Thanks for re-forwarding what I sent in the previous page.Originally Posted by teddybear
Worth considering either way I think.
Ultimate Underdog
Thanks for re-forwarding what I sent in the previous page.
Worth considering either way I think.
The three laws of Kelonguni:
Where there is kelong, there is guni.
No kelong no guni.
More kelong = more guni.
Junior
[QUOTE=teddybear;519623]1. For those who don't need money but only need the excess money to earn more interests, why should they "throw as much as you like into OA / SA" when they can earn more outside of OA/SA?
You think Government pay you more than they earn using your money? The answer is obvious!
2. If you are likely to need the money and don't have excess, it's highly risky to lock money up.
Yes, that is the case!
I have seen my relative (working in shipping line, age 54) CPF statement. His Salary is ave 3k throughout this 30 yrs of working
From $1000 to now $3900. Still working . 2 grown up children >age 21. Every year without fail, 10% goes
to his Church "fund" for past 30 yrs.
At age 54 - HDB fully paid in 2013
=============================
CPF OA=$49k (This 49k should have transfered to SA at much early age 40 to get a 4%)
CPF SA=$169k (I did ask him to transfer her OA to top up to max $161k last yr)
CPF net amount use for HDB housing = $223k
CPF accured interest = $89k
Majorities of ( diploma or degree holder ) them in the late 40s or 50s who live in only HDB. After paying off the HDB loan.
I believe they will have at least >100k in your OA. So if these 100k in your OA is planned properly & transfer early at age 30+.
The SA will probably be > $300k instead of <$180k.
So u dont have to voluntray cash contribution to meet your retirement need. You just need to use less CPF & more cash
to pay for your HDB loan. Then every year, transfer your OA to SA without fail.
Many of them are unaware of how their annual income adds up over 30 years of working (age 25 to age 55). Below is the assumption of your total life time income + your CPF.
1st job working age at 25 + low 3% increment every year to be on the safe side. Some in the early 30s already earn > $5k. I have included the annual 13th month bonus but
exclude the Variable bonus range from 0.5 mth to as high as 5 mths.
DEGREE HOLDER starting pay $2500 (3% increment yearly till age 55). Do nothing to your CPF. remain status quo
At age 25 - OA=$7.1k. SA=$1.9k MA=$2.5k
By age 35 - OA=$104k SA=31k. MA=38k
By age 45 - OA=$250k. SA=92k. MA=106k
By age 55 - OA=$450k. SA=227k. Once MA (now BHS) ceiling is reached. MA Excess goes to SA. But if SA min sum is also reached. MA excess goes to OA.
That why your OA grow fast as the MA excess is channelled into your OA.
By age 55, Total accumulated take home income = $1.3m CASH.
If you will to shift all your money from Ordinary Account to Special Account every year without fail
Then your OA=$340k but SA= $600k instead of $227k. The power of compounded interest 4-5%.
GOODBYE to TENSION. HELLO PENSION (CPF life).
The figure at Special acct depend on the min retirement sum set by CPF in 30yrs time.
Est about $337k (2.5% inlfation) for full retirement set by CPF.
$505k (2.5% inflation) for enhanced retirement sum set by CPF.
It could be less than 2.5% inflation or more than 2.5% inflation set by CPF.
Plan wisely. Remember what CONFUCIUS says. The man who moves a mountain begins by carrying away small stones.
To accomplish any major task , you first must take tiny steps in order to get it done.
If one has no long-term considerations, he can hardly avoid troubles every now and then.; He who has no anxious thoughts for the future will find trouble right at hand.;
If a man is not farsighted, he is bound to encounter difficulties in the near future.; Those who do not plan for the future will find trouble at their doorstep.
Junior
I fail to see the point in your post. I think your point is your relative is greedy and lost money in speculating on stocks. That's all.
Senior
At the rate the whole world printing money, putting the money in the bank (CPF) not the best place.
Junior
We are not voluntary cash contribution in the CPF. Just your 20% of your Salary + 17% from your employer. Just use less from CPF $ & more
cash to pay your HDB loan. Your 20% + 17% contribution into your CPF is for min retirement (1.8k) is enough unless you want a more comfortable
life of 3k-5k/mth.
You use 100% CPF $ for HDB loan if no choice but when your financial status is better. Then try to use less CPF $ for housing & consider how to
manage wisely your CPF by doing a internal transfer from OA to SA at your comfortable level at early age.
