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Thread: Centro

  1. #121
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    err...since this is a centro thread and i thought centro already previewed, how's the response har? what with all the blank cheques that have been handed in potentially to buy at 1200psf?

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel_Yee
    I don't know what is OCR. But if you are talking about suburban, then yes. 600psf is a supporting level. And HDB is supporting this 600psf. So if HDB collapse, the whole property market will be in shit.

    From my experience on valuation from buying TR, banks usually see the past 2-3 months transactions. Take an average and probably offer another 10-15% extra in valuation. They have to do it because of business needs and sense. And they don't see interior. They let the market guage the psf, take an average and offer you max. 15% extra. Probably flooring and facing play a small part but won't make a big difference. Anyway, location is the main factor for a condo price. Design is second so location is still king.

    I don't agree with you on the sail. From outside, it looks really great. Tall, majestic with a very very nice curve. At night, the 2 pillar lights are so prominent and nice. When you walk in, the design is still great. I remember got some water thing at the main lobby. Nice! The lift lobby is still a class above my TR. When reach the corridor, still look great. But the moment the door open, look like ordinary condo. When reach the toilet, I thought I was in a HDB flat. The most distinctive thing I remember was the tiles even though I went there twice only. Really look like some coffeeshop toilet tiles. Facilities is normal for a city area condo. Same as my TR but should have more facilities since it brand itself 6 stars. But facilities and gym still look class enough. If sail don't look like a condo, wait till you see MBR. IMO, if my TR can fetch 1.2k psf, sail should be doubled. Don't own any unit at sail but it is a nice project in a nice location. Interior really need to put in some $. But if you can buy at 2000psf, don't tell me you cannot fork out 20k. We are talking about other condos in Centro thread. Hahahahahaaaa.

    Seems like Centro really sucks because we are comparing the psf with sail and the prime districts but centro is in such a lousy location. I pity those who fork out 1200psf because I paid 900+psf for my TR, freehold.
    You are correct. I feel that the crux of the pricing support is provided by the HDB flats.

    When the dotcom bubble burst, There were many unoccupied flats in newer estates. Big time. Contractors went bust and HDB flats were delayed.

    The recent new HDB schemes (BTO) was excellent to mitigate the bleeding in economic cycles but it provided a strong support as a result.

    It is really interesting to experience the cycle this time round.

    - I started showroom shopping in Oct'09. Showrooms were like ghost towns and I had all the attention from the agent from Oct 09 - Jan 09. Once Alexis and Caspian (both perceived as value for money) were launched with success, everyone became ready to pounce on "value for money" deals.

    - I also perceive that the banks were more willing to help those tide over the mortagage loans. Examples are interest paying, mortgage holidays, etc. No point repossess and sell in a bad market (lose lose situation). I guess that helped to ease the panic as well.

    - Developers gave discounts and the price difference from suburban condos and the strong HDB price narrowed. The price difference is "affordable" for most HDB upgraders. Everyone started to pack the showroom in droves whenever there was a discount.


    - Some developers realised this and increased the price of the suburban condos sometime in April 09. Suddenly, price between OCR and RCR narrowed. People buy RCR as it is more "worth it". Again, the price of RCR went up and the story continued for CCR in May 09.

    - Some developers who have closed their showrooms during the crisis are relauching at pre-crisis levels (obnoxiously rich to do this). Some of them cut up the 4 bedrooms and 3 bedrooms into 1 bedrooms and 2 bedrooms (emulating the success of Alexis concept of small is beautiful). Really amazing.

    When prices go up, the masses learnt about it from the mainstream media and everyone is going in now to earn a bit of the pie. Fear of losing out.

    Today, official statement has come out on the papers that a "bubble" might be coming up. Hmm...Does that mean another new ruling coming out soon?

    Unfortunately, cycles are always repeated and greed never fails to blind us. Sometimes, I am blinded as well .

  3. #123
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    Twin regency. It's at Tiong Bahru.


    Quote Originally Posted by august
    sorry what is TR ah???

  4. #124
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    However, paying $1000psf and above for OCR, i rather pay $1000psf and above for RCR.


