EUR/GBP seems more attractive an investment than pty during this time - Any views?

[Regulators]

Hey guys,

I feel that with the current situation in Europe, it is a good time to get into European currencies, better compared to property imo. Euro has not taken such a beating in years and pound is at an all time low. I feel like european currencies now are at the equivalent of the 1400 mark that our sti once reached. What is ur take on this?

[bargain hunter]

but what if it becomes their version of the asian currency crisis? sorry, i have never dabbled in currencies before so not in a position to comment.

also, by starting this thread, think u'd better get ready for jlrx's preaching on paper currency being value losing instruments.

Hey guys,

I feel that with the current situation in Europe, it is a good time to get into European currencies, better compared to property imo. Euro has not taken such a beating in years and pound is at an all time low. I feel like european currencies now are at the equivalent of the 1400 mark that our sti once reached. What is ur take on this?

[Regulators]

currency speculation is very different from keeping money in the bank. i usually play currency short to mid term.

[devilplate]

FX is the fastest way to become a millionaire...but also the fastest way to become a bankruptcy

To me it is very short term and most fx traders do intraday trading.

[bargain hunter]

yes, that should be the way to make money, short term/intraday. however, if that's the case, then we can't compare it with property investment as that is (suppose to be) VERY long term. Regulators can quickly make money in forex and buy a property after that.

[Regulators]

most intraday traders enter in the morning and offload at mid day. the trend is usually quite consistent if you study the intraday charts.

[Regulators]

the greatest risk is to do margin trading and go in by the tens of millions when u only have a small fraction of that to gamble. i know of traders who made a lot and also become almost bankrupt becoz of that. i always believe the best is to invest within ur means. never bet on something you cant afford to pay up the losses

[teddybear]

Forex trading is like throwing a coin and seeing how accurate you can predict the head or tail turning out. Try for yourselves how many times you can predict the coin flipping outcome in 100 flips and you will know your chance of making money through short-term forex trading.
(The same is true for gambling in Casino, but your odd is even worse).

the greatest risk is to do margin trading and go in by the tens of millions when u only have a small fraction of that to gamble. i know of traders who made a lot and also become almost bankrupt becoz of that. i always believe the best is to invest within ur means. never bet on something you cant afford to pay up the losses

[teddybear]

Let me make a prediction for next 2 years (please take with a pitch of salt):
- European currencies depreciate against US$ and SG$.
- US economy recovers, gaining advantage and benefiting from Europe woes as money flows back into US and US$.
- Singapore properties stay strong and in uptrend as more money inflows as money fleet away from Europe due to their woes, benefiting SG$ and SG properties as well. (mind you, Europe make up almost 33% of world's wealth and just a 1% outflow into SG is already like ).

Hey guys,

I feel that with the current situation in Europe, it is a good time to get into European currencies, better compared to property imo. Euro has not taken such a beating in years and pound is at an all time low. I feel like european currencies now are at the equivalent of the 1400 mark that our sti once reached. What is ur take on this?

[mogyi]

FX is the fastest way to become a millionaire...but also the fastest way to become a bankruptcy

To me it is very short term and most fx traders do intraday trading.

yup, FX is probably the most volatile thing around, if remember correctly, recently a local tycoon oso kana burn hor...

[amk]

What is ur take on this?

it's a gamble.

u have analyst now saying EUR going towards 1.1. the same bunch of guys said the fair value "should be 1.6" just a few months ago.

fx to me is not an investment. If I had the time and energy I will do day trading on this and see if I bet correctly.

[sealover]

I think AUD is safer bet than EUR/GRP. Australia has no debt problem as China and India are paying B$ buying up their resources.

At this moment, FX and stocks are better bet than property.

[zimmer]

But AUD is not at a 4-year low unlike the Euro.

