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Thread: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

  1. #1
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    Default UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    https://www.businesstimes.com.sg/real-estate/uol-uic-tie-up-places-top-bid-for-clementi-ave-1-site

    UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site
    WED, JUL 03, 2019 - 5:56 PM
    KALPANA [email protected]@KalpanaBT
    A STATE tender for a 99-year leasehold private housing site along Clementi Avenue 1 has attracted five bids.

    Units of UOL Group and United Industrial Corporation tied up to place the top bid of S$491.3 million, which works out to S$788.31 per square foot per plot ratio (psf ppr).

    Another state tender, for an executive condominium or EC housing site along Canberra Link in the Sembawang area, has drawn eight bids.

    The highest bid, from MCC Land (Singapore), was at S$233.89 million, translating to about S$566 psf ppr.

    ECs are a public-private housing hybrid.

    Both land parcels have 99-year leasehold tenure. Tenders for both parcels closed on Wednesday.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    looking at the bid prices, the winners clearly don't expect new launch prices to fall below 1300psf nor believe there is oversupply.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    My impression of UOL tends to snap up good land deals. They buy when there is fear in the market. Imo, this price is in favor to the developer.

    Parkwest sold to SHY at around 850psf.
    Last edited by devilplate; 06-07-19 at 22:57.

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    Smile Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by devilplate View Post
    My impression of UOL tends to snap up good land deals. They buy when there is fear in the market. Imo, this price is in favor to the developer.

    Parkwest sold to SHY at around 850psf.
    wow bro, when was the last time u posted man hahaha. back after so many years MIA?

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Many old timers had gone missing. Probably retired from enbloc deals.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Possibly some have returned their ICs.

    Others have forgotten their passwords or can’t be bothered to retrieve them.
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter View Post
    looking at the bid prices, the winners clearly don't expect new launch prices to fall below 1300psf nor believe there is oversupply.
    Is the clementi avenue 1 site not bidded 70psf lower than the one at former park west by SHY?

    Developers are the ones controlling the market now. Even if there is oversupply, they can still maintain launch pricing however they like.

    The 5 sole bids speaks alot about the sentiments among developers.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    This site is subject to the more stringent building criteria implemented recently. All else being equal, a lower number of units can be built. Average size is larger, with more space set aside for common facilities.

    Car park lot provision would be less than the number of units by a greater margin.

    Not Apple to Apple comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    Is the clementi avenue 1 site not bidded 70psf lower than the one at former park west by SHY?

    Developers are the ones controlling the market now. Even if there is oversupply, they can still maintain launch pricing however they like.

    The 5 sole bids speaks alot about the sentiments among developers.
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelonguni View Post
    This site is subject to the more stringent building criteria implemented recently. All else being equal, a lower number of units can be built. Average size is larger, with more space set aside for common facilities.

    Car park lot provision would be less than the number of units by a greater margin.

    Not Apple to Apple comparison.
    Still, the clementi avenue 1 site is arguably more attractive, both location and price-wise.

    SHY needs to be creative to sell those thousand-plus units.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Not sure why you think so. Can elaborate with evidence?

    Park West side has more depth away from AYE while Clementi Ave 1 site is a strip of land wrapping AYE and Clementi Ave 2.

    Exact distance to MRT or Clementi Mall, Park West site is shorter by about 30%.

    The most famed Pri school (NHPS) in the vicinity is only maybe 100-200m away from Park West site, although Ave 1 site boasts two premier Secondary schools.

    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    Still, the clementi avenue 1 site is arguably more attractive, both location and price-wise.

    SHY needs to be creative to sell those thousand-plus units.
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelonguni View Post
    Not sure why you think so. Can elaborate with evidence?

    Park West side has more depth away from AYE while Clementi Ave 1 site is a strip of land wrapping AYE and Clementi Ave 2.

    Exact distance to MRT or Clementi Mall, Park West site is shorter by about 30%.

    The most famed Pri school (NHPS) in the vicinity is only maybe 100-200m away from Park West site, although Ave 1 site boasts two premier Secondary schools.
    In terms of distance from AYE, both are just beside AYE and the difference is minimal. UOL will probably put the tennis court on the side too.

    Distance to MRT, yes Park west is slightly nearer but I don't think that is material.

    As you said, Clementi avenue 1 is closer to premier institutions like nan hua, NUS high school, NUS, international community school, United world college, ASCI and more. Above all, it is nearer to the city, holland etc.

