Seems not many units, esp those on stack 3 and 7, are still up for rental..
Surprised that rentals are still down. Heard the best rates are 6k per mth??
Seems not many units, esp those on stack 3 and 7, are still up for rental..
Surprised that rentals are still down. Heard the best rates are 6k per mth??
there are many agents in this forumOriginally Posted by Riverund
they advertise here .. for sale and for rent ..
but theyNEVER ever commented on whats the real rental tahts gone thru .. in new and old projects
i see Hillcrest villa advertising 10k rental .. i know of a friend who managed to rent out at 9k after undercutting each other ..seems alot out for rent
2 yrs ago a rented a 2 bed room at RV .. remember they advertised 4.3k i negotiated to 3.5k ... and requested for partial furnishing .. and got it ..
i just checked .. its still around 3.5k so what is the true demand for rental ? no one really knows ... unless some kind hearted agent care to reveal ...
despite all the press saying more expats coming .. companies employing .. i really havent seen a pick up in rental ...
my feel is that .. there are alot more condos now than before .. and expats coming in are mere replacement of those let go last yr ..
so nett effect .. we may indeed have a surplus of condos out for rent ..
check out those 4 bedrooms .. over 2000 sqft .. looks terrible ...
i rememeber my GM rented 4 seasons .. paid 24k many years ago .. it is now an old condo .. asking only 15k ..
then again those new ones nearby CANT command 20k ... just reinforce my view that rental ..hard to go up
Agrees with proud owner.
To me everything is cyclical....things will; come down esp with so much units coming on line.....
The unemployment is still very very very high in US and China....nothing has really improves fundamentally.....
How can rental goes up in the near future when thousands
of units will be available with the TOP of so many condos launched in the last few years... unless they is a significant additional influx of expats on top of those who are merely replacement of the former that has left...
In short..unlikely as i was told by my agent can cover monthly loan installments + maintainance is considered acceptable by some investers
Fiona spent so much time writing the following:Originally Posted by mr funny
"A concerns of an oversupply are överblöwn. The 34,100 figure of unsold units in the 3rd quarter of this year is much lower than the 43,400 in the 4th quarter of last year, and not far from the all-time löw of 30,300 in 2007."
But people still prefer making up stories and ignoring the boring facts.
Poor Fiona!
fiona is referring to unsold units. the discussion above is referring to sold units which are completing in the next 3 years but with the intention of leasing out. i think the published articles do not give an accurate picture of the oversupply because they refer only to unsold units. i guess their implicit assumption (since they do not discuss about units which people bought to lease out) is that all sold units can be held on to without the need for renting out. This is obviously not the case if you talk to agents. I am very surprised. You are a recent buyer of a district 9 property but you don't seem to discuss such issues with your agent very much but instead rely only on published news articles? Doesn't the on the ground reality matter more?
Originally Posted by Reporter
"But people still prefer making up stories and ignoring the boring facts.
"....
humm.. sounds exactly like one, but somehow people still doesnt realised in this republic island , media is "controlled"........ with propoganda
... cos' I ain't you ...Originally Posted by bargain hunter
... I dun believe in hear-says, I believe in facts ...
I have not passed any judgement on any of the postings above (i.e. I did not say any of you were right or wrong).
Please show us figures to support the following claims so that others will not be misled:
1. "... my feel is that .. there are alot more condos now than before .. and expats coming in are mere replacement of those let go last yr ..
so nett effect .. we may indeed have a surplus of condos out for rent .."
2. "... the unemployment is still very very very high in ... China ..."
3. "... How can rental goes up in the near future when thousands
of units will be available with the TOP of so many condos launched in the last few years? ..."
And the reason we should ignore the figures but believe in your words would be?Originally Posted by mogyi
And you are?
its not hear-says. i have worked with the agents i talk to for a long time so i know they are telling the truth about the reality out there.
you know that agents as a whole have an agenda to keep prices and rentals up because of the commissions they earn so how do you expect reports of the poor rental situation to be published at all?
anyway, its alright. you believe what you want to and i will do the same for my beliefs. afterall, you are the one who recently bought a district 9 property so good luck for your purchase.
Originally Posted by Reporter
You think the reason I posted has got to do with:Originally Posted by bargain hunter
1. My recent purchase?
2. They have different believe from me?
You may be narrow-minded. I am not.
Do you know why I never argue with their observation that rental is bad? Because there are figures readily available to support the claim. There is nothing misleading about the observation.
They made more claims after that. I am just wondering if these claims are misleading. I am waiting for them to provide the figures to support these claims.
when did i say anyone should listen to my words and ignore the facts?Originally Posted by Reporter
and who are you?
Rentals got a lot to do with the locations and amenities around. Heard from agents that recently those condos in good convenient locations and with amenities nearby already got their rentals jacked up (in newly signed tenancy agreements). As such, rentals bad or going down is true for some places while not true for others. You have to experience that to believe that this is so.
Originally Posted by bargain hunter
haha, i never thought your posting has anything to do with your recent d9 purchase. i really wanted to wish you well ahead of the new year so there is no need for personal attacks like saying others are narrow minded.
the oversupply situation discussed refers to the sold and going to TOP units so your article on oversupply relating to unsold units is not so relevant here.
Originally Posted by Reporter
that is true. however, it is only happening at the very top end of the market actually. for the CCR but not luxury class, the rentals are actually neither falling nor going up. a very simple reason is that expats' company sponsored budget caps are still there eg 3k, 5k, 8k. as proud owner mentioned, the rental market for the big 4 bedrooms is particularly bad. many brand new ones are struggling to find tenants at 8k becoz there are not that many tenants with such a budget vs the number of units completed and coming up.