    Quote Originally Posted by gohsoonk
    You are correct. I feel that the crux of the pricing support is provided by the HDB flats.

    When the dotcom bubble burst, There were many unoccupied flats in newer estates. Big time. Contractors went bust and HDB flats were delayed.

    The recent new HDB schemes (BTO) was excellent to mitigate the bleeding in economic cycles but it provided a strong support as a result.

    It is really interesting to experience the cycle this time round.

    - I started showroom shopping in Oct'09. Showrooms were like ghost towns and I had all the attention from the agent from Oct 09 - Jan 09. Once Alexis and Caspian (both perceived as value for money) were launched with success, everyone became ready to pounce on "value for money" deals.

    - I also perceive that the banks were more willing to help those tide over the mortagage loans. Examples are interest paying, mortgage holidays, etc. No point repossess and sell in a bad market (lose lose situation). I guess that helped to ease the panic as well.

    - Developers gave discounts and the price difference from suburban condos and the strong HDB price narrowed. The price difference is "affordable" for most HDB upgraders. Everyone started to pack the showroom in droves whenever there was a discount.


    - Some developers realised this and increased the price of the suburban condos sometime in April 09. Suddenly, price between OCR and RCR narrowed. People buy RCR as it is more "worth it". Again, the price of RCR went up and the story continued for CCR in May 09.

    - Some developers who have closed their showrooms during the crisis are relauching at pre-crisis levels (obnoxiously rich to do this). Some of them cut up the 4 bedrooms and 3 bedrooms into 1 bedrooms and 2 bedrooms (emulating the success of Alexis concept of small is beautiful). Really amazing.

    When prices go up, the masses learnt about it from the mainstream media and everyone is going in now to earn a bit of the pie. Fear of losing out.

    Today, official statement has come out on the papers that a "bubble" might be coming up. Hmm...Does that mean another new ruling coming out soon?

    Unfortunately, cycles are always repeated and greed never fails to blind us. Sometimes, I am blinded as well .

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by wkang1970
    However, paying $1000psf and above for OCR, i rather pay $1000psf and above for RCR.
    Anyone know if Centro in AMK has been launched. How many has bought and at what $psf?

  6. #126
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    just saw the advert on tv for centro, i guess it has been launched. i asked the same question earlier today as i thought the preview was yesterday but no one seems to know. perhaps everyone has been put off by the touted 1150psf.



    Quote Originally Posted by andy
    Anyone know if Centro in AMK has been launched. How many has bought and at what $psf?

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    "Capsian" effect started the ball rolling, hopefully it is not the "Centro" effect that spoil the show

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    Meadow@P already more than 1,000 psf. Quoted from h88.com.sg:

    While we were there, a 12th floor 3BR on the point block was going for S$1.275m, so it's $1,066 psf for the 1,195 sqft apartment. A 9th floor, 635sqft 1+1 BR was going for S$695k, which works out to $1,094psf. It's likely that the units in the point block were going for a higher price.

    At the time of writing about 250 units were all sold, with most of the high floor 1+1BRs were gone.

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    this was already the price when it was launched for this special 14 storey tower (but its refurbished not rebuilt) and the rest of the blocks are 5 storey only.


    Quote Originally Posted by jitkiat
    Meadow@P already more than 1,000 psf. Quoted from h88.com.sg:

    While we were there, a 12th floor 3BR on the point block was going for S$1.275m, so it's $1,066 psf for the 1,195 sqft apartment. A 9th floor, 635sqft 1+1 BR was going for S$695k, which works out to $1,094psf. It's likely that the units in the point block were going for a higher price.

    At the time of writing about 250 units were all sold, with most of the high floor 1+1BRs were gone.

  10. #130
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    "the 329-unit Centro Residences in Ang Mo Kio apparently attracted more than 80 buyers, even though it is priced at $1,150 psf and above – levels more suitable for prime or city-fringe projects."

    that's all that was mentioned in today's straits times.


    Quote Originally Posted by andy
    Anyone know if Centro in AMK has been launched. How many has bought and at what $psf?