If you use 100% CPF for housing loan which is for your retirement. At the cash portion, it grow more & more. With alot of cash, you statrt
to think & seek more "WANT" (not more need) or seek more riches by investing. U forget about your retirement needs. If you mismanage
in buying a condo/apt ,invest in stock (90% dont make it), buy your "WANT" like CAR (change every 3 yrs) , yearly holiday etc. You will have
less money for retirement.
For those ( degree holder) who are in the late 40s or early 50s & a fully paid HDB. I can say that you still have at least min $100k (max >250k)
your OWN CPF OA where your SA est $140k to $150k (still below min sum $161k) if you do nothing to your CPF.
A survey shows that 55% cannot meet their CPF min sum. With 40 years of good economics growth since early 70s. Why 55% of the S'porean
are still unble to meet the MIN sum in their CPF at age 55? Majorties of them have mismanaged by seeking more pleasures , more want etc.
My cousin's wife work in CPF board, She says alot of S'porean have many REGRET due to mismanagement in their CPF. If they know earlier, they
will have at least min sum for retirement.
I think the CPF staffs are not fully train to explain the 1st priority need to educate S;porean about ONLY using 20% of your Salary Plus 17% of employer
contribution CPF for retirement. When I was in the early 30s (many yrs ago) . I went to CPF board twice to contribute cash. I cant believe the twice CPF
staff trying to persuade me not to do that as it will be LOCK IN. Said to me " I TOLD SO. DONT BLAME ME".
The next 30 yrs for S'pore will be tough. If u did not plan wisely this time round ,you will in real trouble. Some of my friends in late 40s changed jobs more than
10x during his >25 yrs of his working life. During that time in the 80s,90s & early 2000s. No problem at all to hop & hop to get better play. Now, you hop 2-3 times
& you may drop "dead" & cant have job at all.
FYI, those wiives who decided to become a homemaker to take care of children. You better start to think now about your retirement as you have much lesser
CPF for retirement.
Ultimate Underdog
Hard truths. Nobody says it better.
The main idea is to lock it in a form that makes it less tempting or impossible to spend while grow its size.
As long as the mentality is there, one should do fine. But do make sure the money is very unlikely to be needed.
The three laws of Kelonguni:
Where there is kelong, there is guni.
No kelong no guni.
More kelong = more guni.
Newbie
Dear cbsh, I enjoy your posts and thanks for your insights.
It's hard to part with our cash & have it parked for a very long term where we don't know if we get to see or use of the parked $.
Instant gratification is always more attractive. I don't see many young people and even in my children that can postpone wants for a bigger gain down the road. Maybe that is why unsecured & personal loan has grown so fast.
And there are those who believe they are investment savvy and they can achieve higher returns than CPF not withstanding the low interest rate environment.
I believe long term growth rate will be low and CPF interest may be pegged to long term govt bond rate. This policy has already been announced but we don't know when the govt actually implement it. For now, the govt still peg it to 4% on quarterly review. Well, that's a risk when the govt adjust the CPF special account rate lower too.
Ultimate Underdog
Actually last three years I managed over 10% per year on stocks. But the idea is the amount cannot be too big until it affects my emotion and judgement.
Once the amount reaches over 100-200K, I will start to look into properties to peg the growth to a more stable format.
It appears that putting into CPF is also viable, and I will definitely be looking into that avenue instead of more properties as the tax is very heavy now. Thanks bro CBSH!
The three laws of Kelonguni:
Where there is kelong, there is guni.
No kelong no guni.
More kelong = more guni.
Global recession is coming....
There are so many investment venues:
1) Stocks
2) Bonds
3) Properties
4) Futures
5) Options
6) Forex
7) Other derivatives eg CDS
8) Hybrids of the above
9) ...(what else I miss?)...
You pick the few you are good at to make money.......
If you are good at, you definitely can beat 4-5% of CPF return.............
If not, even buying some ETFs over long term (Warren Buffett recommends this option for the financial illiterate) will most likely beat 4-5% CPF return............. (you can have option of redeeming to cash whenever you want and when you need them (unlike CPF).....)
The problems with CPF is that:
1) You have no control over it and you can't take it out when you need the money (your medisave account and min sum is stuck forever, and the min amount required seems to grow forever as you grows older)......
