private property, and if they want to save on ABSD, obviously they will buy the cheapest price property possible! So, where? Obviously buy OCR private condos to save on ABSD they need to pay! This is just no-brainer! Why you and those people never thought of that? You are one of them is it?

    Recent launches at lower prices? Please go and see what they provide! All corners and costs are cut! Give you laminates in bedrooms and cheapest porcelain tiles and appliances and materials!
    This is the first time that I heard people ever use laminates and porcelain tiles in private condos!!! I remember only very poor people use these stuffs in the past!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    Don't talk cock lah, if foreigners need to live in Singapore, and they need to buy a private property, and if they want to save on ABSD, obviously they will buy the cheapest price property possible! So, where? Obviously buy OCR private condos to save on ABSD they need to pay! This is just no-brainer! Why you and those people never thought of that? You are one of them is it?

    Recent launches at lower prices? Please go and see what they provide! All corners and costs are cut! Give you laminates in bedrooms and cheapest porcelain tiles and appliances and materials!
    This is the first time that I heard people ever use laminates and porcelain tiles in private condos!!! I remember only very poor people use these stuffs in the past!!!

    What a cock narrow mindset. Foreigners don't rent? why must capex so much. many are very conscious on the ABSD. they rather rent!!!!!!!!!

    and manly locals are rushing hoping to buy and then RENT out.

    Talk cock u want complain price never drop. when quantum drop u want to complain corners. what next? don't come with free meimei or wife or gf? jiao wei.. when u say price go up. people point out price are softening and quantum are down. u say corners cut lah diff lah.....

    joker. goes to show u are a Big Bird leh.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter View Post
    gentle reminder: please remember to be very careful when u use the words "only very poor people............."

    becoz many in hdb uses laminates? are u saying that people who stay in hdb are poor?
    Aiyah he is a xenophobic and selfish , and self centerer rumor monger. I am not surprise he look down on people in singapore.
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    ..ffosfufidffdfdf

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    Almost all people in the world are paying taxes. I just wonder if it really goes to where should it be placed. Some people are paying very huge amount of tax yet they don't get good service from the state.

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    The Tax System Explained in Beer
    March 18, 2012 by Dan Mitchell
    In my explanations of the Laffer Curve, I’ve shown evidence that high tax rates discourage productive behavior and boost the underground economy.

    And if higher tax rates are sufficiently onerous, the resulting reductions in taxable income can completely offset the revenue-generating impact of higher tax rates. Indeed, this is what’s already happened with the “Snooki tax.”

    And the same thing happens in reverse. If lower tax rates lead to a big enough increase in taxable income, the government actually collects more revenue – which is exactly what happened when the top tax rate was lowered in the 1980s.

    I’ve also tried to explain, shifting from economics to philosophy, that confiscatory tax rates are unfair and immoral. And I’m glad to see that most Americans agree, with 75 percent of all people saying that nobody should ever face a tax rate of more than 30 percent.

    Notwithstanding that polling data, though, I fear that many people don’t really understand the economics of taxation. So I’m happy to share this little story that periodically winds up in my inbox.

    ===============================================

    Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this…

    The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing
    The fifth would pay $1
    The sixth would pay $3
    The seventh would pay $7
    The eighth would pay $12
    The ninth would pay $18
    The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59
    So, that’s what they decided to do.

    The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve ball.

    “Since you are all such good customers,” he said, “I’m going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20″. Drinks for the ten men would now cost just $80.

    The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes. So the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other six men ? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his fair share?

    The bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man’s bill by a higher percentage the poorer he was, to follow the principle of the tax system they had been using, and he proceeded to work out the amounts he suggested that each should now pay.

    And so the fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% saving).
    The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33% saving).
    The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28% saving).
    The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% saving).
    The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% saving).
    The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% saving).
    Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But, once outside the bar, the men began to compare their savings.

    “I only got a dollar out of the $20 saving,” declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,”but he got $10!”

    “Yeah, that’s right,” exclaimed the fifth man. “I only saved a dollar too. It’s unfair that he got ten times more benefit than me!”

    “That’s true!” shouted the seventh man. “Why should he get $10 back, when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!”

    “Wait a minute,” yelled the first four men in unison, “we didn’t get anything at all. This new tax system exploits the poor!”

    The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

    The next night the tenth man didn’t show up for drinks so the nine sat down and had their beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn’t have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

    And that, boys and girls, journalists and government ministers, is how our tax system works. The people who already pay the highest taxes will naturally get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas, where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.
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  23. #293
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    Don't talk cock lah. Here is the counter-argument in a story I heard.......