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter
    "the 329-unit Centro Residences in Ang Mo Kio apparently attracted more than 80 buyers, even though it is priced at $1,150 psf and above – levels more suitable for prime or city-fringe projects."

    that's all that was mentioned in today's straits times.
    Sure cannot sell out lah... HDB upgraders & speculators are not fools. The psf pricing is almost double DBR @ Simei @ 650psf. HDB in Ang Mo Kio is only 20% more expensive than that of Simei. But I am shocked that people are buying Meadow@P at 1000psf.
    Last edited by jitkiat; 31-07-09 at 10:08.

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    well, the take up for that "special" tower for M@P is not as good as the rest which are priced at 8xx to 9xx. From the news, still got 80 suckers buy? actually the absolute $ quantum is not that high because the unit sizes are so small. definitely not comfortable size.

    Quote Originally Posted by jitkiat
    Sure cannot sell one lah... HDB upgraders & speculators are not fools. The psf pricing is almost double DBR @ Simei @ 650psf. HDB in Ang Mo Kio is only 20% more expensive than that of Simei. But I am shocked that people are buying Meadow@P at 1000psf.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter
    well, the take up for that "special" tower for M@P is not as good as the rest which are priced at 8xx to 9xx. From the news, still got 80 suckers buy? actually the absolute $ quantum is not that high because the unit sizes are so small. definitely not comfortable size.
    News that 80 units @ Centro sold.

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    Ah Beng and Ah Seng was having their coffee break one morning.

    Seng: Beng, I heard you buy a new condo. So rich ah..
    Beng: How you know? condo only mah. I only told ah lian and ah hua.
    Seng: Ai ya, property so hot now. I also bought too. I just a HDB 5 room in AMK near MRT. You?
    Beng: Wow. So close to me? I bought Centro. How much you bought yours? I bought a 3 room @ about 1.4m ONLY. 11xxpsf only, after discount some more.
    Seng: 1.4m for a 3 room? So expensive! I bought mine about 580K. You stupid is it? So expensive yet you buy? No brain or what? why don't buy DBR? So much cheaper.
    Beng: You call me stupid? You also stupid! Pay 580K for a HDB, why dun you buy punggol, so much cheaper too!
    Seng: Beng, you taking a risk la, buy so high you monthly installment so much how to tong? My HDB difference, I'm using CPF mah, as long as I have my job will be enough to pay e installment for next 30 years.
    Beng: dun worry lah, I under IAS, only paid 20% mah. the rest I worry 3 years later when TOP. 3 years time if enconomy improve sure pay raise, btw now market so hot, what if I can sell with a good profit before TOP. huat tak already.
    Seng: What talking you? 11xxpsf how much you can sell? 1300psf? How long you need to wait? What if market turns bad? We still in recession you know.
    Beng: You sour grapes lah, your HDB can only sell after 2 years, mine is condo lei, tomorrow if got people want to buy I can sell mine already.
    Seng: I know condo can sell anytime, but our location same same mah. We have everything in common except i know your's is condo. Maybe plus a pool, gym n tennis court. I dun play tennis. So why your condo must be in higher demand, there are so many condo area AMK at much cheaper price.
    Beng: Hey, Dun forget I have sky terrace on #33 hor. I can hold my parties at the sky terrace you can only have yours at the void. Provided no one book before you for wedding funtion hor. Plus Centros is by FEO lei, then what if granduer 8 get enbloc, then launch it as Rentro? They got to launch at least 1600psf loh.
    Seng: Granduer 8 how many years only, how to enbloc? You die lah, how much up side you can have?
    Beng: Dun worry lah. today newspaper said already,
    ''No property bubble forming, say developers''

    sorry folks, my 2 cents. Got to go now. dun flame me hor An agent just sms me. Optima launch last night already. Sold about 150 units. Better act fast. LOL

  15. #135
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    the 3 bedroom units are small sized, 1.1 or 1.2m "nia"...at 1150psf


    Quote Originally Posted by Property_Owner
    Ah Beng and Ah Seng was having their coffee break one morning.