2) You get stuck and you never know when you can get your money if policy changes (eg. 55 years old become 62 years old become 65 years old; Probably 67 years old in future before you can get your money???)........
3) You never know when the given interest will be lowered (likely no more min 2.5% in OA and 4% in SA in future while your money got stuck by the illusion of this min return which is not guaranteed forever to be the same)......
4) You never know whether it will be there or not when you need it since it is not explicitly guaranteed by the government. Even if it is there, the fact that S$ keep depreciating in value means you are worst off than investing in some other appreciating currency (vs S$ and vs inflation).........
So, ultimately, the decision to whether to transfer cash in CPF OA and CPF SA will lie with the person.....
The person have to consider all the above, and the fact that investing in some ETFs (recommended by Warren Buffett) using their cash most likely will earn better return than 2.5% and 4% (which likely will be reduced in future) in CPF OA and CPF SA over the medium to long term than allowing their cash to be stuck in CPF and can never withdraw while withdrawal age keep getting increased........
Senior
Never depend on CPF for retirement.
Start working in Jun 1984 for SGD 400 a month.
Bought my first HDB property 4 A with minimum CPF.
Sold 1995 for a profit of SGD 180K, loan 200K for another new HDB 5 I for 250K.
Bought 2 Bedroom for 535K with 20% (108K) in 2006.
Bought 3 Bedroom PH for 1.3 million in May 2011 with 40% down.
Rental income 6.6K less than a monthly mortgage for 1.8 million loan and other expense.
Still, believe Bank can loan me money I will still buy property.
Last edited by Arcachon; 10-07-16 at 20:34.
Senior
Junior
We are in a abnormal era world. Our future generation have to go through all these.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYDrQqJVZMc
This music played is suitable to listen in these current ABNORMAL ERA
Abnormal climate
Abnormal QE end up main street suffer.
Abnormal debts
Abnormal FX movement. All ones to devalue their currency
Abnormal negative interest rate.
Abnormal 13 yrs war in Middle east lead to more terrorism affecting the whole world.
Abnormal unscrupulous social media to confuse & corrupt the people mind.
Abnormal intervention of the stock mkt.
Abnormal huge flow into bond mkt due abnormal volatility of the FX & stock movement
The next uncertainty is the South China Sea. I am strong but I am tired of all these uncertainty.
That why I have huge allocation into bond.
Plan according to your need wisely. If you fail to plan for retirement. You are planning to fail .
Trouble will be at your door step sooner or later.
Newbie
Not everybody knows how to invest. Most people i know buy stocks and landed up losing. I am one of them. So those who dont know how to invest, I think CPF is a better option.
I make a bit of money from properties but going forward, it is getting tougher. Some of us in these forums know that gone are the days you will see huge asset inflation in a short time frame.
There are not many governments you can trust like my Aussies friends said about their gov. MY of course. But I might be wrong, if we dont trust SG and CPF, then i dont really know who I can trust. But this is just me as I dont normally over worry and over analyse.
Ultimate Underdog
It's not so much the appreciation of properties but the simultaneous devaluation of currencies.
Disruptive technologies certainly have changed the game tremendously for goods that can be easily marked up in production by especially China, everything ranging from electronics to handphones to clothings.
But anything else that is relatively undisturbed by disruptive technologies, such as rice and household stuff, properties, stocks and bonds tied to vehicles that are also undisturbed, we will see them gaining value due to money losing value. And for that matter, CPF is also relatively undisturbed.
My two cents only.
The three laws of Kelonguni:
Where there is kelong, there is guni.
No kelong no guni.
More kelong = more guni.
Senior
Throw in automation robotics , 3D printing. thats going to change the way things are manufactured and delivered to the consumer. That will also have a big impact to the traditional jobs people hold and think will always be there. We are already seeing how e-commerce have seep into the everyday lives of how people consume. couple that with the Global providers of services crossing country boarders disrupting traditional business models, i.e. Pay TV, Transport, Logistic. We are going to enter a new Era. So for Singapore either we go with it try to scale and position ourselves and our workforce into this new market place. Or we get left behind. Singapore don't have anything. Only thing is the human capital and for now the ability to attract human capital.
“Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.”
― Martin Luther King, Jr.
OUT WITH THE SHIT TRASH
https://www.facebook.com/shutdowntrs
Global recession is coming....