    What is one nan hua primary school? It is also only a few bus stops away from clementi avenue 1 which costs 50cents for students.

    Ammenities wise, you have a food court and fairprice supermarket just across the road at casa clementi.

    Price wise, clementi avenue 1 is likely to be lower.

    UOL vs SHY, which is better?

    There are many reasons that CA1 is better than jalan L.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    Is the clementi avenue 1 site not bidded 70psf lower than the one at former park west by SHY?

    Developers are the ones controlling the market now. Even if there is oversupply, they can still maintain launch pricing however they like.

    The 5 sole bids speaks alot about the sentiments among developers.
    this being UOL, 788psf prob looking for 1388psf minimum selling price? you are right that developers are the ones controlling the market but their view is that they are able to find buyers at 1300 to 1400psf it seems. this segment is probably still under or just adequately supplied.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    The sound level is quite different and every metre away counts to moderate it. A squarish site has a much greater potential to mitigate this than a longish one. That being said, AYE might be moved southward in the distant future.

    Usually parents may choose to site their residence within walking distance to premier Primary schools (where distance to school influences P1 registration balloting) but not so much for Secondary schools which is based on merit. Secondary school students are also more robust to travel to their schools, particularly a few bus stops away. Thus school-wise its one up for J. Lempeng.

    Amenities-wise you might be right as Ave 1 site has faster access to food courts, but not forgetting that just across the expressway for J Lempeng, there is also Newest and the Ayer Rajah food centre, quite walkable distance as well.

    But one crucial factor determining the final demand and pricing is the car park lots. While J. Lempeng plans should have been approved with more provision for lots, Ave 1 is likely subject to stringent lot allocation or bidding policies. That will make a whole lot of difference for owner occupiers, although it might not be so for tenants.

    I am not vested in both. Just listing my honest opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    In terms of distance from AYE, both are just beside AYE and the difference is minimal. UOL will probably put the tennis court on the side too.

    Distance to MRT, yes Park west is slightly nearer but I don't think that is material.

    As you said, Clementi avenue 1 is closer to premier institutions like nan hua, NUS high school, NUS, international community school, United world college, ASCI and more. Above all, it is nearer to the city, holland etc.

    What is one nan hua primary school? It is also only a few bus stops away from clementi avenue 1 which costs 50cents for students.

    Ammenities wise, you have a food court and fairprice supermarket just across the road at casa clementi.

    Price wise, clementi avenue 1 is likely to be lower.

    UOL vs SHY, which is better?

    There are many reasons that CA1 is better than jalan L.
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    it is also way more important to be 1km of nan hua primary than to be that near nan hua sec for e.g. due to the primary school balloting system.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter View Post
    it is also way more important to be 1km of nan hua primary than to be that near nan hua sec for e.g. due to the primary school balloting system.
    I did not know primary school is distance based to the extent of each metre...

    I think clementi avenue is within 2km of nan hua. Does the additional km make a difference?

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    I did not know primary school is distance based to the extent of each metre...

    I think clementi avenue is within 2km of nan hua. Does the additional km make a difference?
    (each meter our bro is referring to distance from AYE, please do not confuse)

    for primary school, definitely. even within 1km balloting is required for nan hua for non alumni so people are just buying a chance to ballot (i am not sure what is the success rate for the ballot as it also varies from year to year). traditionally for nan hua primary, for 1 to 2km category, there is ZERO chance to get to ballot at all.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter View Post
    (each meter our bro is referring to distance from AYE, please do not confuse)

    for primary school, definitely. even within 1km balloting is required for nan hua for non alumni so people are just buying a chance to ballot (i am not sure what is the success rate for the ballot as it also varies from year to year). traditionally for nan hua primary, for 1 to 2km category, there is ZERO chance to get to ballot at all.
    Hahaha. I know.

    You are right, 1km and below stands a higher chance of being admitted to nan hua primary. But I think the number of parents who purchase the condo for the purpose of enrolling their kid to nan hua will be much less than 10% of the available units.

    Sales volume at trilinq does not look strong. Looks like not many want their kids to enroll to Nan hua primary this year.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Seriously this Nan Hua school thingy is overplayed by agents.

    I read OCR subject to 85 sqm restriction but is there an article talking about lesser carpark lots?

    Share the link pls....tia

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by devilplate View Post
    Seriously this Nan Hua school thingy is overplayed by agents.