    Seng: Beng, I heard you buy a new condo. So rich ah..
    Beng: How you know? condo only mah. I only told ah lian and ah hua.
    Seng: Ai ya, property so hot now. I also bought too. I just a HDB 5 room in AMK near MRT. You?
    Beng: Wow. So close to me? I bought Centro. How much you bought yours? I bought a 3 room @ about 1.4m ONLY. 11xxpsf only, after discount some more.
    Seng: 1.4m for a 3 room? So expensive! I bought mine about 580K. You stupid is it? So expensive yet you buy? No brain or what? why don't buy DBR? So much cheaper.
    Beng: You call me stupid? You also stupid! Pay 580K for a HDB, why dun you buy punggol, so much cheaper too!
    Seng: Beng, you taking a risk la, buy so high you monthly installment so much how to tong? My HDB difference, I'm using CPF mah, as long as I have my job will be enough to pay e installment for next 30 years.
    Beng: dun worry lah, I under IAS, only paid 20% mah. the rest I worry 3 years later when TOP. 3 years time if enconomy improve sure pay raise, btw now market so hot, what if I can sell with a good profit before TOP. huat tak already.
    Seng: What talking you? 11xxpsf how much you can sell? 1300psf? How long you need to wait? What if market turns bad? We still in recession you know.
    Beng: You sour grapes lah, your HDB can only sell after 2 years, mine is condo lei, tomorrow if got people want to buy I can sell mine already.
    Seng: I know condo can sell anytime, but our location same same mah. We have everything in common except i know your's is condo. Maybe plus a pool, gym n tennis court. I dun play tennis. So why your condo must be in higher demand, there are so many condo area AMK at much cheaper price.
    Beng: Hey, Dun forget I have sky terrace on #33 hor. I can hold my parties at the sky terrace you can only have yours at the void. Provided no one book before you for wedding funtion hor. Plus Centros is by FEO lei, then what if granduer 8 get enbloc, then launch it as Rentro? They got to launch at least 1600psf loh.
    Seng: Granduer 8 how many years only, how to enbloc? You die lah, how much up side you can have?
    Beng: Dun worry lah. today newspaper said already,
    ''No property bubble forming, say developers''

    sorry folks, my 2 cents. Got to go now. dun flame me hor An agent just sms me. Optima launch last night already. Sold about 150 units. Better act fast. LOL

  16. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Property_Owner
    Ah Beng and Ah Seng was having their coffee break one morning.

    Seng: Beng, I heard you buy a new condo. So rich ah..
    Beng: How you know? condo only mah. I only told ah lian and ah hua.
    Seng: Ai ya, property so hot now. I also bought too. I just a HDB 5 room in AMK near MRT. You?
    Beng: Wow. So close to me? I bought Centro. How much you bought yours? I bought a 3 room @ about 1.4m ONLY. 11xxpsf only, after discount some more.
    Seng: 1.4m for a 3 room? So expensive! I bought mine about 580K. You stupid is it? So expensive yet you buy? No brain or what? why don't buy DBR? So much cheaper.
    Beng: You call me stupid? You also stupid! Pay 580K for a HDB, why dun you buy punggol, so much cheaper too!
    Seng: Beng, you taking a risk la, buy so high you monthly installment so much how to tong? My HDB difference, I'm using CPF mah, as long as I have my job will be enough to pay e installment for next 30 years.
    Beng: dun worry lah, I under IAS, only paid 20% mah. the rest I worry 3 years later when TOP. 3 years time if enconomy improve sure pay raise, btw now market so hot, what if I can sell with a good profit before TOP. huat tak already.
    Seng: What talking you? 11xxpsf how much you can sell? 1300psf? How long you need to wait? What if market turns bad? We still in recession you know.
    Beng: You sour grapes lah, your HDB can only sell after 2 years, mine is condo lei, tomorrow if got people want to buy I can sell mine already.
    Seng: I know condo can sell anytime, but our location same same mah. We have everything in common except i know your's is condo. Maybe plus a pool, gym n tennis court. I dun play tennis. So why your condo must be in higher demand, there are so many condo area AMK at much cheaper price.
    Beng: Hey, Dun forget I have sky terrace on #33 hor. I can hold my parties at the sky terrace you can only have yours at the void. Provided no one book before you for wedding funtion hor. Plus Centros is by FEO lei, then what if granduer 8 get enbloc, then launch it as Rentro? They got to launch at least 1600psf loh.
    Seng: Granduer 8 how many years only, how to enbloc? You die lah, how much up side you can have?
    Beng: Dun worry lah. today newspaper said already,
    ''No property bubble forming, say developers''

    sorry folks, my 2 cents. Got to go now. dun flame me hor An agent just sms me. Optima launch last night already. Sold about 150 units. Better act fast. LOL


    come to think of it ...