    ----------------------------
    Once upon a time, there is a village. The village head controls the village, and employed the people to work for him, and the village head's position was passed down to his son/daughter for generation to generation.

    Now now, the great-great grandfather of the village head previously came up with a tax scheme, that the rich were tax 40% progressively and were subjected to estate duty, while the poor and those with no income paid zero tax. Not only that, the village head dictated the pay he paid to the villagers that worked for him because he was the richest man in the village and he "create" jobs for the villagers!

    However, when it came to don't know how many generation after, the new head started to think: "Not fair, how can the poor villagers now be able to afford so many things? Must be because I paid too much tax and they paid close to nothing while I paid them too well!".

    So, after paying a princely sum for a group consultants to brainstorm, they came up with a "brilliant idea": "consumption tax" and "progressive tax on wealth"!
    The new head said: "Wait a minute, progressive tax on wealth? What consumption tax? I definitely have much much much x10,000 more wealth and consume much much much x10,000 more than the ordinary villagers! You bloody idiots, you suggest to tax me more using these 2 schemes?!"

    So, after another round of brainstorming, ah, the consultants come out with revised suggestions:
    1) must abolish "estate duty" and
    2) must reduce income tax when the consumption tax is introduced/raised
    , the reason being otherwise no other rich people (the new head included) will create jobs in the village!

    The consultants also this time come out with exact figures to explain why: "You see, now this time you have ZERO estate duty tax, you got tax cut that is much much more than the consumption tax you need to pay! Furthermore if you consume lesser or go somewhere with no consumption tax to consume you pay even much less tax! The villagers are poor and can't go else where to consume to avoid these taxes, but you can! You also don't have to pay so much tax upfront because of significant reduction of your income tax!. So you see, you will benefit tremendously!".

    The consultants continued: "Furthermore, you can collect even more taxes because the taxes are spreaded out to every villager, including those who does not work, new-born, young children, disabled, retired, unemployed, etc etc. Who cares? As long as they are breathing and have to eat and live they have to pay more taxes! The aging situation in your village is so bad that we expect your tax revenue collection to drop because less and less people working and hence you must find some way to increase your tax revenue! You won't want to increase your own income tax to make up for the short-fall don't you? Obviously you are the only few who can afford to pay much much more taxes! Anyway they won't feel as much pain as you because the taxes are spreaded out to everybody, every living humans, in the village now that each time you increase a little bit and you collect so much more tax!".

    This time, the village head is immersely satisfied and proceed to introduce the new scheme!

    So now, the consultants are being tasked to brain-wash the villagers into accepting the above the 2 schemes and the new head become even much much more richer than all the past generations of village heads and so much more happier as a result because he can afford so much more things and still save a lot of money because his income tax has been reduced much more than the consumption tax he needs to pay, and he can pass his wealth to his 1,000,000 future generations without being tax a single cent because no more "estate duty"!

    Many years later, the consultants are really amazed to hear the oridinary woodhead villagers talking so good about the "consumption tax" and the "tax on wealth" : "Our new village head is so smart! He introduced new tax scheme to tax the rich so much less so that they are encouraged to come here to create jobs for us! Otherwise we will all be jobless! The tax on wealth and consumption tax actually taxes the village head more! He is so honourable to introduce these 2 tax schemes to tax himself more! Only those stupid idiots will say that the new tax scheme is bad for the ordinary folks like us"..................................

    ----------------------------



    Quote Originally Posted by minority View Post
    The Tax System Explained in Beer
    March 18, 2012 by Dan Mitchell
    In my explanations of the Laffer Curve, I’ve shown evidence that high tax rates discourage productive behavior and boost the underground economy.

    And if higher tax rates are sufficiently onerous, the resulting reductions in taxable income can completely offset the revenue-generating impact of higher tax rates. Indeed, this is what’s already happened with the “Snooki tax.”

    And the same thing happens in reverse. If lower tax rates lead to a big enough increase in taxable income, the government actually collects more revenue – which is exactly what happened when the top tax rate was lowered in the 1980s.

    I’ve also tried to explain, shifting from economics to philosophy, that confiscatory tax rates are unfair and immoral. And I’m glad to see that most Americans agree, with 75 percent of all people saying that nobody should ever face a tax rate of more than 30 percent.

    Notwithstanding that polling data, though, I fear that many people don’t really understand the economics of taxation. So I’m happy to share this little story that periodically winds up in my inbox.