[amk]

I think AUD is safer bet than EUR/GRP. Australia has no debt problem as China and India are paying B$ buying up their resources.

by extension of the above argument, mining/resources stocks should be doing well isn't it ? But it didn't. Rio Tinto dropped like 25%.

nowadays I feel it's entirely sentiment driven

[proud owner]

by extension of the above argument, mining/resources stocks should be doing well isn't it ? But it didn't. Rio Tinto dropped like 25%.

nowadays I feel it's entirely sentiment driven

all these movements are reacting to 'stretched' positioinings

when Greek news first hit the mkt ..mkt started to sell EUR from 1.35 ( or higher) .. to 1.2175 ish

the open interest ( shorts in this case) is at all time high ..

similarly cad ..selling to 1.0100 etc etc

fear now is : what is theres a concerted intervention ?

with every tom dick and harry also short EUR .. when the big boys start to buy back .. all followed (herd instinct again )

now EUR 1.2400 .. some got killed being short (depending on holding power)


the same can be said about property ..

if every tom dick and harry is long more than 1 property .. should shxit hits the fence ( i am not saying it would ..but if something happens ..say Orchard MRT really kana bombed) .. those with weaker holding power will be scrambling to sell .. and when it starts .. more will follow ..

same herd instinct again .. be it buying or selling ..

so .. like many have advised here .. buy only what you can afford to service COMFORTABLY

[lancelot]

It doesn't have to be as drastic as a bomb going off in Orchard MRT station to take the sail out of the property wind. I have been through several cycles of the property boom and bust. In each of the busts the catalyst was not dramatic. When prices are up or at record high, it is very easy to extrapolate into the future and see only blue skies. No country, no matter how desirable it is to live in, is immune to a downturn. Especially an economy like Singapore that is closely interconnected to the rest of the world. A receding tide will lower all boats.

[proud owner]

It doesn't have to be as drastic as a bomb going off in Orchard MRT station to take the sail out of the property wind. I have been through several cycles of the property boom and bust. In each of the busts the catalyst was not dramatic. When prices are up or at record high, it is very easy to extrapolate into the future and see only blue skies. No country, no matter how desirable it is to live in, is immune to a downturn. Especially an economy like Singapore that is closely interconnected to the rest of the world. A receding tide will lower all boats.

well said

if orchard kana bombed ... our proertism religious leader sure jump in and buy the rumbles .. and hold for 5-10 yrs ..

[devilplate]

well said

if orchard kana bombed ... our proertism religious leader sure jump in and buy the rumbles .. and hold for 5-10 yrs ..

u r wrong!!

he will grab free fall durians but hold till die....nvr sell ur pptyyyy

[proud owner]

u r wrong!!

he will grab free fall durians but hold till die....nvr sell ur pptyyyy

i wont buy that plot where ION is actually

i feel Leonie hill side ..if also affected is a better choice ..hehehe

anyway why Devilplate ?

have you ever tried this delicacy called Deviled Egg ? damn nice

[devilplate]

i wont buy that plot where ION is actually

i feel Leonie hill side ..if also affected is a better choice ..hehehe

anyway why Devilplate ?

have you ever tried this delicacy called Deviled Egg ? damn nice

got such egg??? in USA?

anywhr is goodie as long as it drop more den 30%

i only worried market stays flattish for yrs ...1999 to 2005....6 yrs of flat market...no free monies...

[jlrx]

well said

if orchard kana bombed ... our proertism religious leader sure jump in and buy the rumbles .. and hold for 5-10 yrs ..

u r wrong!!

he will grab free fall durians but hold till die....nvr sell ur pptyyyy

Are you talking about me?

Actually what you say is true.

Despite being almost 100% invested in properties, I still have lots of fire power left because I have borrowed only approximately 25% of what my banker said I can borrow.

However, what is holding me back are Osama and friends. I have highlighted my concern before about New York being a terrorist target, and now it is reported that Singapore is also being targeted as well.

If I fire my salvo now and use up my full loan quota before the terrorists fire theirs, I'll be dead.

On the other hand, if I don't use up my full loan quota now, that gives me the option of buying more properties in case the terrorists strike, but then I'm not maximising my full investment potential.

It's a Catch-22 situation.

[proud owner]

Are you talking about me?

Actually what you say is true.

Despite being almost 100% invested in properties, I still have lots of fire power left because I have borrowed only approximately 25% of what my banker said I can borrow.

However, what is holding me back are Osama and friends. I have highlighted my concern before about New York being a terrorist target, and now it is reported that Singapore is also being targeted as well.