    other than MRT noise .. if HDB void desk got wedding or funeral .. Centro can also "celebrate" at the same time ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter
    the 3 bedroom units are small sized, 1.1 or 1.2m "nia"...at 1150psf
    example only. Optima or Centro I dun bother.

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    that's true, anyway, they are playing on "low" absolute quantum,small size and high psf...1.4m for Meadows, around 1.1m for Optima and Centro. in any case, above 1m for 3 bedrooms above these areas are really big commitments. Soon many people will have a >1m asset financed with 800k of debt or more. Good luck to buyers.


    Quote Originally Posted by Property_Owner
    example only. Optima or Centro I dun bother.

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    So at some point when St Regis's selling price is on par with The Sail, it is justified?


    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel_Yee
    And they don't see interior. They let the market guage the psf, take an average and offer you max. 15% extra. Probably flooring and facing play a small part but won't make a big difference. Anyway, location is the main factor for a condo price. Design is second so location is still king.


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    It's up to the buyers to judge. After all, it's their money. There is no such thing call justified or not. If want to justify, then property prices should be going down now since it is recession.

    I have said people who buy Centro are dumb but if they make $50k or 100k in 2 weeks, do you think they are? Do you think they give a damn?

    People say Metropolitan only worth 900psf. But those metro owners who sell 1200psf, you think they care?

    If people say Sail should be lower than St regis, but selling way above St regis, you think the sail sellers give a shit?

    So ultimately, it is the majority of the market that drive it. The minority like me can just talk and talk and say Centro not worth it, no rental yield etc......... But it is the majority of the market who determine and say "It is worth it". If not, why do you think Centro got takers at 1.2k psf and Sail is selling on par with Orchard now? Bay view even sell 50% higher than Orchard? Both got MRT but Sail is like a slum now.



    Quote Originally Posted by Regulators
    So at some point when St Regis's selling price is on par with The Sail, it is justified?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jitkiat
    Sure cannot sell out lah... HDB upgraders & speculators are not fools. The psf pricing is almost double DBR @ Simei @ 650psf. HDB in Ang Mo Kio is only 20% more expensive than that of Simei. But I am shocked that people are buying Meadow@P at 1000psf.
    They are many type of people in this world, some are smart and some are stupid. So please don't be shocked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Honesty
    They are many type of people in this world, some are smart and some are stupid. So please don't be shocked.

    precisely

    we need stupid people ... otherwise we cant be smart

    we need people to buy high ... otherwise we cant unload

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    Just heard the Chinese news 1 "expert" claimed that real estate bubble has started to form cos Centro launched at prices higher than any other projects that were sold in AMK during the good times in 2007.

    This naive guy forgot that this piece of land was bought during the good times at high px and bearing in mind the developer doesn't really have a history of making provisions, if not launch at this px then what px to even break even? Not forgetting u can't "keep" LH99 land for long...

    How can one make a cause & effect conclusion just based on this??

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    Quote Originally Posted by jc
    Just heard the Chinese news 1 "expert" claimed that real estate bubble has started to form cos Centro launched at prices higher than any other projects that were sold in AMK during the good times in 2007.

    This naive guy forgot that this piece of land was bought during the good times at high px and bearing in mind the developer doesn't really have a history of making provisions, if not launch at this px then what px to even break even? Not forgetting u can't "keep" LH99 land for long...

    How can one make a cause & effect conclusion just based on this??
    then again

    just becos they were stupid enuff to buy the land at peak .. its a bad investment decision .. what justification do they have to sell higher ??

    so its always a win win situation for developer ?? then everyone would want to be a develoeper ..it doesnt matter how much you pay for the land .. you are RIGHT to sell even higher .. no such thing as bad investment in developer's world ??