    ===============================================

    Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this…

    The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing
    The fifth would pay $1
    The sixth would pay $3
    The seventh would pay $7
    The eighth would pay $12
    The ninth would pay $18
    The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59
    So, that’s what they decided to do.

    The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve ball.

    “Since you are all such good customers,” he said, “I’m going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20″. Drinks for the ten men would now cost just $80.

    The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes. So the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other six men ? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his fair share?

    The bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man’s bill by a higher percentage the poorer he was, to follow the principle of the tax system they had been using, and he proceeded to work out the amounts he suggested that each should now pay.

    And so the fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% saving).
    The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33% saving).
    The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28% saving).
    The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% saving).
    The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% saving).
    The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% saving).
    Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But, once outside the bar, the men began to compare their savings.

    “I only got a dollar out of the $20 saving,” declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,”but he got $10!”

    “Yeah, that’s right,” exclaimed the fifth man. “I only saved a dollar too. It’s unfair that he got ten times more benefit than me!”

    “That’s true!” shouted the seventh man. “Why should he get $10 back, when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!”

    “Wait a minute,” yelled the first four men in unison, “we didn’t get anything at all. This new tax system exploits the poor!”

    The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

    The next night the tenth man didn’t show up for drinks so the nine sat down and had their beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn’t have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

    And that, boys and girls, journalists and government ministers, is how our tax system works. The people who already pay the highest taxes will naturally get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas, where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.

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    Even people living in HDB don't use laminates in bedrooms anymore!

    Laminates was used extensively in early 196x when Singapore as a whole is still very poor............... Never expect it to see it being introduced in such "expensive" private condos again in this age!

    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter View Post
    gentle reminder: please remember to be very careful when u use the words "only very poor people............."

    becoz many in hdb uses laminates? are u saying that people who stay in hdb are poor?

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    PUBLISHED FEBRUARY 28, 2014

    S'pore private home rent rates expected to fall

    Analysts see decline in demand as expatriate population shrinks

    BYLYNETTE KHOO [email protected]

    THERE is now a growing consensus among analysts that rental rates for private homes will slide in the coming two years since the official data showed the first quarter-on-quarter decline in four years for private home rents.
    Hopes that a growing expatriate population and resilient economic growth will lend support to rents have also dimmed since the latest government budget suggests continued tightening of foreign labour force.
    Savills Research said in a note yesterday that the residential leasing market will see a decline in demand from a shrinking pool of overseas nationals as more employment restrictions are implemented.
    "Rents in some locations may continue to see a correction, particularly in the mass-market segment due to strong competition from new supply, as well as smaller rental budgets amid the rising cost of living in Singapore," the property consultancy and research firm said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    Even people living in HDB don't use laminates in bedrooms anymore!

    Laminates was used extensively in early 196x when Singapore as a whole is still very poor............... Never expect it to see it being introduced in such "expensive" private condos again in this age!
    when you say laminates in bedrooms, what do you mean?

    i see in very high end condos, their furniture also use laminates, and not solid timber. the backs of high end wardrobes also use thin piece of plywood (and not solid timber.)

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    D2 rental is very bad in the last 3 months. The data that I have tells me rental has dipped 10 to 15% in D2. Other districts, still ok. OCR rental is fine. RCR still good. But I think the ripple effect could hit RCR soon.





    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear View Post
    PUBLISHED FEBRUARY 28, 2014

    S'pore private home rent rates expected to fall

    Analysts see decline in demand as expatriate population shrinks

    BYLYNETTE KHOO [email protected]

    THERE is now a growing consensus among analysts that rental rates for private homes will slide in the coming two years since the official data showed the first quarter-on-quarter decline in four years for private home rents.
    Hopes that a growing expatriate population and resilient economic growth will lend support to rents have also dimmed since the latest government budget suggests continued tightening of foreign labour force.
    Savills Research said in a note yesterday that the residential leasing market will see a decline in demand from a shrinking pool of overseas nationals as more employment restrictions are implemented.
    "Rents in some locations may continue to see a correction, particularly in the mass-market segment due to strong competition from new supply, as well as smaller rental budgets amid the rising cost of living in Singapore," the property consultancy and research firm said.

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    Rental fall will be a killer. Cant find tenant even a bigger killer. $1M 2br condo needs $3-4K/mth to service bank loan. Still haven add in tax/MCST. W/o tenant for 3 -4 mths is very worrying and stressful.

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    Bitcoins - Now 1 of hottest word in town!

    Is it a scam? Many people are asking..................

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    Confirm a scam, money already is a scam , Bitcoin is even worst.

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