Yes, not everyone know how to invest, that is why I agreed with Warren Buffett, that for those who don't know how to invest, they just need to invest in global ETFs like S&P500 ETF and they would still do better in the long run (vs CPF). Anyway, fact is, many actively managed funds didn't perform as well as ETFs, and CPF can pay you that kind of return is because their return (through Temasek and GIC) is much higher. By investing through global ETFs, you can keep all the higher returns to yourself (don't have to share with Temasek and GIC).......
As to investments, we just have to smarter than the rest and move faster than the rest! Think out of the box and you would be successful! If you just read and follow whatever people want to you read and hear, you will not be successful!
Anyway, CPF has no guarantee from Singapore government (if say their return is lower than interest payout, and we have no idea what is in the book, there is no detail annual report of their assets, returns etc, same as Temasek and GIC), so, trust nobody except yourself! And I have more confident in the big boy to be around 50 years or 100 years from now than the small boy! And you never know what new policy changes there will be to CPF............ So, having a bird in your hand (you can do whatever you want) is better than 2 in the bush (e.g. with CPF)............
Newbie
Ok Kumxia.. Will take note of ETF once I am no longer long on property investment. Right now, i am like 95% on property. So if property crash, we might be hit. The only consolation is we are planning for the longer terms.Yes, not everyone know how to invest, that is why I agreed with Warren Buffett, that for those who don't know how to invest, they just need to invest in global ETFs like S&P500 ETF and they would still do better in the long run (vs CPF). Anyway, fact is, many actively managed funds didn't perform as well as ETFs, and CPF can pay you that kind of return is because their return (through Temasek and GIC) is much higher. By investing through global ETFs, you can keep all the higher returns to yourself (don't have to share with Temasek and GIC).......
As to investments, we just have to smarter than the rest and move faster than the rest! Think out of the box and you would be successful! If you just read and follow whatever people want to you read and hear, you will not be successful!
Anyway, CPF has no guarantee from Singapore government (if say their return is lower than interest payout, and we have no idea what is in the book, there is no detail annual report of their assets, returns etc, same as Temasek and GIC), so, trust nobody except yourself! And I have more confident in the big boy to be around 50 years or 100 years from now than the small boy! And you never know what new policy changes there will be to CPF............ So, having a bird in your hand (you can do whatever you want) is better than 2 in the bush (e.g. with CPF)............
Junior
A person earning accumulated income est $1.5m for the last 8 yrs & yet still in financial trouble. i believe he was not managing his money well at all.
Now financial trouble at his door step for failure to plan. Hope it will not turn in a financial crisis.
If one has no long-term considerations, he can hardly avoid troubles every now and then.; He who has no anxious thoughts for the future will find trouble right at hand.; If a man is not farsighted, he is bound to encounter difficulties in the near future.; Those who do not plan for the future will find trouble at their doorstep.
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I used to be a Regional Marketing / Sales and Training Manager for a pharmaceutical company and it was effectively a Regional Director’s position. I was earning about $15,000/month then. I spent almost 10 years in the industry and company, since January 2005 and was made redundant in March 2013.
I immediately made many changes of lifestyle and even went into a repayment mode with several banks and financial institutions and even got the car finance company to take the car back in and to change the shortfall of the loan into a personal loan.
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Ultimate Underdog
95% on one instrument always appear to be too heavy.
It's always about balance.
Maybe build up a cash and CPF (OA) buffer and re-invest in other instruments recommended here, including ETFs (which I am clueless about) and CPF SA.
The three laws of Kelonguni:
Where there is kelong, there is guni.
No kelong no guni.
More kelong = more guni.
Junior
[QUOTE=cbsh38584;519633]
Bought Great eastern 18 yrs endowment policy using CPF-OA in 1997.
Premium deduct every yr from CPF OA for 18 yrs = $2333 X 18 = $40192.
18 yrs later. The return is = $59,757.
Est return is about 4% calculated by my agent which is better than CPF-OA 2.5%.
I again try to ask around all the insurance companies whether they still offer endowment polices using CPF-OA.
They have stopped selling endowment policies many yrs ago using CPF OA as they are unable to meet the guarantee min 2.5%
required by CPF board.
Only using CASH for endowment policy which they say return is low 3% but not guarantee.
Senior
[QUOTE=cbsh38584;519685]It works out to be 2.6% if u take the profit divide by 18 yrs...
“Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.”
― Martin Luther King, Jr.
OUT WITH THE SHIT TRASH
https://www.facebook.com/shutdowntrs
Global recession is coming....
minority,
Don't be bloody stupid and lying again here!!!!!!!!
cbsh,
You are right,
the actual return is ~3.98% p.a. (if you want to be more precise)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
But then you also highlight a very important point: All good schemes with good deals will be sooner or later be removed (if the terms and conditions can be changed unilaterally while you get stuck and you can't say the other party change the terms & conditions and you can then want out especially with no penalty etc)! I don't see this to be any different from CPF, so I prefer my money not to be stuck and I have no control over it while others can keep changing policies and terms and conditions anyway they like........
With global ETFs, the long-term return has historically been 7-10%.
This is probably higher than GIC's long-term return............
Temasek's claimed return of 17% since inception, well, seems incredibly too good, as that would mean Temasek is as good, if not better the world's undisputed and most acclaimed investor Warren Buffett!
According to media statements, we came to know that: Temasek was incorporated in 1974 as an invesment company with initial capital of S$354 Millions; At 31 Mar 2013, Temasek's asset under management was S$215 Billions or total shareholder return (TSR) 17% p.a. since inception (39 years).
As we know, Warren Buffett is the acclaimed world's best investor (with annualized return of about 17+% too) - best because of longest and highest annualized return track record (and whose record is in the open and everybody can independently verify and see for themselves)........ And now Temasek claimed to be of same level as him? Given that there is no transparency before Temasek start releasing their assets and returns and there is no details about the capital injections into Temasek by the Government, and there is no way for people to independently verify, no wonder there are numerous people who openly doubted Temasek's claimed of 17% return since inception.......... People can read about the doubt raised here..........:
http://www.baldingsworld.com/2013/06...lly-earned-17/
http://fifthestate.co/why-ho-ching-wont-respond-to-me/
http://www.baldingsworld.com/2013/04...valued-assets/
http://www.scmp.com/print/article/10...re-tooth-fairy
There are also heated discussions at Hardwarezone (but this thread has since been removed)!:
http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/ea...l#post75806333
(and why did hardwarezone delete the thread totally???)
According to here:
http://www.theonlinecitizen.com/2013...whats-missing/
more questions were made after MOF clarifications.
So, the doubt of Temasek’s return is as follow:
“Began with $354m in 1974?
In this connection, according to Temasek’s web site – “Value since Inception - Formed in 1974, Temasek began with a portfolio of S$354 million”.
If you compound $354 million for 39 years at 16 %, you get about $116 billion. So, to get to Temasek’s portfolio value now of $215 billion, there were capital injections and "boost" to valuation from listings due to the market valuation of some pre 2002 assets.
With (without data) capital injections & "boost" valuations – how can citizens calculate the return of 16%?
But, here’s where the puzzle or confusion may begin. Since ”The Government injects capital into Temasek from time-to-time as part of the Government’s allocation of fresh flows of funds, and to allow Temasek to plan its future investment strategies” – how can we calculate and analyse the annualised return since inception of 16 % without more information on the capital injections and "boost" valuations?
Why didn’t just give the “capital injections” data?
As if to add to the jigsaw puzzle – the above does not tell you how much these capital injections were? Maybe they are buried somewhere in the last 10 years’ annual reports. As a citizen, or for that matter – no one should have to try to crack his head and try to figure out how much and when the capital injections were made?
To put it simply and bluntly – why didn’t the above just give the “capital injections” data?
$30b capital injection from inception to 2008?
According to a Speech by S Dhanabalan, Chairman (of Temasek), at The Indus Entrepreneurs event on 21 August 2008 – “Since inception, we have received a total injection of a little less than S$30 billion in assets and cash”.
”
However, there is wrong assumption in the above. It is wrong to say “If you compound $354 million for 39 years at 16 %, you get about $116 billion. So, to get to Temasek’s portfolio value now of $215 billion”.
Actually, if you start with $354M and compound monthly for (39*12) months at (16.55%/12) pm, you actually get about $215 Billion! (But if you compound annually you get $116 Billion as mentioned in the article!)
Actually, if you do a Excel XIRR annualized return calculation assuming that there is no capital injection and there is only $354M capital to start with in 1974, and if you have $215B at then end of 31 March 2013, the annualized return rate is actually ~= 17.7% !!!