Originally Posted by teddybear
The rental has gone up again.Originally Posted by Reporter
It is nothing fantastic, but it has gone up again.
I know because every now and then I have leases up for renewal.
In fact, due to the very low SIBOR rate of only 1+ %, the rentals are able to completely cover the mortgage, with extra few hundreds leftover per property per month.
But even if they do not cover, I am perfectly ok to come up with some of my own money to top up because, at the end of the day, I am going to own the property, not the tenant.
In fact, I feel a bit guilty that the tenants are helping me to pay for my properties. Sometimes I feel they must have owed me something in their previous lives.
Originally Posted by mogyi, 12.16 pmOriginally Posted by Reporter, 12.19 pmI am someone who is still waiting for you to justify your claims.Originally Posted by mogyi, 1.05 pm
if things are so rosy, why:
25 Akyab Road #21-05
Freehold
$1210
1485
$1796k
25 Aug 09
25 Akyab Road #27-05
Freehold
$1200
1485
$1782k
14 Sep 09
and the latest caveat is:
25 Akyab Road #22-05
Freehold
$1144
1485
$1700k
07 Dec 09
Don't try to hard to scrutinize too small a dataset because they are not representative of a bigger trend. If you look at other stacks and places and the picture is different.
Originally Posted by bargain hunter
i am just learning from reporter, just as he highlights a single record psf, i am trying to do the same for falls.
Originally Posted by teddybear
????? u can have the last say... i see that u needed thatOriginally Posted by Reporter
Ok fair enough.
Originally Posted by bargain hunter
Highlighting a single record psf is different from highlighting the falls within the potpourri of data.Originally Posted by teddybear
The "record psf" serves a very important function, because it serves as a benchmark. Each "record psf" makes people sit up and notice the market.
Imagine this news headline say, sometime in the future, "First HDB Resale Closed Above $1 million". It will make people sit up and do some soul searching, or go have a walk in the garden to reflect about their lives.
On the other hand, within the potpourri of housing data, there will always be some which rise and some which fall. Even after, say, the first HDB resale closes above $1 million, there will continue to be some HDB flats which rise, and some which fall.
Thanks for highlighting that bargain hunter, trying to get personal with me, is putting words in my mouth.Originally Posted by jlrx
I did highlight the record psf. However, I don't remember concluding trend using any set of data. In fact, I don't remember concluding any trend so far.
bargain hunter is a dangerous guy. Need to be careful man!
You did not conclude any trend because you only "report" rather than "analyse". You should provide some analysis to your "reports" so as to make them more meaningful.Originally Posted by Reporter
In fact, the "record psf" tells us a lot about the trend of the property market.
When the "record psf" goes up, that means the "average psf" has also gone up; although, within the potpourri of housing data, some specific units may go up or down.
For the same reason, in the area of income, the number of people earning more than $1 million per year serves as a very important benchmark.
From zero in 1988, to 100+ in 1998, to 3,838 in 2008, that is a trend.
Some people pointed out previously that this is not reflective of the general income trend for the population, as the pay of fresh graduates and toilet cleaners have stagnated over the past two decades. I beg to differ.
An increase in the topmost pay will pull up the average, even if the lowermost pay remains unchanged.
It's like the effect of global warming and the rising sea level.
All governments in the world are keeping watch on the highest point of the sea level, not on whether a certain water molecule 300 m below the Pacififc Ocean has gone down to 2000 m below, or another water molecule which was 1759 m below the surface of the Indian Ocean is now 25.9 m below the surface of the sea.
It is the surface sea level (equivalent to the "record psf") which tells us how much of the polar ice caps have melted, and whether coastal lines will remain or disappear.
i am just trying to provide some balance. blindly focusing on a single record psf was what the government highlighted back then in 2007 as dangerous. that was also why they introduced the median prices data for more transparency and to prevent people from overhyping a single record psf.
its funny because i have never concluded that prices are in a downtrend, you guys are the ones putting words in my mouth. I merely pointed out comparisons for same stacks and higher floors transacted at lower psf at later dates. Those are real facts that its possible for prices to be done within the same development at lower prices.
Originally Posted by Reporter
From an owner's pespective, analysing, reporting, whatever, using stack 5 is a bad idea.
Stack 5 is about the worst stack in the developement. Pls pardon me if you are reading this and you are in stack 5. Stack 3 and 7 has got unblocked view in front and on the right side. Stack 1 is blocked by Ansley up till level 21 I think. But stack 5 ... it is blocked by stack 3 !
Anyway, it is useless to try to talk up or down the market. I read with laughter the other forum where hundreds of people in Jun/Jul period cursed the record volume and convincingly predicted that the economy is on a W recovery and major crash in Q4 09 - Q1 2010. Now if they look back, they probably laugh at themselves.
If u think the market is going down, sell now. If u think the market is going up, buy now. No need to try convince others, unless u are willing to bear their losses.
Just my simple thoughts.
can stack 6 see any flyer or casino if the unit is below 20 floor since it is unblocked?
In view of current rental mkt condition, would one then go for a 1-yr rental contract vs 2-yrs?Originally Posted by teddybear
Just interesting to note the expat population at this development, judging by the ang mohs suntanning every weekend .... either at the pool or at their balcony!! Makes viewing the apartments available at P11 all the more interesting.
Wonder if tenant population will be similar at Montebleu....
For stack 1,2,3 have to clear 25th storey ...
For stack 5,6,7 have to clear 20th I think ... but to be sure, 23rd ...
Tomorrow got fireworks .. the first time since TOP, I think, owners can feedback which floors can see the fireworks ...