    I read OCR subject to 85 sqm restriction but is there an article talking about lesser carpark lots?

    Share the link pls....tia
    https://www.salary.sg/2018/best-primary-schools-2018/

    Nan Hua not exactly among the most popular primary schools.

    Indeed just a sales tactic.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by bargain hunter View Post
    this being UOL, 788psf prob looking for 1388psf minimum selling price? you are right that developers are the ones controlling the market but their view is that they are able to find buyers at 1300 to 1400psf it seems. this segment is probably still under or just adequately supplied.
    Just did a check and saw resale units hitting $16xxpsf for low to mid floor at Trilinq.....Wow

    Anyway, 9years ago i would never imagine amber park can sell for $2500psf. Huat ar!

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by devilplate View Post
    Just did a check and saw resale units hitting $16xxpsf for low to mid floor at Trilinq.....Wow

    Anyway, 9years ago i would never imagine amber park can sell for $2500psf. Huat ar!
    Huat ar! Why developers so stupid never bid for Clementi Avenue 1? SHY huat ah! UOL huat ah!

    (i would recommend all to look at (and analyse) the sales data yourself before jumping to conclusions)

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Right there at position 25 leh...???

    Less than 20% vacancy wor.

    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    https://www.salary.sg/2018/best-primary-schools-2018/

    Nan Hua not exactly among the most popular primary schools.

    Indeed just a sales tactic.
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/lta-new-parking-standards-car-park-developers-10912218

    There you go.

    Details are not yet but new buyers could examine.

    Quote Originally Posted by devilplate View Post
    Seriously this Nan Hua school thingy is overplayed by agents.

    I read OCR subject to 85 sqm restriction but is there an article talking about lesser carpark lots?

    Share the link pls....tia
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelonguni View Post
    https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/lta-new-parking-standards-car-park-developers-10912218

    There you go.

    Details are not yet but new buyers could examine.
    With the sudden spike in prices, some buyers are probably squeezed dry alr, with nothing left for a car, esp those who buy near MRT.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    I would think both may appeal to different kinds of buyers.

    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    With the sudden spike in prices, some buyers are probably squeezed dry alr, with nothing left for a car, esp those who buy near MRT.
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    The last cooling measure imposed a 5% non-remissible ABSD on land purchase.
    So UOL’s land cost should include this additional 5% to have a like for like comparison just on land cost only?
    Any guru can advise?

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    I think so. Nett nett, their costs will only increase.

    Recently there were also new requirements requiring transport plan to be made and approved. All these would add to the costs. Just not sure if only the latest was affected only or both were affected.

    Quote Originally Posted by Khng8 View Post
    The last cooling measure imposed a 5% non-remissible ABSD on land purchase.
    So UOL’s land cost should include this additional 5% to have a like for like comparison just on land cost only?
    Any guru can advise?
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Another thing which I am not sure if it affected only the newest developments or both, is the banning of sand export to Singapore (from Malaysia) from last year.

    If the developer does not have stockpiled access to it or already secured the rights, construction costs is expected to rise further as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kelonguni View Post
    I think so. Nett nett, their costs will only increase.

    Recently there were also new requirements requiring transport plan to be made and approved. All these would add to the costs. Just not sure if only the latest was affected only or both were affected.
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelonguni View Post
    Another thing which I am not sure if it affected only the newest developments or both, is the banning of sand export to Singapore (from Malaysia) from last year.

    If the developer does not have stockpiled access to it or already secured the rights, construction costs is expected to rise further as well.
    Fake news? It is sea sand for use of land reclamation, little or nothing to do with construction..

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    Default Re: UOL-UIC tie-up places top bid for Clementi Ave 1 site

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/07/08/malaysia-cuts-sand-exports-singapore-jeopardising-expansion/

    Definitely not fake news.

    It limits Singapore's land expansion so new sources will have to be found, which makes land even costlier to produce (reclaim). If land is costlier to produce, can property be cheaper?

    The sand used for reclamation is also the same sand used for construction.

    Banning cockles used to make char kway teow also affects cockles used for eating raw on a plate, or those used to make laksa, chili and garlic cockles etc. In the end, no cockle supply.



    Quote Originally Posted by annetyu View Post
    Fake news? It is sea sand for use of land reclamation, little or nothing to do with construction..
    The three laws of Kelonguni:

    Where there is kelong, there is guni.
    No kelong no guni.
    More kelong = more guni.

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