(See figure "Return1").
For those who don’t know what is annualized return and using XIRR (in Excel) to calculate them, you can read here:
http://www.investopedia.com/ask/answ...cagr-excel.asp
However, we were also told by Ministry of Finance that:
“In the case of Temasek, the Government is its sole shareholder. The Government injects capital into Temasek from time-to-time as part of the Government’s allocation of fresh flows of funds, and to allow Temasek to plan its future investment strategies. These capital injections are reflected in Temasek’s accounts and are made public.”.
Also: “According to a Speech by S Dhanabalan, Chairman (of Temasek), at The Indus Entrepreneurs event on 21 August 2008 – “Since inception, we have received a total injection of a little less than S$30 billion in assets and cash”.”.
But hei, like that means Temasek didn’t include all the new capital/asset injection from Government and also the dividends they received along the way from 1974 to 2013 March??? It still comes back to the same question: Why wasn’t capital injection (and dividends received along the way) included in the computation of Temasek’s return???
This is very important because if you exclude those, your portfolio’s return will be inflated, that is, the calculated return will be much larger than it really is!
If you include $30B of capital injection from inception to 2008 mentioned by S Dhanabalan, Chairman (of Temasek), on 21 August 2008 (and spread them out aga-aga since I don’t know when they were done and the exact amount), the we can estimate that Temasek’s return will be LESS than % 10.73% !!!
(See figure "Return2").
But, if that is the case, wonder why they didn't include dividends received, capital injection made and other cash/asset injection made along the way into the return computation?
So if Temasek didn’t include these dividends received and asset/capital injection etc at market value into their return calculation, then their return cannot be compared apple-to-apple to others internationally like Warren Buffett!
And that bring us back to another question: How does GIC compute their return? Does GIC include fresh capital injections into their computation of their annualized return???
So, now we know that Warren Buffett is still the only undisputed investment "GOD" with annualized return of about 17% (which include all fresh capital injections) that the whole world come to know and accept (despite claim of 17% return by Temasek)..............
Last edited by teddybear; 12-07-16 at 19:29.
Senior
Pls show us leh? dont just claim your bullshit leh?
payer paid 2333 X 18 yrs = 40192 cash
After 18 yrs become $59,757
that means a profit of $19, 565. You bloody spread that reaturn over 18 yrs ur bloody profit is 2.7% pa u bloody ass.
“Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.”
― Martin Luther King, Jr.
OUT WITH THE SHIT TRASH
https://www.facebook.com/shutdowntrs
Global recession is coming....
minority,
Stop all lies here!
Wanting to lie through your teeth again?
Ha ha ha!
Didn't cbsh already told you that the return is about 4%, and you still want to insist that it should be 2.7%?
What bloody scambag! Keep insisting other people are wrong and you are right with such non-sensical calculation that is totally flawed???
Can somebody show minority how to calculate to get ~4% because he is either trying to lie through his teeth or he is one bloody ignorant stupid idiot who trying insisting he is right and want to act smart (and exposing himself as bloody stupid idiot in the process)???
I just don't feel like wasting my time on such bloody epic liar..........................
He still haven't provide proof to me on all the other issues that he insisted he is right and now he is challenging me to show him that he is lying again???
Last edited by teddybear; 13-07-16 at 00:06.
Junior
I consider my money in CPF is another AAA rated bond which offer high interest rate (2.5% to 5%) guarantee by our govt. I am getting close to est $18,000
guarantee interest by end of 2016. It will grow & grow from $18k to $20k to $22k & so on as year goes by. If I know when I am in early 30s. My CPF interest
earning will be > $30k a year. I started late .
For those at age 55 onward. you will get between 4% to 6% as compare to local bank between 0.8% to 1.3%.
1st 30k earn 6% = $1800
2nd 30k earn 5% = $1500
Bal above 60k shall earn 4%.
So if you have a stable job with a the financial mean when you are young. Plan YOUNG by ONLY USING your 20% of your Salary + 17% of your employer
contribution to CPF to enjoy the 4% to 5% by transfering CPF-OA to CPF-SA.
My sister's daughter, age 30 already more >100k in her saving acct. So I am telling her to transfer some of her CPF-OA to CPF-SA. But she hestiate
as she already used her CPF-OA $30k into unit trust in 2014 which is still losing 8%. It was >20%losses in early 2016. I dont know when she can recover
her losses. Next yr ? , 3 yrs later?. 10 yrs later ? Nobody knows. But one thing I know she is losing her chances of getting guarantee 4%-5% in her SA acct if
she transfer this $30k from OA to SA.