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    Quote Originally Posted by proud owner
    then again

    just becos they were stupid enuff to buy the land at peak .. its a bad investment decision .. what justification do they have to sell higher ??

    so its always a win win situation for developer ?? then everyone would want to be a develoeper ..it doesnt matter how much you pay for the land .. you are RIGHT to sell even higher .. no such thing as bad investment in developer's world ??
    Very well said, there's always profit or loss in any investment.

    But luckily.... there are suckers to support them...HENG AH!!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Honesty
    Very well said, there's always profit or loss in any investment.

    But luckily.... there are suckers to support them...HENG AH!!!!!
    i said many times developers have close link with govt

    once all finish launching and selling .. then the subsale war starts .. pushing it higehr ... THEN govt will come in

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    Quote Originally Posted by proud owner
    then again

    just becos they were stupid enuff to buy the land at peak .. its a bad investment decision .. what justification do they have to sell higher ??

    so its always a win win situation for developer ?? then everyone would want to be a develoeper ..it doesnt matter how much you pay for the land .. you are RIGHT to sell even higher .. no such thing as bad investment in developer's world ??
    Haha... I am not disputing the fact developer bought high... They can write down value like Capland did for Char Yong Gdns or they can launch at high px. But even if there are takers, that does not equate bubble.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jc
    Haha... I am not disputing the fact developer bought high... They can write down value like Capland did for Char Yong Gdns or they can launch at high px. But even if there are takers, that does not equate bubble.

    i m not saying anything about bubble


    but a mere fact that its the mentality of the average sporeans that help make the Rich richer ..

    thank you very much ..

    i am torn between making money , and helping tom dick and harry make good decisions ..

    $ vs conscience

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    hi daniel, it is not about having buyers to judge and decide the prices, coz that would be akin to property market manipulation. hypothetically, does it mean that if a rich Arab comes along and agrees to spend $2k psf buying up an few projects in jurong just because he likes jurong, jurong properties would be worth that much in future? Likewise if a goondu is going to pay $3kpsf for the Sail, does that put the sail, st regis and orchard scotts to be on par? i say not. Some condos like Seasons Park, Cairnhill Crest, Ardmore, St Regis, Orchard Scotts and many more are built for class and luxury living which is the reason why people pay that kinda price to live with people of the same strata and class at the very first instance. The Sail is a different animal. If it is being personified, it would be like a rags to riches story. At launch you get all kinds of hdb upgraders buying it and even aunties and uncles with hdb addresses get to queue up to buy the sail at cheap cheap prices. today, with that same mass market quality, it is being sold like a "luxury condo" just becoz it is near to the IR.
    I think valuators in banks have become irrational and bonkers when it comes to valuations coz they cannot differentiate between luxury and mass market condos....

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel_Yee
    It's up to the buyers to judge. After all, it's their money. There is no such thing call justified or not. If want to justify, then property prices should be going down now since it is recession.

    I have said people who buy Centro are dumb but if they make $50k or 100k in 2 weeks, do you think they are? Do you think they give a damn?

    People say Metropolitan only worth 900psf. But those metro owners who sell 1200psf, you think they care?

    If people say Sail should be lower than St regis, but selling way above St regis, you think the sail sellers give a shit?

    So ultimately, it is the majority of the market that drive it. The minority like me can just talk and talk and say Centro not worth it, no rental yield etc......... But it is the majority of the market who determine and say "It is worth it". If not, why do you think Centro got takers at 1.2k psf and Sail is selling on par with Orchard now? Bay view even sell 50% higher than Orchard? Both got MRT but Sail is like a slum now.

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    Clearly the Sail was marketed for its location and view, not really class or luxury. Otherwise, Modi would not have paid 15mil for the penthouse.
    I do not think he is a goondu paying $2650psft. He bought it for a reason, to entertain clients.

    If you compare this to the record price of $5,600 psf for a 53rd-storey private apartment in The Orchard Residences at $28.27 million which is 99-year leasehold unit, its hard to argue who is the bigger goondu?

    Of course you can say that Orchard is a different league compared to Marina Bay but with the future developments, its not that far off...

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