If I fire my salvo now and use up my full loan quota before the terrorists fire theirs, I'll be dead.

On the other hand, if I don't use up my full loan quota now, that gives me the option of buying more properties in case the terrorists strike, but then I'm not maximising my full investment potential.

It's a Catch-22 situation.

well too bad for you .. they were caught before they could carry it out (what am i saying?)

then again ... they can still escape and never be found ...

lets pray they never succeed ... for an island this small .. the consequences can be huge and lasting

[devilplate]

Are you talking about me?

Actually what you say is true.

Despite being almost 100% invested in properties, I still have lots of fire power left because I have borrowed only approximately 25% of what my banker said I can borrow.

got quota one ar..i din noe...i tot unlimited as long as u only borrowed 60% or lesser. jobless, no payslip..no IRAS..nvm...as long take 60% or less, bank loan sure approved..so can i say unlimited quota?

most impt is ammo..which is HOT CASH

[jlrx]

got quota one ar..i din noe...i tot unlimited as long as u only borrowed 60% or lesser. jobless, no payslip..no IRAS..nvm...as long take 60% or less, bank loan sure approved..so can i say unlimited quota?

most impt is ammo..which is HOT CASH

Is that what your banker said?

Maybe my banker is more conservative. He said the total monthly mortgage servicing of all property and car loans cannot exceed 60% of monthly household income.

Even though I told him my properties are self-financing as in the rentals more than covered the installments.

[devilplate]

Is that what your banker said?

Maybe my banker is more conservative. He said the total monthly mortgage servicing of all property and car loans cannot exceed 60% of monthly household income.

Even though I told him my properties are self-financing as in the rentals more than covered the installments.

it is not wat banker say...is wat all banks told me.

i hf been taking 60% or less loan and do not hf to submit any supporting documents. only nid to provide some bank statements to show tat u can pay 1 yr of installment...

y wud any bank stop lending any individual when he/she only borrow 60% or less of the valuation. if the person defaults, the bank just force sell...and very unlikely the ppty price is gona drop more den 40%...so the bank is more or less covered.

when one only take 80%loan...they got more worries

[proud owner]

it is not wat banker say...is wat all banks told me.

i hf been taking 60% or less loan and do not hf to submit any supporting documents. only nid to provide some bank statements to show tat u can pay 1 yr of installment...

y wud any bank stop lending any individual when he/she only borrow 60% or less of the valuation. if the person defaults, the bank just force sell...and very unlikely the ppty price is gona drop more den 40%...so the bank is more or less covered.

when one only take 80%loan...they got more worries

also when father + 2 son each buy a unit at geylang ..then they turn you down

bank also become social guidance ?

[jlrx]

it is not wat banker say...is wat all banks told me.

i hf been taking 60% or less loan and do not hf to submit any supporting documents. only nid to provide some bank statements to show tat u can pay 1 yr of installment...

y wud any bank stop lending any individual when he/she only borrow 60% or less of the valuation. if the person defaults, the bank just force sell...and very unlikely the ppty price is gona drop more den 40%...so the bank is more or less covered.

when one only take 80%loan...they got more worries

Then in that case your leverage is less.

80% loan only need 20% cash; whereas 60% loan need 40% cash.

You could have bought two properties for every one you bought, if you had taken 80% loan.

[devilplate]

Then in that case your leverage is less.

80% loan only need 20% cash; whereas 60% loan need 40% cash.

You could have bought two properties for every one you bought, if you had taken 80% loan.

but in exchange for a good night sleep...60% leverage: rental will easily cover my installment especially i spread out max 35yrs.

i leverage stocks for eg. using CFD up to 5 to 7times normally but u noe tat u can cut loss easily. however, for ppty, it is not so liquid.

having said tat, i strongly discourage ppl to fully/partial redem their mortgage loan whenever they got spare cash(unless for primary residences and u r nearing retirement age) mortgage loan is probably the cheapest loan one can get oredi.

[devilplate]

also when father + 2 son each buy a unit at geylang ..then they turn you down

bank also become social guidance ?

u mean the atrium residences case? i am not so sure leh...i did enquire abt this ppty and my banker say no problem to take loan against it.