If her CPF-OA investment of $30k is still "under water" 5 yrs later. I am using 4% to calculate.
Her 30k investment using CPF-OA will lose interest if she transfer to SA ( 5 yrs) = 30k + 6.5k (lost opportunity interest)
10 yrs will be = 30k + 14.4k (lost opportunity interest) = $44.4k
20 yrs will be = 30k + 35.5k (lost opportunity interest) = $55.5k
30 yrs will be = 30k + 67k (lost opportunity interest) = $97k
http://www.moneychimp.com/calculator...calculator.htm
Can her unit trust of 30k grow in 5,or 10 or 20 yrs time to match the return of CPF-SA ? Nobody knows. But I know she will get guarantee interest from CPF-SA.
Our CPF is one of the best tool for retirement planning. We should focus our time & energy on growing our CPF as young as possible to enjoy the power
of high compounded interest rate . CPF withdrawal age will always be 55.Only change is how much u can withdraw after deducting the min sum SA
(year 2016 is $161k) needed to set aside .
Retirement planning is like what Confucius said.
The man who moves a mountain begins by carrying small stones.
To accomplish any major task , you first must take tiny steps in order to get it done.
Retirement planning is like what Muhammad Ali said.
“I hated every minute of training, but I said, ‘Don’t quit. Suffer now and live the rest of your life as a champion.
Newbie
In excel, key in "=RATE(18,-2333,0,59757,1)", it will give 3.6%
[QUOTE=cbsh38584;519685]
Senior
TALK COCK SOILD HOR!! I ASK U SHOW US!!! U CAN WRITE SO MUCH CRAP! GOES TO SHOW A SHIT FART LIKE YOU IS ALL 99% SHIT! 1% AIR!minority,
Stop all lies here!
Wanting to lie through your teeth again?
Ha ha ha!
Didn't cbsh already told you that the return is about 4%, and you still want to insist that it should be 2.7%?
What bloody scambag! Keep insisting other people are wrong and you are right with such non-sensical calculation that is totally flawed???
Can somebody show minority how to calculate to get ~4% because he is either trying to lie through his teeth or he is one bloody ignorant stupid idiot who trying insisting he is right and want to act smart (and exposing himself as bloody stupid idiot in the process)???
I just don't feel like wasting my time on such bloody epic liar..........................
He still haven't provide proof to me on all the other issues that he insisted he is right and now he is challenging me to show him that he is lying again???
“Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.”
― Martin Luther King, Jr.
OUT WITH THE SHIT TRASH
https://www.facebook.com/shutdowntrs
Global recession is coming....
minority,
Show you?
How about this, If I can show you, you would admit that you are like what you said:
"U CAN WRITE SO MUCH CRAP! GOES TO SHOW A SHIT FART LIKE YOU IS ALL 99% SHIT! 1% AIR!"
minority,
I can SURELY BET you won't dare to accept the challenge, , ha ha ha!
minority,
Stop all lies here!
Wanting to lie through your teeth again?
Ha ha ha!
Didn't cbsh already told you that the return is about 4%, and you still want to insist that it should be 2.7%?
What bloody scambag! Keep insisting other people are wrong and you are right with such non-sensical calculation that is totally flawed???
Can somebody show minority how to calculate to get ~4% because he is either trying to lie through his teeth or he is one bloody ignorant stupid idiot who trying insisting he is right and want to act smart (and exposing himself as bloody stupid idiot in the process)???
I just don't feel like wasting my time on such bloody epic liar..........................
He still haven't provide proof to me on all the other issues that he insisted he is right and now he is challenging me to show him that he is lying again???
Junior
Try to flip by buying investment grade IPO bond , Zurich insurance 4.75% perp bond yesterday. But was 10x oversubscribe
Now to buy is 101+.
Junior
Vedanta Resources has repaid in full and redeemed $514.8m in convertible bonds due on 13 July.
==========================================================================
I flipped twice for this JUNK bond but many sleepless nite during the commodities crash from Jan16 onward.
Moody's downgraded the company's senior unsecured rating to Caa1 ( Substantial risks) from B1 in Mar16.
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